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Original poster

any help please?

84 replies

whentheshithitsthefan · 02/12/2014 20:04

my husband was dismissed from work today. he will be appealing the decision, but as we have never done this before we dont know where to start, can anyone offer some advice?

OP posts:
flowery · 02/12/2014 21:43

What was he dismissed for and how long has he worked there?

KarenHillavoidJimmyswarehouse · 03/12/2014 10:36

If he's in a union then they will be able to advise.

Otherwise, the letter explaining his dismissal should contain details of how to appeal or refer to the company's policy. Ordinarily, just putting "I am appealing against the decsion to dismiss me which I was notifed of on x date" in writing to the most senior person in HR will suffice, but he should really check the company's policy.

mymummademelistentoshitmusic · 03/12/2014 10:43

What help/advice do you want? Without knowing what's actually happened it's not really possible to advise.

Original poster
whentheshithitsthefan · 03/12/2014 16:44

he was dismissed for sexual harrassment. he will be appealing. weve never been in this situation or anything close before, so i know nothing about putting an appeal in..
i dont really want to put any specific details on here, but if anyone might be able to give a bit more advice would you mind dropping me a pm?
thanks.

OP posts:
flowery · 03/12/2014 17:39

Do you not feel able to say how long he has worked there?

mymummademelistentoshitmusic · 03/12/2014 17:46

Was it you that posted about something similar recently? The husband was stopping the team employing people they didn't need through an agency and getting backhanders (or something like that)?

Original poster
whentheshithitsthefan · 03/12/2014 17:48

nope nothing like that.

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Lunastarfish · 03/12/2014 17:56

Your husband needs to write a letter to say he is appealing the decision. He should explain why the decision was unfair for example no evidence of the harassment, witness story has holes in it, long service, etc (obviously whatever is the truth in the situation). If he's in a union contract then asap.

He only has 3 months less 1 day from the DISMISSAL to lodge a claim at the employment tribunal.

LIZS · 03/12/2014 18:19

Isn't a tribunal only applicable if he has more than 2 years' service ? Have they followed their disciplinary procedures ?

sparklecrates · 03/12/2014 18:44

Others will advise too but calmly ask for all their evidence before making any excuses or saying anything you think might ingratiate. I had sone thing similar happen to me and I said 'wow that's a serious accusation' which was rather nastily recorded as 'sparkle admits what they did was serious' the nasty bastards.. but that is what employers can get like.. They all think they are bloody Columbo. Getting all the 'evidence' gives you time to calm down and also means they will struggle to add or change any thing later. be nice about asking but be v. aware

Musicaltheatremum · 03/12/2014 19:25

How awful for you. I wonder LIZS if sexual harassment is one of these things they say is instant dismissal. Correct if it is true but not so good if it's not. Sorry you are going through this.

HermioneWeasley · 03/12/2014 19:27

Go with Luna's advice

Original poster
whentheshithitsthefan · 03/12/2014 20:53

he was well over 2 years service.
he was suspended for 3 weeks while then ''investigated'' the investigation consisted of 2 interviews...not much in the scheme of the accusation.
and it is a single accusation relating to one incident.

OP posts:
Original poster
whentheshithitsthefan · 03/12/2014 20:56

thanks LUNA, he has to appeal the decsion before he can go to tribunaral. he has 5 days from when he recieves his dismissal letter to do that. then if that doesnt go how we think it want it to then he can still do to tribuniral?

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mymummademelistentoshitmusic · 03/12/2014 22:30

I guess the question is; did he do it? What evidence did they have?

Original poster
whentheshithitsthefan · 04/12/2014 07:01

he says he didnt, and the person who has accompynied him to the meetings also says he didnt.
their evidence is of cctv footage, which they say shows he may have intentionally or unintentionally touched the lady.
so i think that means there is a chance it might also show he may not have intentionally or unintentionally touched her.

also, the lady says a very specific thing. and the cctv doesnt show it in any way shape or form.

OP posts:
lougle · 04/12/2014 07:13

So is your aim to appeal the 'charge' or appeal the 'sentence'?

If CCTV footage shows he did in fact touch her and the woman in question has interpreted that to be be sexual in nature, then he can appeal on the basis that it was unintentional but he understands the woman's distress and feels that he should be able to keep his job while accepting certain conditions about contact with the distressed employee.

If, however, he feels that she has made a specific claim which should be visible on footage and wasn't, he may wish to appeal the whole thing and ask that it's dismissed.

Original poster
whentheshithitsthefan · 04/12/2014 07:28

to be honest, i have no idea what bit to appeal!
the investigation wa completed in under 2 hrs.
to sack someone it seems a very short shoddy way of investigating.

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Original poster
whentheshithitsthefan · 04/12/2014 07:29

they have actually said that her specific accusation doesnt matter. because his possible action could be seen to fall under the umbrella of him possibly touching her in a way that they believe may have been sexual.

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flowery · 04/12/2014 07:50

Investigations don't need to take ages, and with CCTV evidence obviously that speeds things up. If there is something he thinks they should have looked at as part of the investigation that was missed, he should mention that.

It sounds as though his best is to explain that it wasn't intentional/sexual in nature, apologise for any distress and argue that dismissal in the light of a previously spotless record (assuming it is) is disproportionately harsh.

Original poster
whentheshithitsthefan · 04/12/2014 08:09

His record it totally clear. Never been an issue.

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KarenHillavoidJimmyswarehouse · 04/12/2014 09:51

Has he seen the CCTV himself? Does he know what incident is being referred to?

You say their evidence is of cctv footage, which they say shows he may have intentionally or unintentionally touched the lady.
so i think that means there is a chance it might also show he may not have intentionally or unintentionally touched her which indicates he doesn't know what was on the CCTV.

Then you say also, the lady says a very specific thing. and the cctv doesnt show it in any way shape or form which indicates he HAS seen the CCTV.

If he hasn't had a chance to respond to the evidence against him (i,.e. the CCTV) then there is a chance he could argue due process hasn't been followed - he may still end up being dismissed though if there is reasonable belief (not irrefutable evidence mind) that Gross Misconduct has taken place.

If he has seen the CCTV, I don't understand why you think "there is a chance it might also show he may not have intentionally or unintentionally..." - surely he can see what it showed? It either showed him touching her or it didn't?

This is a horrible situation for you both. If in the best case scenario for him he was completely exonerated, what then? Would he feel comfortable going back to work? Or should he be thinking of an exit strategy?

Sorry I can completely understand you not wanting to give too many details on an open forum, but it also makes it difficult to understand exactly what has happened and what he should be appealing against.

Original poster
whentheshithitsthefan · 04/12/2014 10:14

Sorry, my anger and loss of sleep has meant I've made no sense!!
He has seen the cctv.
It shows that he did not do what the lady has accused him of doing.
The company have said that.
But.
They have said that he MAY have intentionally or unintentionally done something else.
But they aren't able to say he did.
They think there is a possibility it may have .
He says they are wrong.
He says that it doesn't show him touching her. His companion in the meetings also says it doesn't show him touching the lady

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InfinitySeven · 04/12/2014 10:36

Is your husband sure that he understands? I don't mean that in a derogatory way, but this meetings can be stressful and difficult to follow.

It would appear this his work are saying that, on the balance of probabilities, the CCTV shows that he touched the woman, either intentionally or accidentally.

It would appear that whatever the contact was is so inappropriate that it is a dismissal offence.

It also appears that while the woman made a different allegation, which cannot be backed up by the CCTV, the contact that they can see is enough for them to terminate his employment.

He can appeal, but he'll need to make sure that he understands. If the CCTV does show him touch her, and he appeals saying that he didn't, it won't stand. Does he have any excuse for being so close to the woman that he could accidentally touch her where he did?

Who was his companion? A union member or a friend?

It might be worth checking to see if your home insurance has legal cover, and if it does, if this is covered.

Original poster
whentheshithitsthefan · 04/12/2014 10:40

His reason is that she walked up and put her arm around him.

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