"it is unacceptable for men or women to call in because a child is sick in my view."

[hunkermunker]

Xenia says "it is unacceptable for men or women to call in because a child is sick in my view."

I am interested to know what other people do in this situation.

Forgot to add that my mum worked full time throughout our childhoods (I have two sisters). Her job always meant more to her than her children, (which were a barrier to finding another man ((whom she would always support)) and this put is in harms way basically. It's an extreme example but these thing do happen and are more common when people have less real choice; ie the lower earners.

If it comes to it I will choose DS and have to hope my PhD thesis is still cutting edge 2 or 3 years from now. I wish I didn?t have to make that choice though.

I just don't know yet uwila....it's early days re;France, but it is definitely different...we only moved at the end of November, and then went straight to a month long, ( it was planned before the 'France move ' reared it's head ! before I get accused of sheer decadence !),trip to Oz for xmas ! So am just geting into harness..And lots of differences may be also due to changing my work environment from clinical to university ? But colleagues here absolutely do not rush around ! Greeting everyone takes about half an hour, then coffee several times a day....at 5pm the lights are being turned off, and you are literally harassed out of the department !! I don't have a lot of experience of US, except some conferences but I imagine it is the opposite of France....

I would have the second child, mt, as there's a limited amount of time for that but probably 40 more years for you to forge your career. I am not sure a PhD is really needed to make a lot of money. There's a lot of talk about MBAs etc but often people who do well just pick a good idea and get on with it.

Have had a break - did this kick off then?

Is that why you think people do PhDs Xenia, to make a lot of money?

A PhD can be useful though in some careers in making a name for yourself. It would in mine.

I thought MT said she couldn't afford to leave her partner and she relied on his financial support - thus presumably her problems might be resolved a bit if she was earning more money, that was all. No, I don't think PhDs usually help earnings at all except in a few narrow sectors. I've told the children I won't financially support them doing PhDs for that reason, although if they choose to do them that's fine and up to them as adults.

If you didn't do the PhD, Monkeytrousers, would you be in a position to leave him? Would you want to have another child with someone you're not happy with?

So if your child wanted to be, for example, a research biochemist, you wouldn't help them to do a PhD? But if they wanted to do a legal practice course you would?

Oh yes I told dd this last week, if she wants to do a PhD she can pay herself

She has a long time to save up as she is only 4

Surely the Child Trust fund covers the cost of that CD?

HUnker - and

My DD and DS paying for secondary school so they better start saving.

dd aged 3 is trying to save but has a lot of iou's from me!

My DD doesn't take IOU's.

There is a bit of a trend of lazier students not to bother applying for jobs, graduating, not knowing what to do so they go and do an MA. It's a completely pointless process in most cases and means they just want parental money for another yar because they didn't apply for jobs on time. When my daughter was considering doing a Harvard MBA on graduating - Blair's son was at university with her and going to do that I was not against that. What I would want is them to make out a sort of life/business case for whatever it is they propose, that's all. I am not sure I would be very happy funding post graduate things at all. Daughter 1 should really have sorted out her own funding and she's very lucky I'm funding her for the moment.

she is only 3 so she doesnt know she has them yet and i am very careful to not let her see me emptying her piggy bank!!

Mine is also 3 and is still trying to work out how to spell IOU.

i wasnt a lazy student but when i went to uni i hadnt a clue what i was going to do when i left, i did what has been labelled a micky mouse course - humanities and media studies. and i will be the first to admit i went to uni to have a good time and party til i dropped. i was lucky that at the time student grants still existed student loans had just been invented but were more for pocket money my first one was for less than £400 and paid for me to go ski ing.

i think my parents would have liked me to have what they call a proper career my dad was a barrister and my mum a solicitor, i have a sister who is an accountant 1 brother is a dr and the other something well paid in IT.

i wasnt pushed into doing anything girly i in fact applied for the diplomatic service then turned it down in favour of being a holiday rep. It is my choice to have a low paid stereotypical female job and nothing to do with having children

and i have had more sick days due to hangovers than due to childcare issues!

uwila i told her it meant shoes! and she likes dressing up in mine so we are both happy!

and i worked for a large city firm where on a fri afternoon a lot of the section i worked in (mainly men) spent a good few hours in the pub every lunch time and very often didnt make it back into work! They were getting paid to get pissed which in my opinion is worse than throwing a sicky to look after your kids!

pmsl @ sorting out a business case for doing a course Xenia

You really do make me laugh sometimes

fantastic!

Message withdrawn

If they want money from me as adults then I'm not going to fund 3 years sitting on a beach in Bali or whatever even if they thought it was their destiny. I might fund one to effect and arrange the building on my island though or help them start a business but what children need to know is they don't have some sort of meal ticket for life otherwise there is no incentive to anything. That is a major issue with the very rich in which category we certainly don't fall.

so, this is a hard question, how would you, as a line manager/employer, deal with someone who was taking off a LOT of time, wither for their own sickness, child's illness or 'emotional issues'? At what point to you decide that someone is 'unemployable'?
Open question, I'm asking cos dh & I work in different businesses, with very different 'cut off' points on these issues.
And sickness of the staff, rather than other reasons, could have a different answer.

kickassangel - that's a point that i've been giving a bit of thought to - at work i have staff on long term sickness and i have staff who were ill when hr pointed out that they had insufficient holiday allowance for the holiday they had booked. circumstances are different but we're having to treat both cases carefully. i am also personally dealing with the impact of a nanny who has a child who has picked up a string of minor illnesses but has asked to take the day off approx once every 3 or 4 weeks because the child's ill or for doctor's appointments etc. this latter situation has been by far the most disruptive to my work although the total amount of time off is far less than other two situations.

i don't think there's an easy answer but, from an employer's point of view, i am far more likely to try and accommodate those who at least try and understand my position rather than the slightly bolshie "my child is more important than anything else" tone that some posters seem to take. obviously your child is the most important thing to you - that goes without saying - but it isn't necessarily to me or to the business. that doesn't mean we won't do our best to accommodate your needs but a bit of gratitude to colleagues who have to pick up the slack makes a lot of difference.