Advice: Grievance against Employer

[FanDabbyDitsy]

have you had experience lodging a grievance against employer?

I am in the process and would like any advice going…

(relates to discrimination, bullying within local authority/education setting)

What help did a union offer? was it resolved? How long did it take? Did it involve mediation/apology? Did it involve ACAS? Did you resign and go to employment tribunal?

Yes, that exact experience and although I hate to say it, my advice would be to put effort into finding another job and walking away. Others may have different experiences but my advice would be to think very carefully about what you are realistically likely to achieve versus the impact on yourself and your family.

Agree with Pixie. Even if you do win, things won't ever be the same. I'd perhaps use it as a delaying tactic to find another role. ACAS will also advise you to do this, off the record.

To answer your questions though, union a bit slow, employer concerned only with protecting itself (even though off the record admitted it all), made up counter-slurs and generally a really damaging experience. No amount of compensation (and awards are generally pretty low anyway) could ever be worth going through such trauma. I’d also recommend thinking really hard about your (realistic) end goal and working back from there.

Thanks for the replies and advice @PixiePirate @Treacletoots
I have ruled out the option of walking away without putting in the grievance and going through the process. Although would then be prepared to resign and take to tribunal. Already at the stage where there is evidence/ witness accounts/ written statements from the perpetrators etc, so have been given confidence from Union there is solid ground…still a wobbly feeling.

Thanks again @PixiePirate
sorry I didn’t catch your last post for sending my reply.
I could have almost written what you said word for word, it captures my experience so far…it’s not fair you had to go through that, have you managed to move on to other workplace/have any closure or has it had a long lasting impact? So far has left me jaded with peoples morals, conscience… I think there is incompetence/lack of confidence with unions and employers on how to resolve and or discipline for such behaviours…

Unions have criteria to follow before they will offer legal help. You should be able to find this on their web pages but it is fairly prescriptive. Similarly many house insurance policies will offer legal help - again, must meet their criteria. Statistically, most employers settle before tribunal. You need to go through ACAS first I think as you need a certificate from them that the mediation process has concluded. From a similar setting in Scotland, it was grievance, appeal, ACAS, mediation, various pre hearings and then settled before tribunal. If you can remain calm and not let the process bother you too much, it is worthwhile. Costs are seldom awarded to either side unless a frivolous case so it’s really time and effort. You can easily Google previous ET decisions to see if anyone has won a similar case to you.

Plus the time limits are very strict so watch that too.

Thanks so much for the reply @Scottishflower65 I appreciate the stages in the process and you sharing your experience. Did you remain with the employer throughout and after or did you resign before any of the stages? I will go see if can find any similar ET cases, thanks for the tip.

Sorry that you’re going through such a tough time. It’s disappointing how so many companies lack the backbone to deal with poor behaviour and instead victimise the ones who try to assert their personal boundaries and legal rights.

My experience was very damaging and had a long term impact but I managed to
move into a new role without any issues and I’m certainly wiser, have much lower expectations and am more compassionate as a consequence. I’d still turn back the clock and walk away if I had the chance though.

Please take care and prioritise your own wellbeing as you navigate the process. I hope they settle early to bring the situation to a close ASAP.

Thank you @PixiePirate that’s really kind, I’m taking much better care now things are progressing, but struggling with the slow pace.

You’ve hit the nail on the head about lack of backbone and the victimisation of those who speak out… I really appreciate your time and insight- it’s an isolating feeling to be going through, you sharing your experience is giving me lots to consider, I’m glad things have been better in a new role- but sad to think of the lasting effect it’s had, I’m so sorry you were mistreated. I must be prepared to walk away…

Thank you @FanDabbyDitsy

One thing I meant to say is to insist that you get a detailed reference as part of a settlement. As you will already know, they’re really important in education for obvious reasons.

Your union will be able to help with that but it obviously needs to explicitly state that there were no safeguarding concerns etc.

That’s something I had not thought about….that’s a really good point- thank you @PixiePirate I will make sure to insist on reference, and mention this to Union on next meeting

For info: https://www.gov.uk/employment-tribunal-decisions

Thanks to previous reply for the tip, you can access tribunals here, for those who may be in a similar position

maybe also FOI for all emails that mention you by name, by initial, or by any derivative of your name? We were able to use a few of these emails in our case.
It wasn’t me at ET, it was a relative who I was supporting.

Many thanks @Scottishflower65 thats a really good idea- union currently being met with resistance when it comes to sharing information. The employer appears to have a culture of deny/deflect/avoid, so troubling that doing the right thing and simply apologising appears to be unfathomable… thanks again for the reply, hope your relative achieved their outcome and is recovered

Yes, settled before full ET.
I would get your FOI in as soon as possible and see if anything useful. Also keep a note of all interactions as hard to remember who said what on what date but that’s the kind of evidence needed for ET. If you don’t want to deal with ACAS direct, you can ask your union rep to do so. Ensure union rep is liaising with head office from an early stage as head office make the decision on legal merits / support. Feel free to PM me if any other questions you don’t want to share on MN.

Yes I don't know what the point was. Accomplished nothing. I just went and got another job. SLT moved onto bullying someone else. When I spoke to regional
Union rep he said it was rife in my school and I should just go

An FOI request is incorrect. It's a SAR. The difference is substantial. Different laws. Send in a FOI and they can delay resounding for weeks and then tell you it's an ineligible request!

I fought bullying and disability discrimination this year. UNITE were brilliant. It took about three months. Employer whitewashed it and denied everything, and found no case BUT offered me another job with a lovely manager instead of me taking it further. I could have trashed them at Tribunal - the "notes" I submitted in evidence were actually recordings I had made but they didn't know that. But after a discussion with the union I decided to take the offer as it suited me. Not the first case against this manager. Won't be the last. But I won and she knows it.

If you are public sector you have probably a good defined benefit pension?
You need to get a pension benefit statement from your employers pension section.
This will alert your employer that you realise that your pension is a valuable asset to you.
If you leave you may never get such a pension again.
Unfortunately sometimes public bodies push out employees so that they can get someone new on a lower salary but more importantly a less valuable pension.
So many public sector employees don't focus on this benefit. Even some legal advisors don't understand it!

Yes, agree a SAR, slipped my mind as to correct terminology 😁

Thanks so much for the further replies. Have relayed the advice and asked my union about SAR/FOI. Also had not thought about impact on pension should I have to leave.

@Quveas well done on fighting your case and achieving a positive outcome for yourself, it’s great to read and know there can be some success (very much need the boost currently as it’s almost broke me down to the point of walking away and withdrawing…)

@canyouextrapol that is disappointing that it made no difference, how deflating that is widely known to be ‘rife’ in schools yet nothing gets done to rectify. Glad you got moved on to another job and hope things are much better.

@FanDabbyDitsy I just thought I would ask you how you got on as I find myself in the similar sofas yourself?

Hello, sorry to hear you are in a similar situation- I hope you get good support.
Unfortunately (fortunately?) I ended up getting a new job to get away from the situation. I had 'mediation' meetings with the other parties, and it was clear that it was geared up to invalidate my claims and make it out that I was 'imagining' this and that. Very disappointing but I am happier in my new job. Sorry it's not an outcome you will want to hear.

Union reps are hit and miss, really depends on the person.

My advice is if you feel you're being pushed out of your job or they are making it so you can't continue, get a solicitor, let them deal with it and find another job in the meantime.

My friend got a £10k payout from her £30k salary job by doing this. Solicitor cost £3k and did ALL the scary stuff. It went on for a year, had a tribunal date booked for months, the employer made the £10k offer the day before the tribunal, so she agreed to it and the tribunal was cancelled.

But tbh honest it did cause her a lot of dread about losing the solicitor fee in
case she lost. Just see it as putting on a big bet and take t as seriously as that.

Main point is - don't bother fighting it with a union rep only. Get a solicitoras or just leave for a new job or it will wear you down trying to do stuff yourself, a lot of it HRtype stuff you won't understand

Ahh sorry, I got too excited to post and didn't see this was ages ago! Oh well, hopefully it helps someone else. Glad you're OK now OP