Isn't this just so insulting?

[OneLieIn]

In a team personal development session when asked to describe the best things about me, my male senior colleague said "she always makes me smile"

As the most senior woman there, I think he absolutely wouldn't have said that to a male colleague.

What do you think?

"Help him keep true"?

He deserves to be shot for that sentence alone

Definitely go with your gut instinct. If he thinks he can walk all over you then he'll continue to do so

"Help keep him true?" shudder OH MY GOD what a COCK

What is the culture of your organisation like?

How do the other men behave? What comments do the other women get?

If he's an anomaly, I would possibly ignore him. If there's a culture of keeping little women in their place which is going to have an impact on your career progression, I guess the choices are to fight back or leave.

Is there someone there who can stick up for you, maybe someone at his level?

mrscumber I think he might be scared...

It is difficult as you always worry that you will be seen as moaning if you address it and it is hard to know if it is conscious or not. I'm afraid I often resort to the passive-aggressive "How nice that I can make you smile even when I'm doing such a challenging role - what a lovely compliment!" (although I do seethe)

Can I just point out though that comments like this are often not intended as we percieve them (is it possible he sees this as some kind of chivalry?) I sometimes get this from our senior partner and yet in conversation with colleagues recently it was said he'd told them how much he respected me and my abilities.

Do you think he feels threatened by you and so puts you down to assert his authority?

Yanbu. At face value it's a nice compliment but I would too hear the undertones that are quite patronising.

I'm a SW. In a huge professionals meeting early on in my career I was told by several people, publicly, that the young person in question would probably work well with me because I was so pretty. The young person was a 14 year old boy. Can you imagine the repercussions if I had been a man with a 14 year old girl??

Sexism for me is a no smoke without fire thing. If you felt it that's what wax implied

fiftyshades you are so right.

He (and a few others) behaved really badly that basically could have got him into real trouble, really inappropriate language, like being in the pub with a bunch of teenagers. (teenagers with more money but not half the fun)

I pulled him up in it the following morning and he phoned me three times that day to apologise and got others to phone me too. He was definitely scared. I think that is definitely still there as he brought it up again as "the leadership intervention of the year"

And

He specifically chose to talk about me not others.

Sorry that was all at an away day earlier in the year. He is scared.

Keep him on his toes then. You have good reason to be unimpressed. He will have seniors that he wants to please as well. Wouldn't do his career any good if it all came out!

Thank you! You have all made me smile

All the men have active nouns (my grammar is shit so hoping someone else comes along and puts me right) - they possess the attributes. Your attribute is pleasing him. You don't have an independent attribute. If he's said your boardroom wit never fails to make me smile, well then very different. I am not saying this right, but I think you need to make it very clear and draw comparisons with the language he used about the men. The incident you describe sounds YUK with them (including boss) behaving like teenagers in a pub splashing cash around - am assuming sexually inappropriate? And bad enough for him to realise how bad it would look relived at an employment tribunal?

that's a brilliant objective analysis Wheezo.

Wheezo, that's interesting... Active nouns. That is a very concrete and definitive way of describing the language.

In a v nice hotel, v sexually inappropriate "she got promoted because she's got big tits, she'll go far" type stuff.

OUCH OneLieIn oh my lord. no wonder he is scared.

I would say to him that this is turning into a pattern of behaviour that you feel a mediation involving HR might help him turn around and ask him if he wants to change that pattern of behaviour. Maybe despite the awful previous behaviour you were hoping it was a one-off drunken damaged male ego/ bragaddacio letting off steam in order to lessen a woman's achievements by equating her career success with the size of her breasts in order to make themselves feel better but following his sober behaviour in front of people regarding your personal performance and capabilities, while not saying you're good because you've got big tits, it is on the continuum of perceiving women as somehow lesser beings in the workplace and objectifying them as objects to please men. (she gets promotions because she has big tits = she does well at work because she makes her boss 'smile').

I'd dress it all up as YOU helping HIM not to fuck up his entire career but you will need HR's help with that (so hopefully it goes on record and when more women complain they will have an easier time in building a case against him). You're not 'reporting' him - but at the moment his behaviour means that he presents a very real legal risk to the company that if it's not you taking him to a tribunal it will be someone else in the near future and he wouldn't want that would he? SO if he wants to save his career he'll accept yours and HR's help.

God how massively depressing for you. I totally see where you are coming from and any one who says it isn't intentional misses the point that this kind of casual but subtle sexism affects the way women are seen in the work place.

I recently went to a kindergarten graduation ceremony (I kid you not but in my defence I don't live in the UK). Each graduating child had a few sentences read out about them. The boys were; energetic, enthusiastic, lively etc. The girls were; accommodating, graceful etc. It made me want to weep. It starts young and carries on into the work place...

wheezo thanks, not sure I have the courage to involve hr. I have the feeling as soon as I do, one of us is in our way out of the business.

This has made me increasingly irate as the day has gone on.

I find it utterly offensive that he talks about you not as a whole person with strengths and weaknesses, but when asked to list one good thing about you, it's about him. Your job isn't to make him smile. Your job is to solve problems, build relationships, have an impact - same as everyone else. If you do that with grace and humour as well as intelligence and gravitas, fine. But he should say that, not 'she makes me smile'. It's like something you'd say about a child.

Add to that the previous background and you having to 'keep him true' - WTF? Is this the 19th century with you as his moral guardian? Bollocks to that.

He may be senior to you but he needs telling. His comment diminished you. Not to mention made him look like the dick he clearly is.

tribpot wow, that's exactly how I feel. I have stewed on this and the longer I consider the more cross I get. Now I am a bit more relaxed (red wine yeah) but I am pretty close to packing in.

Thing is the cumulative effect is so demeaning. Since being at the firm I have been told "I need a wife" that "the primary caregiver (ie me) cant work" "that I will never make a director if part time"

It's demoralising and quite tiring

Well, I'm sober OneLieIn (I'm always sober!) so let me be your sober self for tonight :)

The comment is symptomatic of a much more serious problem. You can look at it in a number of different ways; you don't have to decide tonight.

I think option 1 is go nuclear and take his sorry arse to the cleaners. He should be reprimanded for his behaviour and a message should be sent to the other men who condone or ape it that it is not acceptable. Except the main loser in that will be you, because you'll be the whistle-blower and perpetually on the outside thereafter.

Option 2, at the opposite extreme, is to leave. Rome wasn't built in a day and the playing field won't be levelled in one either. Bit by bit, this kind of attitude will be broken down; you get to decide how much of a role you play in achieving that, and how much you hand on to the women who come after you. That's not a defeat, but it's a tactical withdrawal.

Option 3 is to speak to him again about his conduct. It may not actually be intended to be patronising and dickish, but caused by lazy thinking, assumptions and unfamiliarity with the concept of women as people. I think you can make the point that there's a pattern of behaviour that needs sorting out - it isn't your job to have to keep coming and pointing out how excluded his behaviour makes you feel.

Personally, and I'm in in a kamikaze mood about my own career, I'd leave and then take the fucker to town. But that kind of attitude is why I took leave (without authorisation) this morning, to prevent me going nuclear in the office. Can you take a few days out to think it through?

trib I have sent a note to the HR person I trust a lot asking her who I can talk to for guidance and help with this. The note on the end says this isn't a formal HR issue but a request for guidance and help. This puts it on their radar. I trust her and I need help. I can't take this on alone.

And it's not just him.

And I have only had one glass of wine

Yes, I didn't think you were completely trolleyed :)

The only note of caution I would sound about talking to HR is they may feel a duty to raise something even if you don't want them to. I'd clear that up before you do tell your HR person anything.

Keep your chin up - this sounds like a shitty situation but whatever path you take it won't defeat you unless you give in to their attitude and accept you are somehow less worthy than they are. Wankers.

I haven't said anything really in the email... Just there have been comments made I have found demeaning / upsetting / annoying and asking who I can talk to to help me through this.

I can't and won't name names. I just want someone to talk the scenarios through with on how I can tackle this. Do I become a hard liner? How do I handle it when in a situation where me challenging will cause more grief. What I want is to resolve it with the least fuss possible.

What I want is to resolve it with the least fuss possible.

Unfortunately I doubt this is a realistic aim. They also want to resolve it with the least fuss possible, which consists of you shutting up and putting up. Realistically, if you want to take a stand, you will have to be prepared to be challenging.