Furloughed still working

[seavieww]

My boss who owns a medium sized business has furloughed his most his staff as some of our offices have closed - about 75 percent

The office girls ( and one guy) there's 6 of us have been furloughed as from today but are all still managing to work ( from home)

He said he can claim all our wages (80%) so that's around £9k per month on our wages BUT we are all still working as usual

As much as I don't really care per say
He can do what he wants, I was telling my boyfriend today his plans etc and he said he really shouldn't be doing that?

Thing is when you are furloughed you give your details ie national insurance number to hmrc so surely they would be checking to make sure people are claiming it correctly?

Just wanted some thoughts on this

@DonnaDarko thank you this is perfect to show him when he mentions it

However I can't see anywhere that the employee has to reply it's just the company has to send a written record

But as I say, he may not even tell anyone that's my worry

And if I know I have been furloughed then of course then I would speak up and say he can't!

So bad

It is illegal and immoral but I doubt very much theyll be wanting access to company systems afterwards with all the thousands of companies who'll be furloughing their staff unless someone whistleblows and they have reason to suspect it was abused. Abusing it is such a shitty thing for an employer to do when people are scared for their livelihoods and want to do what they can to remain employed.

That's awful. It's very clear when you do the claim on the HMRC portal that whoever is being claimed for should not be working. I do the payroll for my company (and the rest of the accounts) so I have not been furloughed but everyone else has.

I'm surprised your friend who is doing the payroll has agreed to it

but he said he needed my NI

Why wouldn't payroll have your NI number?

@Titsywoo and @amber763 yeah true but it's not my friend submitting, he's just gathering the info

@Fredthedoggie I've already said because we were on the phone together and he said whilst I've got you what's your ni number -
He was asked to produce a spread sheet with our names, ni and monthly pay ( us 6 ) and I was talking to him at the time as he was checking the system to get the others. Only asked me as we were talking on the phone!

@Titsywoo as far as I'm aware he hasn't agreed as such
He was asked to collate the office staffs details so my boss could furlough us ?
So I guess he's not actually processing it my boss is

This has happened to us. Boss has told us we have to keep working. We were made to sign the furlough agreement but he then contacted us and told us that we would actually keep working.

Totally stuck because when we raised it with him he said it's not black and white and that we can keep on working. I know this isn't true but I also can't afford to be without wages.

Boss says he won't get caught as HMRC will have too many claims to check them.

I hate it.

@Badboss2020 oh no! So it's more common than I thought. Bet loads of companies are going to do it...

I think so too. My boss knows full well that he's in the wrong but says that he won't furlough is if we don't keep working. I.e the other option is redundancy.

One person stood up for himself and refused to work. Boss made it clear he won't be coming back at the end of furlough and made them out like a traitor.

Your boss is committing fraud.

If you've signed something agreeing to be furloughed and you continue to work, you
Are also committing fraud. Fuck that!

People, who's bosses are saying you'll never get caught yeah cause no one has ever been done for benefit fraud before.

The reality is that whilst it is an obligation on the employer to seek the consent of Joe Bliggs to put him on furlough, the practicality of it is that employers have all the details they need from running regular payroll to put Joe on to furlough without Joe knowing.

I would not be surprised in the least If there were 100s of companies in the UK doing this and employees blissfully unaware that their name has been used for this little trick!!!

@Dalrympy my boss is exactly the same
If anyone did stand up to him, he would just have that attitude I think

Ah well looks like that's going to be me tomorrow when he says he's furloughing me!
Maybe I'll be giving my marching orders ?!

I shall update tomorrow ! Thanks guys

@ouch321 yep I feel the same

Bit like pp said, how they can feel so confident they wouldn't ever get investigated ? I would not want that on my conscience thank you

Well it's that or no wages and no job at the end of it all.

I have kids and rent to pay.

I have him on tape telling us that we have to keep working and that the government advice isn't clear (it bloody well is!).

The ridiculous thing is that he has furloughed the WHOLE company. Even himself. Yet the company continues to trade. Not making much money but it's definitely running. It's crazy.

This is all very outting but we were told to lie to the accountants and to HMRC if they call. We are still the ones answering the phone!

Unfair dismissal court case for him if he does

No one has been there for more than two years so unfair dismissal unlikely to get very far.

Mine is by far the dodgiest case I've heard so far. To openly try and defraud HMRC is very bold fucking stupid and we have plenty of evidence that he's doing it!

There is a hotline number at HMRC to report employers who are doing this. I assume it is anonymous. Every taxpayer will be paying for arseholes like this for years to come

@badboss2020 OMG that's not good - bloody worrying that some people act like this ? But yes I get your situation you need your income

But I wouldn't be able to deal with the anxiety, I'm worried enough, so I would have to say to my boss if he presents me with a letter that it's furlough or nothing
I know for a fact he can't furlough us office people, he need us as the company is still trading and making money which yes is good for me, I don't want furlough unless I have to

God there's people who aren't getting salaries and in bad situations then you have people like our bosses 🙄

So question for you @SummerSazz do I report ? Would you?

Any everyone else, should I report ? I feel like I couldn't and wouldn't want to get involved but I feel like I am if that makes sense ? So if I find out for sure it's what he's doing should I do that?

Heads all over the place.....

Advice on this re my last few posts please if anyone can shed some light on this would be appreciated and I'll catch up in the morning

Night all x

@SummerSazz Yeah but you whistle blow, the company perhaps has to cease trading due to the financial implications then you're out of work. It's a no win for these employees :(

Those of you who know that your employer is acting fraudulently, but don't call them out on it, are also acting fraudulently. It's really easy. If you know your employer has claimed money to furlough you, then just refuse to do any more work. If you're threatened with being sacked, tell your employer that your employer more than happy to phone HMRC.

The "hotline" is actually a website where you do have to put your full details in. It's not anonymous and there is no phone line at the moment.

I know because I tried but I chickened out.

Like someone said. There is no win here. I can report and then I don't get paid and I'm out of a job, I can stand up to him and probably the same, or I carry on and continue to feed my family.