SUBJECT: MNHQ here: How has maths helped your career?

[AnnaCMumsnet]

Women are underrepresented in science, technology, engineering and maths careers. The ratio of men vs women working in STEM has stalled at 74:26

There are lots of possible explanations for this, but the stats seem to show that disparities start fairly early. Girls are substantially less likely to take scientific, numerical and technical subjects at A Level, and an study from a few years ago showed that across OECD countries, girls are more likely than boys to express a lack of self-confidence when tackling maths and science problems - even though girls often outperform boys at GCSE level in these subjects.

We’ve been talking to Maths4Girls, who are trying to redress the balance. They say:

“We seek to dispel gender stereotypes and inspire more girls to pursue maths and the opportunities it can bring. We do this by introducing female role models to young girls aged 11 - 14 so they can share their inspirational career journey, and give insight into their amazing career.”

Some of the workshops Maths4Girls have run (for free) include using maths to solve crimes, to persuade people, and to save the world (by tackling the really big global challenges such as climate change).

We know from thousands of conversations on Mumsnet over the years that we have many brilliant women here who excel in maths and maths-related fields, so to support Maths4Girls in their mission we thought we’d try to find a few role models of our own.

How has maths helped your career? How do you use maths, from day to day, in your job - and what sort of difference does your job make in the world? Do you have any thoughts about what might have helped you when you were studying or breaking into your chosen field - or do you have any tips for the upcoming generations of girls and young women thinking about building a career in STEM?

(Feel free to namechange if your story is too identifying!)

Thanks
MNHQ

I'm an occupational therapist/hand therapist.
I use a goniometer everyday to measure the range of movement in finger joints, to monitor if an injury is getting better. I also use a dynometer to measure hand strength and disposable tape measures to measure swelling.
I measure and make patterns for splints.
That's it really, basic maths stuff, but it really makes a difference to people's lives.

I’m an actuary and have a maths degree and use maths every day. My degree class was pretty evenly split by sex. I think a good knowledge of maths is useful in so many jobs. My DH is in the civil service, and to get through the ranks you need to pass tests which include a maths element. Although his role isn’t directly maths related, he does need to understand budgets etc.

@Sometimesfraught82

You seem very determined to argue that maths is not important. I’m not really sure why you’d choose to do that on a thread like this.

Your suggestion of teaching maths so it is focused on business and finance is a bit silly. The list you have proposed is all covered by simple arithmetic. Not one thing on your list requires even slightly complex maths.

This thread is about trying to demonstrate to girls (via their parents) that maths is important. Several posters have said use the basics in their day to day jobs - such as business and finance - but others have shown that it opens up a diverse range of really interesting and rewarding careers.

Why you would seek to detract from this I don’t understand. But it’s quite clear that you do not have a good understanding of the beauty and importance of maths and you are coming across as a little bitter about this.

I thought you were going to put forward some argument to get Black-Scholes formulae taught at GCSE then, my bad you mean interest rates and book keeping.. oh wait they already are taught at that level

@SingleModeFibre that is what I was trying to get at, except far kore succinctly, never was good with those pesky words

I'm a psychologist. I use maths to interpret test scores (standard deviation, standard error) and research.

Another beneficial skill taught by learning maths (in my opinion!) is the logical thought process it requires. Yes I don’t need the proofs I learnt for GCSE now for work, but that skill of approaching a problem step by step to reach a logical conclusion is applicable in many parts of life, not just maths.

@Sometimesfraught82

Maths taught at school isn’t related to the world of business and finance. So huge swathes of it is utterly irrelevant

None of it is irrelevant. One of the big skills running through all maths taught in school is logical thinking and that is a huge driver of good decision making in any sphere. Another is the ability to deal with abstract concepts and, in particular, to generalise from the specific. - another skill that is broadly applicable in business and elsewhere. You develop these skills through maths whether you’re actually studying algebra, trigonometry, or calculus, statistics or mechanics. It’s all relevant.

This thread has turned into an arguement about maths taught at school. Whoever it was that mentioned maths specifically related to finance, these concepts were taught in Business Studies GCSE 25 years ago when I was at school and are still taught in Business studies GSCE today, available as an option at most schools.

Regarding maths as a subject. Some STEM careers (and others) involve maths but you don't have to pursue a pure maths route to get into them. Further education at uni will include the relevant aspects that are career specific. A good grounding in maths is useful for a lot of careers as it teaches numeracy and logic.

On the whole this is a useful thread and I will be exploring Maths4girls. I have an 11 year old who thinks that maths is pointless and doesn't see why she should put any effort in. I really want to change this attitude so she can keep her life options open.

Maths is important outside of careers too.

My undergraduate degree is mathematics. I felt i couldnt really use it though unless I went into teaching or academia. I did a masters in a health science qualification now work admin in NHS. Before that i dabbled in finance but the role i had didn't use much maths asides basic arithmatic. I dont use it in my day to day role but it has been a major talking point in interviews and i think it helps me stand out from other candidates as most people hate maths and maybe it makes me seem intelligent. I dont think i am especially smart though, but if you are mathematically minded then maths is one of the easiest degrees to get. I also have tutored along side my day job and look forward to helping my DD with her high school maths down the line.

I'm a charity fundraiser and during my career I've raised millions of pounds for charities.

I use maths every single day. It's part of budgeting, project management and forecasting.

On a smaller scale from Wrong I have been on PTA committees for ~12 years now. My confidence with numbers (and spreadsheets) has been extremely helpful. The amount of people who seem to have no idea at all how to make sure we make profit rather than loss from events is mind-blowing.

Teen I've met some paid fundraisers who don't seem to understand profit!

I'm an Estimator. I work out the costs of civil engineering construction projects and tender to win work. Maths is literally my everyday job. My children now know that whenever they moan about the irrelevance of the maths they are learning "in real life" that I will have an example of when I have used that calculation - the radius of a bell mouth to calculate how much tarmac I need, or the angle of respose to work out wastage on an unkerbed carriageway, or even just percentage differentials to calculate discount to secure work. I adore my job and as a STEM ambassador do occasionally visit school and always focus on how STEM subjects are relevant to so many jobs. But my job needs so many other skills - great interpersonal skills, interpretation of documents (I also trot this one out when the DCs are complaining about comprehension work) and strong organisational skills to meet deadlines. I'm the only female Estimator in my company, it's traditionally a male dominated field and that's such a shame as it's fascinating and rewarding career.

Agree with being confident with Maths is a leveller when in a room full of men.
I won't even state my actual maths qualification, as have self taught and revisted different techniques to bring me up to scratch. Maths is a wonderful subject and I love the logic and the process. Like a pp, maths is more than just arithmetic, but it's hard to get kids past that when at gcse thats all it is.

As a designer, use of geometry, ability to scale up and down is vital.

@Ozymandias101 I use equations, algebra, Pythagoras theorem and geometry all the time in my job - although it's often thought of as an arts degree (in fact one of my degrees is a BA) , practically once working architecture involves maths quite a bit.
Safety calculations, energy calculations, areas, roof pitches, stair calcs, spans, acceptable deflection etc are all regularly used even in small scale projects.
The builders I work with have to calculate quantities and those who understand maths cope with this a lot better.
My DH is a dr and uses maths all the time, weights, measures, conversions, flow rates.

I am a Civil and Structural Engineer.

I use maths every day; calculating loads and forces etc when designing steel, timber, concrete etc for all aspects of construction.

Also use trigonometry for calculations and when producing drawings.

I design the steel etc for numerous house extensions, class room extensions, new buildings, repairing buildings, designing retaining walls etc.

I can see the results of my work and generally make people's environment work better for them.

I love my job.

I am not stuck indoors all of the time and meet all different types of people doing all manner of jobs. Every day is different.

Love it.

I worked as a software engineer and data analyst for many years, so used lots of statistics.
Now I work as a vicar but regularly use maths in sorting budgets, and as a school governor tracking pupil data.

I work in a bank as a compliance manager, often have to do analysis. Also I have had roles in reporting and analysis during my career in financial services. I have a a level in maths, it has been beneficial to me.

Mn, at what age person is the figure taken from.
Because lots of women may start of in careers using maths, but after say the age of 30, they may have children and never return.

If say you have taken the figure when people are age 62, then yes,again, I would not be in the least surprised at the 76.24 figure or whatever it is.

As to your op, I would say to them that people who use Maths in their careers are often higher earners!

I'm a biomedical scientist or the NHS. I was rubbish at maths at school, but got into it during my degree and MSc because I could find different ways to present my data so that it made more sense to people and found I quite enjoyed it.

I've used it in statistics, as well as data analysis and epidemiology (I do actually have a fair idea of how they work out the R number for instance - or R0).

I've also taken economics with the OU (I've got approx half a degree's worth) which involves maths to work out how household economics (microeconomics) and wider economies (macroeconomics) work, which helps a lot with understanding politics.

I use maths now to work out concentrations of various reagents needed, or to multiply up colony counts so that we know how many bacteria we have in a ml, or for serial dilutions to find out how much antigen there is in a solution, or for working out proportions of certain types of cells in certain fluids (among other things). I also use Excel to draw pretty little graphs too to show how well things are working.

Lots of other uses too, but it would get very tedious if I listed them all

I use maths every day. I am a maths teacher. I have an honours degree in maths and a Masters in maths education. The best way to help children enjoy maths is to not let on if you found it difficult/didn’t enjoy it. When I started my teacher training in the 80s, their was a big study called the Cockcroft Report, which emphasised how children pick up attitudes to the subject from their parents. I have found maths useful in my job as a union officer, too. In a room of managers I have never been afraid to criticise inappropriate measures used to gather data. As others have said, the skills needed for maths are so important. The ability to think logically is a boon to critical thinking. Spotting patterns, trial and improvement, interpreting data have all been used in the successful fight against covid. I have taught so many talented young women in my career. Girls need role models. I humbly like to think I have played my part in this.

I’m a doctor. My maths skills really helped with grasping statistics.

Also once at work I was stood next to two accountants who between them couldn’t work out a percentage and one of them quite seriously went to call her boyfriend (a maths teacher) for help.....so it was useful when I stepped in there.