Why won't new employee sign his mileage claim?

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The usual process is that forms are completed online, printed, signed and handed to the office admin with a petrol receipt.

Yes, it's a bit antiquated but it works. New employee is kicking up an almighty fuss about how he should be able to submit it with his name typed, rather than an actual signature. He's still printing the form and handing it in, so it's not about inefficiency, he just keeps saying he doesn't see why it needs a signature.

I can't get to the bottom of why it matters so much to him that he'd make this much fuss, over something so minor, in his first few weeks in a new job.

What am I missing?

I'm beginning to wonder Cherries, but yes, as far as possible. Three forms of ID and two references. TBh, he's been "difficult" on a number of things but I could at least understand why the others were bothering him

Does he have a probationary period?! Might be worth keeping an eye on, usually when people start a job they are full of enthusiasm and may put forward new ideas, but I'd say they are less likely to complain needlessly about current systems and procedures.

Mind you, my DH would probably prefer to just sign a form after spending time having to scan receipts into their online system!

Yes, he has TooTrue in far more ways than this, but unfortunately there's no probation period.

It's very specific to this industry but you only have to pass probation in your first job after qualifying, after that no more probation periods no matter how many times you change job.

Send him a copy of the company policy stating that expense forms should be signed. Either he abides by company policy which form part of his terms and conditions or he doesn't at which HR should pick up the issue.

I know someone like this.
Their concern is that their signature might become available to all and sundry.
The merits of this concern are debatable but that is the issue underlying my friend's stance.

Yes, we're going to have to follow HR advice on this one, for more than just the mileage issue. I was just curious as to whether anyone could think of a sensible reason why this is such a big deal to him

Industrial espionage ?
Is that a possibility? It happened in my previous job.

Continuous service is what’s relevant, not a probationary period. Probationary periods are pretty meaningless legally anyway- the only thing that changes usually is the notice period. People don’t have stronger employment rights just because they’ve passed probation in a job.

Not in this industry Flowery - you can change employer but still be considered to have continuous service.

Continuous service and 'probation' are different things, surely? In the NHS you can change employer from one Trust to another and you are considered to have continuous service for purposes of things like sick pay, holidays, maternity rights, etc., but even an internal change of job will trigger 10 week and 20 week job reviews to ensure that you are settling into the job and that the job should continue.

Yes probably Lougle but in this industry once you've qualified you don't get another probation period and you have continuous service

That doesn't seem very sensible.

Honestly, I think your “why” is that he thinks he is cleverer than you and is trying to challenge you and make a point. I really wouldn’t keep him on especially if he is being tricky about other things too. I think it will get worse.

Or it’s fraud and he wants deniability. But same outcome really! Ditch him!

No Lougle, but it's a national agreement, nothing I can do about it.

Is there any kind of appraisal system, or peer review for the role? Just thinking of ways that could be used to formally raise his performance?

I doubt there is a rational reason behind it, so I would just go down the route of 'requirement of the role, no signature no money' whilst looking towards the door. I really don't feel this is going to end well tbh, he already doesn't sound like the kind of person to back down. Is he actually good at his job (the bits of it he deigns to do)?

There was a guy I used to work with who was really about signing anything at work as he was an ultra paranoid weed smoker. I’m not sure what he thought people would do with his signature but it seemed to worry him

He can then go back and say he didn't sign anything when you unravel his fraud later down the line!!!

If he has brought the form you the office or emails it from his work email account, you're going to be able to prove on the balance of probabilities that he filled the form in for any claim. Get him to write an email each time he sends it with confirmation that the claimed miles are a true reflection of miles travelled.

Or like another pp said, just don't process the forms. You've told him the process, ball is in his court.

I agree this is very odd & would make me suspicious

It is a ridiculously time consuming, and rather wasteful system though. Ours used to be like that, and it was SUCH a pain in the rear. Our Employers finally caught on that, by submitting the claim, you are promising that you have actually done those miles - it only takes a slight change of wording on the form. It is ridiculous to make every employee print out each claim.

I mean, only he will know why he is happy to put up with the antiquated system and yet not sign it - you'll only find out by asking him. I was just commenting on the waste of paper / ink / time the system involves.

OP in my organisation we undergo quarterly expense audits. Line managers randomly select an expense claim for each of their direct reports and scrutinises to ensure it was an approved visit or a wholly justifiable expense incurred in the execution of their duties (to quote policy words).

For this employee, can you ask his line manager to review his claims and determine everything is justifiable.

Longer term, his manager should give him a first informal warning that if he doesn't abide by company policy and put a 'wet signature' on the firm, in line with policy and procedure (can you give him a copy of the expenses policy?), then he will be out of compliance. It isn't relevant that the process is senseless/waste of time and ink etc, it is the current process and he doesn't get to pick and choose, he follows the process or he can get another job.

If he has done under two years, it is possible to part company provided you abide by notice period and contractual obligations. Probation isn't relevant here.

I agree the system needs updating but that's not his objection. He has been asked what the issue is but all he can say is he doesn't see why he should.

This one is going to run and run. I probably shouldn't be surprised but it seems the forms he's completed so far include mileage from home, rather than from the usual place of work. Some days he won't actually go into work, but he's still only allowed to claim the extra miles iyswim. It says that on the form.

I guess, as he hasn't signed the form and no expenses have yet been paid, this will be dismissed by his line manager as a "mistake".

All his claims will be checked going forward and nothing will be paid without a signature.

For everyone who's convinced we can dismiss because he doesn't have two years, he's a teacher, so we can't. They have continuous service under the national teacher pay and conditions regardless of how often they change employer (in the public sector). Not in a school for those wondering about the mileage.

How odd. Any intelligent person knows that expenses have checks and balances. I've claimed expenses where I've had to physically sign the expenses sheet but in another place of work had an online system where no signature was required but no one else could log in as me so they knew it was me and my manager had to approve before it went for processing.

I'd say you don't sign you don't get paid. If he goes on about it then it is time for an informal meeting explaining that he can't circumvent company policy just because he doesn't agree with it. Who knows what he'll refuse to do next.