Page 2 | my (new) boss says my body language is negative

Linguini · 26/02/2022 19:58

He sounds sexist, are you the only or one of few senior females he works with? Has he said anything similar to other females at your level or higher, can you ask them?

To me, I'm concerned he seems to think women should be smiling, batting their eyelashes and sticking their tits out.

How does your body language compare to your male colleagues? You should ask for clarification.

I'd also speak to HR because this man is making personal comments about you, about things not related to your work.

Linguini · 26/02/2022 20:00

In meetings on Zoom, body language is virtually invisible (apart from facial expressions).

Are your meetings recorded? Could you ask to compare your body language to your male colleagues so you can really understand what he's talking about?

SliceOfCakeCupOfTea · 26/02/2022 20:04

If you're lowering your eyes on zoom meetings, he's probably assuming you're on your phone below camera level or generally not paying attention.

Not criticising as I do the exact same thing. I hate staring into my camera lens.

topcat2014 · 26/02/2022 20:11

Of course it is likely your camera isn't working on your next zoom :)

topcat2014 · 26/02/2022 20:13

Maybe this guy is just a deadly boring moron.

In case you think I am just being an arse, I am 'C level'. Btw

NeverDropYourMooncup · 26/02/2022 20:44

@minny80

He mentioned eye contact, and I think I have the tendency to lower my eyes when listening so that I can focus. I don't think I slouch or cross my arms too often (also most meetings are on Zoom) and most definitely not rolling eyes or sighting in a meeting. I don't think I smile much in meetings where he is present, and I might possibly feel a bit on edge, as he is often picking up on things I say.

It might be that you aren't coming across as well as you hope on Zoom?

I can do the bright, alert thing stuff in person without fail - but I had to really pay attention to my posture and expression on Zoom because I found that I would look as bad as the other people in the meetings if i didn't.

I can't work miracles, but I made sure the camera was higher and further away so nobody got to look up my nose and I appeared to be looking into the camera rather than downwards. I also use a high backed chair so that I can't slouch and the angle is slightly to the side for when I'm making notes, so I don't look like I'm playing games on my phone or checking my emails.

And yes, I do make a point of smiling and nodding to suggest that I have actually paid attention.

The other thing I do is pay attention to what I'm wearing so that it comes across well on camera - sort of 'cleaner lines' but not too casual.

If you don't come across perfectly on Zoom and are then avoiding looking at him during in person meetings, perhaps that's why he's focusing on it?

Or he's just a dick. But he was very specific about his complaint, which could suggest he has at least some point there.

WonderfulYou · 26/02/2022 20:50

I'd be requesting specific examples and feedback on what he thought I needed to improve.

I agree.
There’s no point him saying that and not giving examples.

However the lowering the eye contact does seem pretty negative. And he may have a point.
Why are you not looking at the screen?

The only time I lower my eyes is to write notes but you can clearly see I’m writing and lots of my colleagues do it.
If you need to write notes maybe have the camera not as zoomed in so they can see you’re writing and not sat on your phone.

WonderfulYou · 26/02/2022 20:52

Not criticising as I do the exact same thing. I hate staring into my camera lens.

I don’t look at the lens, I look at the person on the screen.
I wonder if he doesn’t realise that to look forward you need to be looking up, so does it just look like you are looking down when actually you’re looking at his face?

Regularsizedrudy · 26/02/2022 21:02

I would email him asking for examples and copy HR in. Sounds like he’s just annoyed youre not a smiley woman falling over herself to make him feel at ease. Twat.

bellac11 · 26/02/2022 21:18

@WonderfulYou

Not criticising as I do the exact same thing. I hate staring into my camera lens.

I don’t look at the lens, I look at the person on the screen.
I wonder if he doesn’t realise that to look forward you need to be looking up, so does it just look like you are looking down when actually you’re looking at his face?

I look at the person on the screen and my own picture shows me looking at the person on the screen. You dont have to look into the lens to look like you are giving eye contact to someone

CourtRand · 26/02/2022 21:19

@marqueses

Also wondering what c level means

I don't think body language is a protected characteristic so I don't think he comments are discrimination. Could he have a point, do you have a co-worker you could ask?

C team or C level means CEO, CFO, CFF or the like

HundredMilesAnHour · 26/02/2022 21:47

I don’t look at the lens, I look at the person on the screen.

Even pre-Covid much of my work was done via video-conference as we have global teams. Obviously Covid was a continuation of even more camera time. Those of us in more senior roles were trained (by an actor from Game of Thrones actually) that you need to LOOK AT THE LENS. Especially when you're talking or want to demonstrate that you're actively listening. It does make a difference. Tone of voice is really important too, as is lighting. But at least start off by looking at the lens. It's an easy win.

bellac11 · 26/02/2022 21:52

@HundredMilesAnHour

I don’t look at the lens, I look at the person on the screen.

Even pre-Covid much of my work was done via video-conference as we have global teams. Obviously Covid was a continuation of even more camera time. Those of us in more senior roles were trained (by an actor from Game of Thrones actually) that you need to LOOK AT THE LENS. Especially when you're talking or want to demonstrate that you're actively listening. It does make a difference. Tone of voice is really important too, as is lighting. But at least start off by looking at the lens. It's an easy win.

So why does it look as if Im giving myself eye contact when Im looking at myself on the screen? (not the lens)?

NeverDropYourMooncup · 26/02/2022 22:07

So why does it look as if Im giving myself eye contact when Im looking at myself on the screen? (not the lens)?

Perhaps your laptop camera is at eye level?

Mine's boosted up onto some mini table thing DP picked up from the charity shop - takes it to the perfect height on the kitchen table, so I'm looking straight on rather than looking down.

R0tational · 26/02/2022 22:08

Commenting on race was a bit off.
His approach sounds unhelpful.
Good luck sorting.

wingscrow · 26/02/2022 22:37

This is dreadful management...

I am puzzled that so many people on this thread are going along with the idea that it is appropriate for a man to criticise the 'body language' of the only woman in the room/his team and that the OP needs to do something about it...She is not even in a customer-facing role so how exactly is that relevant?

This looks to me like he is a bully and a misogynist on a power-trip, not a manager giving out constructive feedback.

You need to have a chat with HR and/ your union (if there is one in her workplace), OP.

Any decent manager would focus purely on actual work performance and give specific examples of where you were failing to meet their expectations and then would discuss with you a plan to get you to improve your performance. They would also give you a chance to reply to the criticism.

I am a team manager and I would never make comments that focus on my staff's body language, any appraisal of their work is about performance and behaviour. Going on about body language is simply dodgy. Body language can be affected by someone's culture, health condition, disability, gender, anxiety (some people struggle with eye contact) and so on.

The fact that you are non-British and he is picking on you also bothers me.

Seriously, speak to HR, this guy is out of order.

Ozanj · 26/02/2022 22:49

@minny80

I have had this new boss for about 5 months now. He is c-level, I am a manager. This week out of the blue he has spent 30 minutes criticising me on a number of things, basically, in his opinion, I am not delivering to his expectations. As a manager I was really (negatively) surprised by the way he delivered his feedback, he came across as very fed up with me and didn't give me any time to reply/defend myself. The last criticism on the list was body language. In the past, he has feedback to me I came across distracted and disengaged in a meeting, to which I have apologised and since made an effort to make sure this does not repeat. The other day his feedback was my body language is negative. Tbh I am at loss on what this might mean, and not sure I should make an effort to change his mind. I personally think picking up someone on their body language, as opposed to behaviour or communication is dangerously uninclusive, and I am concerned he might have some belief of what positive body language means which he expects me to align to. I would appreciate any view on this. To summarise he is a man (c-level), I identify as a woman (manager), and the only woman in the team of managers he leads. He is South Asian (which I suspect might be relevant)

At a certain level heing vocal (even if your point is incorrect) is equated to being more intelligent and trustworthy than someone who is quiet and says / does nothing.

If you just sit there like a jelly baby in meetings and don’t say anything or react then of course a C-Level exec is going to wonder whether they can trust you to have their back. The whole point of you attending meetings with him is that YOU are the expert in your field and as such you are updating him and identifying and deescalating problems in your wheelhouse on his behalf. If you aren’t doing that then you need a new job.

iklboo · 26/02/2022 23:04

If you just sit there like a jelly baby in meetings and don’t say anything or react then of course a C-Level exec is going to wonder whether they can trust you to have their back. The whole point of you attending meetings with him is that YOU are the expert in your field and as such you are updating him and identifying and deescalating problems in your wheelhouse on his behalf. If you aren’t doing that then you need a new job.

Where in earth do you get that OP sits like a 'jelly baby' (whatever the fuck that is) and doesn't say anything or failing to identify issues / de escalate? Oh wait, you just made it up to fit your own narrative. As you were.

JacquelineCarlyle · 26/02/2022 23:06

@Regularsizedrudy

I would email him asking for examples and copy HR in. Sounds like he’s just annoyed youre not a smiley woman falling over herself to make him feel at ease. Twat.

Agree completely with this.

2018SoFarSoGreat · 27/02/2022 01:22

He is probably a twat, but put that aside for a minute.

If this was simply the last of a list of things he picked you up on, I'd give it some thought in context. I'd also copy in hr and make sure there are clear objectives and examples of each thing raised.

I have found it really hard to feel good about people whose body language on zoom is all I see if then, and it is obvious they are not... Whatever it displays. Lack of interest, don't care what is said, are doing other things, are half asleep. Pick one. It makes a tough time for everyone even harder when this happens. I've had some tough conversations over this, and it has improved.

bellac11 · 27/02/2022 11:03

Lots of posters throwing round sexism and misogamy, I dont know that the OP has listed behaviours from her manager that would evidence that

Someone else in the thread said that the manager had displayed hostile non verbal language and again there was no evidence from OP's posts that this was the case (unless I missed it, apologies if so)

GinPalace2 · 27/02/2022 11:32

It’s interesting after 30 minutes of criticising you about not meeting his expectations you focus on body language.

The quickest way to address the body language is to nod. Simply nodding when he/someone else makes a point. This shows you are interacting with the conversation and taking it on board. PP have also given some good ideas about positioning your screen and looking into the camera.

Also as pp say, I wouldn’t discount that there may be an element of misogyny or cultural differences at play.

Teenagetrouble · 27/02/2022 11:42

I work with someone who is very good - but he does (I feel) overly fixate on peoples body language after calls and meetings in order to read them. I think he often gets it wrong as people can do things for all different reasons and body language is not a very accurate (but sometimes useful) way to read people.
So I suppose I’m saying people who rely on body language get it wrong, your boss is wrong and a bad manager to throw this at you. And go back to him for clarity on what he means.

PaulaTrilloe · 27/02/2022 11:45

Has Mr C suite fed back to your male peers about their less than positive body language? (Or just you?)

bellac11 · 27/02/2022 11:52

@PaulaTrilloe

Has Mr C suite fed back to your male peers about their less than positive body language? (Or just you?)

Why would OP know this, hopefully no one eles in the office knows what he has said to her, thats confidential surely?