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Original poster

Is my HoD being unreasonable in wanting me to go in for a meeting while still on maternity leave?

70 replies

Kathyis6incheshigh · 14/08/2007 14:51

Esp. bearing in mind that I will have to bring one or both children with me?
Is this normal? Has he not really thought it through, do you think?
Would I look like I'm being unco-operative if I refuse or at least say that what with childcare issues it will have to be on my terms?

OP posts:
Original poster
Kathyis6incheshigh · 14/08/2007 15:33

many thanks for this info.

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Original poster
Kathyis6incheshigh · 15/08/2007 12:18

Oh, I'm all confused now. Help.

Arranged meeting with HoD for before I go back properly, saying that I may need to bring a child or two with me, but he has emailed me to say I really do need to find childcare because it's an important meeting etc etc.

Even assuming there is space at the nursery, it will cost me about £90 for 2 dcs for a day, I believe.

AIBU to get back to him and say sorry, but I am not prepared to spend that much money and can we have the meeting once I am back at work (and getting paid).

Or will that make me look flakey and uncommitted?

I am so pissed off at his la la la, just arrange childcare attitude, as if all I need to do is wave a magic wand and Mary Poppins will pop up and take my children for free.

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flowerybeanbag · 15/08/2007 12:22

YANBU.
If it's a 'keeping in touch day' as mentioned below, it should be mutually agreed, both in terms of timing and payment. You can have 10 paid keeping in touch days without it having an effect on your maternity pay.
Is he saying you will be paid your normal rate for this meeting? If not, are you happy with that, and if not, absolutely fair enough to ask for payment for childcare!

BellaBear · 15/08/2007 12:23

YANBU at all

Original poster
Kathyis6incheshigh · 15/08/2007 12:26

But the 'keeping in touch' days won't technically apply to me will they, as I had my baby back in Dec O6? That's how I read the cut'n'paste from Wheels below.

Trouble is, if I am paid (which I am guessing is not allowed anyway) it will only cover the 2 hours of the meeting - and in any case I will have to pay for the whole day at nursery as you can't generally just pay for part of a session, so it wouldn't even begin to cover my costs.

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flowerybeanbag · 15/08/2007 12:29

Oh sorry Kathy, yes in that case KITDs don't apply to you, and if you are still getting any maternity pay you can't also receive 'normal' pay in the same week.
However I would say reimbursement for childcare costs is not payment in that sense, so I think that would be ok. That's what I'd do anyway. They can't insist you go in, so if it is really important they certainly should do what is necessary to enable you to go in, you certainly shouldn't be out of pocket. It's not as if you are refusing to go or don't see the importance of the meeting.

BellaBear · 15/08/2007 12:29

regardless of keeping in touch days, you are on leave, so no YANBU at all. He could try to be a bit accommodating, I think.

flowerybeanbag · 15/08/2007 12:30

they could pay the nursery direct for the sessions or could reimburse you on production of a receipt.

EffiePerine · 15/08/2007 12:31

Well say that you can make the meeting, but as it is during your maternity leave you will have to ask them to cover your costs (and set those out: travel, childcare etc.).

fishie · 15/08/2007 12:31

when are you due to go back? i did go in a few weeks before returning to meet evil new boss but there doesn't seem much point in discussing things if you aren't going back for months.

littlefrog · 15/08/2007 12:31

As far as I remember, if you work AT ALL during a week when you're getting SMP, you lose ALL your SMP (perhaps this doesn't apply to you though, if your baby was born in Dec though...)
Do you really think this couldn't be done over the phone?
If it can't be, I'd consider saying that yes, I'll come in, but I need to be paid for a full day's work - which surely is reasonable. Better perhaps to ask for pay, rather than childcare/travel costs.

Original poster
Kathyis6incheshigh · 15/08/2007 12:33

Thank you Bella & Flowery.

I am sadly disappointed in him tbh - he's usually so spot on about equal opps issues

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flowerybeanbag · 15/08/2007 12:33

but as you rightly say, littlefrog, if she is paid salary she loses all SMP for that week. I would think reimbursement of expenses would get round that.

Original poster
Kathyis6incheshigh · 15/08/2007 12:34

I'm due back 1st Nov, so it would be about a fortnight before returning.
It would be a good idea, but ninety quid is ninety quid
God I hate asking for money
Am thinking I really do not have what it takes to survive in the cut-throat world of working motherhood....

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Quattrocento · 15/08/2007 12:35

Don't be disappointed in him. He may not be doing it with any intention other than wanting you to feel included.

I recall a thread where one lady on maternity leave was spitting tacks about a reorganisation where she hadn't been consulted.

It's difficult to get the balance right.

slalomsuki · 15/08/2007 12:38

Kathy

I presume you work at a university or FE college. I am a HoD at one and we are told in no uncertain terms not to contact members of staff who are off sick or on maternity unless it is dire emergency or to get an idea when they are coming back.

I am meeting with one member of stff like you in a similar sitaution and they will be bring thier kids with them next week and so will I.

Have a look at your handbook and have a chat with the personnel re and find out if the uni can help you.

we have a subsidised creche on site

Original poster
Kathyis6incheshigh · 15/08/2007 12:38

Oh you're probably right Quattro - it must be a minefield.

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Original poster
Kathyis6incheshigh · 15/08/2007 12:47

Slalom - thanks - yes, it is a uni.
My former HoD has always worked strictly according to the rule you mention - eg I had 2 PhD students who were very near to finishing when my baby was due and I was desperate to see their theses through to the final stages but was not allowed to.

It's interesting you think a meeting like that is doable with children around. I do think it is, esp if it's just the baby - and frankly I have colleagues who would love an hour of playing with a baby if I need to do some really intense discussion.

Oh we did once have a memo round saying it's not appropriate to bring children in due to health and safety reasons (b*llocks IMO, I work in an office, not a lab) so I am guessing Personnel would take the view that I shouldn't.

I do think this keeping-children-and-work-strictly-separate attitude is very parent-unfriendly, and I hate the way it seems like the consequences are different if you're a man and take a child in (everyone thinks 'oh, how lovely, he's human' but if you're a woman they think you're flakey. Or maybe that's just me being paranoid).

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slalomsuki · 15/08/2007 12:53

I'm taking two of mine in next week aged 6 and 4 for a meeting and to make sure an office move is going ahead. I will have them at a seperate table or set them up on the computer and take it from there.

It depends upon where you work I guess. The dean of our school is relaxed during school holiday time but a bit more strict in teaching time but I do know of lecturers who have their kids sitting in classes with them if needs be.

fishie · 15/08/2007 12:58

yes he is being silly and thoughtless isn't he. i think it would be absolutely fair enough to ask for childcare expenses, he's the one who has asked you not to bring them so he is effectively asking you to find someone ese to look after them.

Original poster
Kathyis6incheshigh · 15/08/2007 13:00

Yes it does seem to vary between institutions.

My old PhD supervisor hardly took any mat leave when she had hers in the 80s and was infamous among students for breastfeeding during supervisions. That's not an ideal solution either, but she at least had the option.

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Dottydot · 15/08/2007 13:05

OK, I'm donning hard hat... But I think it is reasonable to request a meeting a fortnight before you return to work, to discuss your plans, etc. If the meeting is planned for mid-October (you said about a fortnight before you return?) then it's lots of notice to find childcare.

Sorry - it's the manager coming out in me - but I think I'd want to see a returning employee a week or two before they started back and with that much notice would hope/expect they could sort out childcare.

Original poster
Kathyis6incheshigh · 15/08/2007 13:07

Dotty, no hard hat needed! I don't think it's unreasonable to request a meeting. But do you think the employee should be prepared to fork out £90 of their own money for childcare at a time when they're on the unpaid portion of their leave?

Having plenty of notice helps you find some childcare, but it doesn't help you find free childcare (not in this case anyway as my mum will still be abroad!)

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Original poster
Kathyis6incheshigh · 15/08/2007 13:10

it is very useful to have a manager's perspective anyway, Dotty - thanks.

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Dottydot · 15/08/2007 13:11

Sorry - I'm writing this at work (ahem) so my view is manager-slanted - should probably think about it when I get home this evening!

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