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Original poster

DH has been dismissed for gross misconduct... what next?

127 replies

carrottyjuice · 25/02/2014 21:47

Hi all, I really hope someone can give us some advice. I'm a bit of a nervous wreck at the moment. I've been a SAHM for 11 years, with 3 DCs. Having had my first child very young, I have had little work experience, and all of them in entry-level positions, so don't have a CV to speak of. We've always relied on DH's income, which was decent enough, but today things changed, as during a disciplinary meeting, he was dismissed straight away for gross misconduct.

This was due to an incident where he failed to inform his manager of an issue as well as deliberate falsification of documents to cover up the issue. This was when he was made to work 9 days consecutively without off days, and on that particular day, he worked for 24 hours (yes, 24 hours) and was so knackered at the end of that, that when the issue arose, he chose to falsify records so he could come home to catch some rest.

He admitted all the charges against me and stressed to the hearing that he was overworked and tired when he made the mistake, due to working an extra night, weekend shifts and call outs without overtime pay due to a colleague being on long term sickness. These haphazard working hours have been going on since his colleague went off on sick leave round about a year ago.

They dismissed him today, reason being a breakdown of trust, as he was a supervisor. He's read somewhere that if he is dependant on drugs, they can not sack him but must get him into rehab while allowing him to keep his job. He has been a regular cannabis smoker for the past year since his job shift patterns changed to accomodate his long term sick colleague, because he was so stressed out with all the extra work, he needed help to sleep.

It's not the right thing to do, I know, and he feels really remorseful for the way things have turned out. Not that the cannabis was a main reason why he did what he did, but it could have played a part. He's wondering if he could appeal his dismissal raising the cannabis dependency issue as a reason, and thereby have a shot at keeping his job, while he actually goes looking for a new one? He has not been happy for the past year. Our family life has suffered a lot because he was always on call, doing shift work (when he shouldn't, because his contract states his job hours should really be 9 to 5 Monday to Friday)...

Do you think he has a chance of winning his appeal and keeping his job and getting rehab from the company?

OP posts:
Original poster
carrottyjuice · 27/02/2014 14:36

Nobody wants to be in our situation right now.

OP posts:
Rockchick1984 · 27/02/2014 15:31

Ok, point out to him that life insurance doesn't pay out for suicide, so that wouldn't help in the slightest!

Can you go out and get a job? Presuming from your comment re childcare costs that you're a SAHM. If you get a job you will be eligible for housing benefit and possibly a reduction in council tax, if you are working over 24 hours a week you will get tax credits. Just look for anything, even minimum wage. This way you don't need to worry about JSA sanctions.

You haven't replied about legal cover on your home insurance, but check this as its worth at least investigating if they can help. No win no fee solicitors will only take on cases they are pretty certain to win otherwise they (obviously!) don't get paid, whereas if there is any possibility of your DH having a case then a regular solicitor will get involved.

MinesAPintOfTea · 27/02/2014 15:47

I suggest you both start applying for anything vaguely suitable: neither of you are in a good place to get a job and the second can either stop looking once the first has a job or look for different hours.

He would have a very difficult time forcing his former employer to take him back on, so best to move on unless you want to start getting into blackmailing them by admitting more occasions when he broke the law.

ClaraFox · 27/02/2014 16:30

I think your best bet here is to pour all energies into job searching. Your DH should consider anything vaguely suitable and in the meantime carry on with his current job appeal. If they continue to say they won't take him back then your next course of action should be to ask that they at least consider giving him a reference - even if it's just to state his length of service.

WanderingAway · 27/02/2014 17:14

Wow i never knew that some local authorities only paid housing benefit to unemployed people. What do people on low wages do if they need help paying their rent.

MyCatIsFat · 27/02/2014 17:29

They do pay HB without JSA.

Original poster
carrottyjuice · 27/02/2014 18:14

I see now (didn't see it before!)... thanks for that. So if one of us gets a full time low paid job at least, we'd still get HB and WTC.. so that helps to know. Thank you. Just have to hope one of us gets it before money starts to run out.

OP posts:
Original poster
carrottyjuice · 27/02/2014 18:16

And by the way, DH told me his life insurance does indeed pay out for suicide.

OP posts:
MyCatIsFat · 27/02/2014 18:42

I've just been to CAB. Been told he will be sanctioned for up to 3 years from JSA for being dismissed this way.

It's not for the CAB to decide whether he is sanctioned or for jow long as it's the DWP Decision Maker who determines this on a case-by-case basis.

Very poor advice to have been given by the CAB - I am surprised.

KatieScarlett2833 · 27/02/2014 18:49

You should claim JSA for the family, not him.
JSA is also paid pending a decision on Misconduct so he could claim and get paid now.
Even if he claims and eventually he gets 13 week sanction, he can claim hardship which is JSA minus a percentage, usually 40%, sometimes 20%.
You should also be claiming CTC if you don't already get it.

KatieScarlett2833 · 27/02/2014 18:50

3 year sanction for first offence Misconduct sanction?
13 weeks tops.

Breakage · 27/02/2014 18:51

DH got JSA after being dismissed for gross misconduct - he eventually won his case for unfair dismissal but he was completely upfront when he made his claim for JSA (before the case was brought) and JSA was paid without any fuss.

Similar situation actually, DH did what he was accused of but there were mitigating circumstances in that he was working under ridiculous pressure with insufficient training or support.

KatieScarlett2833 · 27/02/2014 18:52

Should have said if you claim, no sanction at all.

SantasLittleMonkeyButler · 27/02/2014 19:02

I have absolutely nothing to add with regards to your DH's situation BUT for you, when my DH was made redundant a few years ago & I needed to find work fast the best option was Community Care work (if you drive) or care work in a private nursing home if you do not.

It is one job that almost every county in the country has many vacancies for and that requires you to have no previous experience whatsoever. Community Care pays better, but you do have to factor in your car running costs (some companies pay petrol, some don't).

If you want to PM me your rough whereabouts I can find out whether the company I worked for has a branch near to you, if you like. I don't work for them anymore but that is for personal reasons - I did actually like the job!

It may not be your idea of a fun day's work, but it could be a way to pay the rent in the short term.

DraggingDownDownDown · 27/02/2014 19:29

Deep breath. We were in a similar situation over the summer months (for those that remember my Dh and his fucktard comment) we immediately looked to see what we could cut out bill wise.

No sky, no landline phone, credit card - minimum payment only. Increased council tax to over a year and not 10 mths.

MegTheCat · 27/02/2014 20:12

You can apply for hb straight away. You don't have to wait until you find work. Councils should all be followimg the same rules. They can award benefits based on zero income if that's what you're getting. It's hard to prove zero income but you can write a letter to explain your situation and what you are living on. Or they might award pn the basis that ypu've applied for jsa and are waiting to hear. They might not make a decision and pay immediately, but it is harder to get HB backdated if you leave it till later . Check the council website and see if you can apply online.

Original poster
carrottyjuice · 28/02/2014 09:22

DH can't even find the papers for the home insurance policy which he bought from his bank. We were given a solicitor's number to call for advice, but the CAB advisor told us to just go straight to the solicitor's office after seeing her because it was just down the road and we could get advice sooner. We got there but was told that as the government had stopped legal aid, they will no longer give advice in person, and that we must call them for phone advice the next day. So we returned home..
The CAB also helped us make an appointment with their duty solicitor on another day.

There are lots of care homes in our immediate area. In fact, one right next to our flat. I think we'll ask them, but first we will wait for the appeal to go through and see what the outcome is.

OP posts:
Original poster
carrottyjuice · 28/02/2014 09:25

Yes I was told by a lady on the local council's phone helpline that I should apply for HB regardless of whether our claim for JSA has been approved. I'm just worried that if our JSA claim is not approved, we will be denied HB after that and then we'd get no JSA nor HB and would be in exactly the same situation we feared would happen.

OP posts:
FoxyHarlow123 · 28/02/2014 09:42

Giving up his pot habit would be a great first step. What a sorry mess this whole thing is. Both the employers and your husband are culpable here. Their working practices sound really unprofessional and not in line with employment law. However, your husbands method of dealing with it hasn't been great either. His employers are not a charity and do not have to carry someone who believes it ok to act in the manner that he did. Your husband should be presenting himself now for any job opportunity going (bars, restaurants, driving, temping etc), as should you. Good luck. Hope it all works out for you.

iseenodust · 28/02/2014 10:01

"First we will wait for the appeal and see what the outcome is."
OP really? Given all the experience shared above? Why not seek work now? It will distract you from stewing over this every single waking minute and hopefully bring some money in.

flowery · 28/02/2014 10:41

Yes I agree with iseenodust. Can't imagine what sitting and waiting will achieve, when actively going out there looking for work (both of you) might mean there is no major disaster however the appeal goes.

Surely you don't lose anything by applying for HB either, even if you think you might be denied it later.

SolomanDaisy · 28/02/2014 11:00

You have zero income, your DH has admitted something very serious and the appeal outcome seems almost certain. You simply can't afford to wait to start job hunting.

If this was genuinely a frequent practice then he could try threatening them with whistle blowing, but I can't see it helping.

MyCatIsFat · 28/02/2014 11:41

I'm just worried that if our JSA claim is not approved, we will be denied HB after that and then we'd get no JSA nor HB and would be in exactly the same situation we feared would happen.

There is no entitlement link between JSA and HB. You can claim both or either.

You may have a very long wait for an outcome. It would be better to start job-hunting now.

You should also consider making a complaint against the CAB as they have given you very poor assistance by telling you he'd be disbarred from JSA for 3 years and by sending you to a solicitor despite the well-known legal aid changes. Your CAB needs a good shake up

Dinosaursareextinct · 28/02/2014 11:55

You have a lot on your plate - he has already been dismissed, so why not claim for benefits and start job hunt immediately? Making complaints would be some way down my list of priorities at the moment. Many solicitors offer free initial interviews outside of the (now largely defunct) legal aid scheme.

SantasLittleMonkeyButler · 28/02/2014 16:29

I've re-read all the comments to see whether I could add anything helpful. From what I can see;

Your DH has been dismissed.
You are a SAHM.
You have 3 children.
You are not entitled to any more tax credits this year.
You do not think you can claim JSA.
You do not think you can claim HB.
Your DH has a cannabis habit.

It is really not for me to tell you what you should be doing, this is your life not mine. I really can't see how you are going to cover even your basic food & electricity bills though? I appreciate that you must be pinning your hopes on the appeal being successful but, as others have indicated in RL, that is unlikely. In all honesty, two things need to be happening straightaway;

Your DH needs to stop with the cannabis. You cannot afford it now & he is not going to have much luck attending job interviews stinking of pot.

You need to be applying for any work with an immediate start. You can always give the job up if the appeal is successful, or if your DH finds another well paid job - you never know, you might even enjoy it and want to carry on Smile.

Unless there is something you have not told us - savings, alternative income, rich parents etc. I can't see how you're going to manage otherwise?