To consider training to become a GP?

[Inpersuitofhappiness]

I can't believe I'm posting this, I have pretty low confidence in myself, and this is something I've always thought was beyond me, but I have always had an interest in all things medical.

I've just turned 30, and a few times I've been told that I should consider getting into the medical profession. I've always shrugged it off, because I don't view myself as smart enough. One person who recommended it was a GP himself and said that its just hard work to get there.

Is it really doable for the fairly average person if they work hard?

Is it too late?

Is it a career even worth having? I know there are so many GPs leaving the profession with the way the NHS has been over the past several years atleast.

There's part of me that feels like I could really help people.

I already have a career that I don't mind, its genuinely the interest in helping people a bit more thats making me want the change.

I'm hoping I might be able to speak to people who have maybe done it, or know people who have. What do people do if they fail their training?

@Inpersuitofhappiness

I don't even have A levels, my highest qualification is L6 in management. I didn't stay at school after 16, I completed training as and when to get where I needed to. I was intending on starting with an access course first because I know my paper qualifications are lacking. So far in life I've not followed the normal routes.

I was hoping to make up for that in my 30s to be honest.

Make sure you do the right Access course. It must be specific to medicine. Access to health or similar won't be the same.

I'm a doctor. It's certainly not impossible!

You need to do A-levels. Two sciences and one other unless you do an extra year at uni as foundation. You'll need AAA. Foundation offers are slightly lower but generally I'd say the standard of candidates is actually often a bit higher; foundation students at my medical school had previously degrees from Oxford and LSE, they just decided to switch to medicine later

You will need a few decent GCSEs. Google the requirements per medical school. After a levels you need to sit the UCAT- an aptitude test, have a read on google.

You are looking at 2 years for a levels, 5 for undergrad medicine, 2 years foundation and 3 years training for GP. This is as an absolute minimum. Some med school courses are 6 years and many take a year between foundation years and specialty training. So between 12-14 years.

You need to accept you will likely need to move around a lot. Med school offers are few and far between and the journeys you're expected to cover on clinical placement for the final three years are usually vast. Universities in the north west cover from Barrow in Furness to Manchester to Cheshire to Isle of Mann and North Wales. You don't have any say in where you go, you go where you're sent! Regardless of your circumstances pretty much. Us owning a house/having kids didn't let us off the hook in this sense.

You also need to then apply for a foundation job which is based half on a situational judgement test and half on your rankings. Some areas are easy to get jobs in. Some, often near big cities, are much tougher. You rank your choices and get what you're given. You rotate around 2-3 jobs here every few months, either at one or two hospitals over the two years. You have to do a medical job and a surgical job, likely a&e and usually a community job too (eg palliative care, GP or psych). Bear in mind here that it's likely only 4-6 months out of the first 2 years can be in GP. You will have to do specialties such as A&E/ orthopaedics/ urology/respiratory (for example) in a hospital, whether you like them or not. You have to do the extremely annoying rotas with loads of nights and long 12 hour shifts, cover xmas and whatnot and it's a pain but I enjoyed it. You have to want to do it though.

Specialty applications for gp however are generally more accessible. You need to sit an aptitude test and situational judgment test here again. It's called the MSRA currently but that may change by the time you go through. You usually do 18 months in a hospital and 18 months in a GP setting as part of the training. Hospital jobs can be varied but are often psychiatry, geriatrics, A&E or paeds for example.

Good luck :) it's the best career in the world.

Have you considered allied health professionals instead? speech and language, physio, Occupational therapy? There's potential to become very specialist, and also a prescriber as an advanced practionner. Courses are much shorter, 2-3 years depending on whether you do an accelerated course, money isn't as good as a medic but there's less stress and more family friendly hours. Generally less weekends and nights unless you go into specific specialities such as respiratory. It's very rewarding and you don't take your work home with you. If you like problem solving it might be right up your street.

I would consider nurse training then try to get into a practice as a nurse and work your way up to nurse clinician

@Theredjellybean It sounds like your about ground down by your work - I completely appreciate that being a doctor is about all the things you have mentioned however I really don't agree that it's not about 'helping people' too. 'health' is more than just science, your dealing with people for a living ergo you can't treat them like objects in my opinion. Yes you have to have lots of resilience (which often is learnt and developed through the training journey) but you can also have a level of sympathy and some of the 'softer skills' whilst maintaining professional boundaries.

OP, I have a friend who embarked on training in her early 30's (already had a HCP degree) and a friend who's mum started training in her mid 40's. Both found it incredibly hard work, much harder than anticipated but both got there, one is now a GP and one is continuing her training within a hospital speciality. If you have the passion, dedication and reserve to essentially put your life on hold for the next 10+years then go for it. You could also look at other health related professions, in any related role you will still have years of continuing professional development, further university courses etc so either way the journey never stops!

I know quite a few doctors, including GPs, one said the training's like doing 35 GCSEs, not hard, you just need a good memory. The other doctors agreed.

If you have no qualifications, why don't you start down the road and see where it takes you.

@PrankedByLife

You don't even have GCSE's!

At least sit your English Language, Maths, Physics, Chemistry and Biology and get an A / 8/9 before thinking of becoming a doctor.

THEN do your A Levels in maths, physics chemistry or biology - you need 3 - if you get A's THEN you've got a chance and even then there is a lot of competition.

My brother is a junior doctor, he previously studied a non medical degree at Oxford University, he didn't have to do 7 years but a 4 year degree.

There was a 50 year old on his course - that man was previously a City Banker.

You have to be very intelligent / academic.

The fact you don't have GCSE's surprises me that people have encouraged you take this route.

I do have GCSEs. I didn't list them as they aren't as high a qualification as a L6 NVQ in management. FWIW I got A in English, A in Science and B in Maths but this is the first time in about 10 years anyones shown any interest in what qualifications I got at school.

The fact that people have encouraged me previously to take the route is probably more of a telltale sign that I'm not a complete idiot, and that I come across fairly well, as I've said, I haven't taken the right paper routes, but the career I chose didn't require me to get too much in the way of qualifications.

Theres nothing I've ever failed that I've tried to do, all of the assignments in my L6 were scored highly. Most I got distinctions on. Its not that I'm completely thick, I just haven't relied on academia as that's not where life has at this point taken me.

I’d agree op, why don’t you start with getting some basic qualifications and then see how you feel from there?

You mentioned doing an access course, usually people without GCSE's embark on that route.
So you still need to do your triple science GCSE's, single science from 10 years ago won't cut it.
The university's will be interested in your GCSE results.

There's no harm in looking into things further. I remember wanting to be a GP when at school but looked into what was required and soon came to my own realisation that it would be too much of a struggle for me academically. That's not to say I'm not an intelligent person but it requires top results in the sciences and that just wasn't me. Maybe talk to people in the profession for advice first.

I don’t know if your specifically looking at GP but without any form of further education currently, this would be a long time studying and at 30 I assume you’d prefer to ‘earn as you learn’? Have you considered an on the job route such as access course around current commitments, then apply for say an ambulance service and work through ECA, technician, paramedic then applying for physician associate which can be done part time and paramedic qualification would gain access to this. Then you can do further training as a doctor whilst still working. Not a short route but all earning whilst learning, and no route to becoming a gp is ‘easy’

Honestly it will be tough. Very tough. As an example Manchester medical school has about 68 places and over 1,000 applicants.

These applicants will have straight As at gcse, straight As at a level and extensive work experience.

You’ll also need to do the UCAT for some medical schools which is basically an IQ test, and score well.

Thousands of qualified students do not get into medicine every year.

You’ll need to be completely focussed, and clearly be able to demonstrate why they should choose you over another applicant.
That’s just getting accepted.

After that you have 7 years of difficult exams, many of which cost £100s and you have to fund yourself.

In your junior doctor years you’ll be on a rota - you might have to work Xmas, new year, miss birthdays, weddings and be on call, all whilst still studying.

I don’t want to put you off, but that is the reality. Most doctors I know like their jobs, but day to day it is stressful and there are easier ways to help people.

On the flip side, you’ll be well paid and pretty much guaranteed job, and you will get satisfaction in a way an office job won’t give you.

YABVU.

Have you considered training as a Physician Associate? They're like doctors in that they're medically trained, but not as long as traditional doctors and there's a lot they can't do, but definitely hands on medicine, caring and very valuable member of the team. It's a shorter academic timeline and a HCP that hospitals are using more and more of.

Something to look into

Whatever you do, @Inpersuitofhappiness, please don’t lower your expectations. Aim high and go for it, why not?!

I agree with what PP have said, get some A Levels or Access courses done and go from there. Work out the path you need to take, then take the first steps.

Good luck!

I started medical school at 24
It was my second career. I was initially a nurse.
I also did not have science a-levels and instead sat an access course. It was incredibly hard. I would advise an access course rather than a levels as it is more suited to an adult learner. Mature students on my course who sat alevels generally wished they had completed access instead. You need to be careful that it is the right course which is accepted by your desired medical schools.

I would strongly advise you research lots of health related careers. Radiolography, optometry and audiology are often overlooked

If you still think medicine is for you then my advice is always to go for it.

It is a long slog. I did access, then my medical degree, taking a year out to have my daughter, and am now slogging away in my second year as a junior doctor, applying to specialty training. It has been hard. Would I do it again? I’m not sure... probably. I do love being a doctor, I do think it was worth the sacrifice. Let me know if you have any other questions

Have a look at Physician Associate training as well. I believe its a 3 yr degree course, there are quite a few PA courses now.

There are plenty of jobs that will allow you to 'help people', but doctors are scientists, first and foremost.

The public perception of them is poor and as a result a lot of their patients have zero respect for them.

These two things are not unconnected.

Sorry not RTFT I was like you and had a child young so missed out on opportunities.
I did an ‘access to medicine’ course in college which gives you more of an advantage when applying to study medicine. It was a course for mature students so the ages were 25-50 those on the older side all got onto the really strict medicine courses after college.

It is very difficult though as you don’t get any help financially like in uni so I was working, going to college and a single parent so I took a job opportunity afterwards instead.

Personally I’d get cracking on the access course ASAP if that is what you need to do. It will give you a much better idea of aptitude/ interest. You’ll need a higher level of qualification than you currently have for any health care profession, they’re practically all 3/4 year degrees with high entry grades so you’ll need it whatever you decide. Personally if your heart is in medicine I’d try for that, what have you got to lose?

Thanks for the advice, its really appreciated. Its as id suspected to start with, not only is there training to become the sort of person on paper to be accepted to do the degree, it does seem that there's a huge, huge amount of competition for the opportunity to even train.

As much as I'd love the opportunity to go into an academic role, and actually do something that feels like its worthwhile maybe I'd be far better off just staying where I am. I was feeling like maybe I'd just bite the bullet and try, and I'm glad I asked here for some advice, because I'd be mortified if I tried to train and couldn't do it.

Thanks for the insights, and the really good advice. I might look into the other roles people have pointed out.
Thanks.

Don’t give up before you’ve started. Can you do the access course part time whilst working? Medicine courses have changed to make them more practical and less academic. Yes you need certain attributes and grades. Some of the most academic make terrible HCP, common sense and people skills are just a couple of other attributes needed!

If you train as a nurse or an allied health professionals as suggested, you could gain entry via an access course, which would only take a year.

then apply for say an ambulance service and work through ECA, technician, paramedic then applying for physician associate which can be done part time and paramedic qualification would gain access to this. Then you can do further training as a doctor whilst still working. Not a short route but all earning whilst learning, and no route to becoming a gp is ‘easy’

Wow. How long would you say that would take? O/p would be retiring by the time she qualified!

I also very much doubt you can train as a doctor while still working. Medical degrees are very demanding, placements, studying around those- the last 3 years you’re effectively working and studying.

I'd say go for it Op. You're not too old and by the time you are fully qualified, you'll still have 20+ years of your working career left. Good luck.