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Original poster

Suspension from work - part 2

436 replies

applecrumbleandcream · 12/04/2012 17:51

Thanks everyone, just catching up. Not feeling too good today. A bit grim. Not feeling strong at all but emotional and very sad. Been to the doctors again and just broke down completely, he wants to sign me off but I told him that I just want to get all this over with. He has wrote me a statement whilst I was there blubbering for me to send to the Investigator to say that I am not currently well enough to complete this work. I even had the doctor crying and saying he despairs that employers are doing this. I told him I have got no confidence in the unison rep. I spoke to him this morning to ask his advice about filling in this statement when it doesn't list my computer and what should I do, he was very sharp said if I don't do as I am asked then it is going to go to a Hearing and then said he was in a meeting and just cut me off!!!

My dad has said he will get me the best lawyer there is and forget about Unison, just wondering what to do about this. Have to go back to doctors again next Thursday. He is compiling a proper medical statement for me.

I'm sorry if none of this makes sense, but I can't think straight at the moment. Sad

OP posts:
zebrafinch · 23/05/2012 06:50

apple did you download the free publication from the London Law Centre "Facing disciplinary action a guide from employees....". I cannot link but you can find it a www.londonlawcentre.org.uk. It does not replace legal advice from your solicitor but gives good advice to employees for before during and after the disciplinary hearing.
Mainly above gives some good advice. You have to sit down hopefully with a friend helping you and write down all the evidence which you have against each of the allegations which have been made. Can any staff member provide a witness statement in support of some of the facts that are in dispute?

you mentioned your mother had an accident/been ill? discuss with your solicitor whether there are any grounds for discrimination against you because you are a Carer??? Could there be anything about you that underlies the behaviour of the staff member towards you???
How organised is your paperwork?? get a lever arch file , put your letters emails, meeting reports, evidence etc. in a logical format with separators along wth staff policy documents on disciplinary action and procedures. Do a separate sheet listing the relevant dates and events. This will help you when you discuss your case with your solicitor especially if you are stressed.

zebrafinch · 23/05/2012 13:55

Include in your lever arch file any staff policy documents, emails, memos on Internet usage and flexitime.
Apple, have confidence that you can do this. Spend an allocated amount of time each day on getting organised and preparing your defence to each specific allegation. Try to treat it as a work project and then spend the rest of the day doing some activities which hopefully can take your mind of all this. Go for a swim or a walk. Take care of yourself.

zebrafinch · 23/05/2012 13:58

apologies just re read my post above. The publication Is a Guide FOR employees not from. Download it.

Nyac · 23/05/2012 14:10

Just seen your latest post Apple. I was thinking "workplace bullying" just as I was reading through your thread, and now it turns out that a colleague and your manager have been conspiring against you.

I don't know if anybody has mentioned it, but this is quite a good resource on workplace bullying:

www.bullyonline.org/workbully/index.htm

And if you haven't already, you do need to talk to a good employment lawyer. This is appalling treatment of you.

Best wishes to you.

Nyac · 23/05/2012 14:16

As other people have said too, it is important that you now lodge a grievance about their treatment of you. If this goes to tribunal it will show that you've gone through the process correctly in objecting to their behaviour.

klaxon · 23/05/2012 14:22

Wow! What a heinous bitch your colleague is! Is there not a house we can drop on her head? Shock

I think the outcome is pretty inevitable now - perhaps you should start working on what you will do after the fire you (other than have a good cry). Onwards Apple, you are better than this!

BerylStreep · 23/05/2012 16:45

But Klaxon, is it inevitable? Surely we (and apple) need to have faith that somebody in the discipline hearing will see this for what it is? That's why apple needs to go through all the allegations in a logical manner to show how unreliable all this 'evidence' is and to show that she is an honest, hard-working individual who has been subject to malicious allegations, harassment and bullying.

Assuming she wins her disciplinary hearing, I wouldn't be too quick to automatically assume that it is impossible to continue working for the LA. Sure, she could never work with that colleague again, or her manager, but in an ideal world they themselves will be facing investigation once she lodges a grievance, and may not be with the LA for much longer themselves. She may surprised as to how supportive the rest of her colleagues and other managers are.

Perhaps apple could get a new role elsewhere in the organisation? I think with jobs thin on the ground, she needs to keep her options open.

It may sound naive, but I think apple needs to fight this as best she can in the hope that someone will see sense.

As an aside, my experience is that part-time workers' timekeeping is always subject to more scrutiny. I wonder how many other people apple's colleague has been keeping tabs on?

klaxon · 23/05/2012 18:07

Beryl - on present information, I'm not sure that anyone in the investigation WILL be fair. The problem is that once someone is assumed by the majority to be 'a bad 'un' evidence will be found to fit and they'll get her on a technicality which, if they didn't want her out, would just be ignored. :(

I'm sorry to sound negative but I'd be planning for the future and saying 'okay it's shit but here we are, where do I go from here'.

mirry2 · 23/05/2012 18:20

But the op needs to believe she will win and fight for all it's worth because it wil affect her prospects of getting another job to have a dismissal on her CV.

Sge is going to have to fight this all the way to an independent tribunal if necessary so it's important that she starts the grievance procedure now, with a very justified complaint of bullying.

zebrafinch · 23/05/2012 18:42

Apple whilst this might look like a stitch up you have to fight it in a detailed almost clinical way. I agree with Beryl above. Jobs are hard to come by. I knew of someone working for a public body who was suspended fighting very serious allegations and facing dismissal. With the proper preparation, detailed evidence gathering and documentation , every single one of the serious allegations against him by another staff member were found unproven during the disciplinary meeting. The other staff member was shifted to a different building and the the accused kept his job, his pension and his dignity. Please dont be hard on yourself apple all the decent people at work will be rooting for you and thinking there but for the grace of God go I. Hold your head up high apple.

I should add however that the accused was helped by a very good union rep which unfortuntely you seem to be lacking.

Catkinsthecatinthehat · 23/05/2012 19:07

A lot of the sites you are wrongly accused of accessing are ones which need personal accounts - banking, facebook, gambling etc. Is there a way of showing that the accounts aren't yours? Password info won't be retained but the cookies on the computer might have some other evidence.

eg. I bank with Lloyds. If I go to their login page from my usual computer my account number is already there, I just have to put in my password. A discussion forum I use welcomes me back with my username, and again I just have to put in the password.

Jux · 23/05/2012 20:15

I have no expertise, but I think - if you can face it - that you should fight for all you're worth.

I was constructively dismissed years and years ago, because I was really ill and it was potentially a long-term, in fact lifelong, condition, and my employers knew it, and didn't want me. I was going to fight it but got exhausted so quickly that I just gave up and handed in my notice; it was just easier.

Indeed, it is a lifelong condition and yes, I would have stayed working there on my nice salary for as long as I could, and they'd have moved me sideways, but that salary would have made a heck of a lot of difference to me over the next few years, and the pension, and the early retirement they'd have got rid of me with or the redundancy.

Instead, they gave me cash payment and a month's salary (which they didn't actually have to do).

Yes, I regret it.

Fight them, op, you know you're innocent, and they're swaggering at you like the playground bullies they are.

MainlyMaynie · 24/05/2012 08:04

I wouldn't be too pessimistic about no one questioning the evidence at the hearing. It will be someone not involved in the situation chairing the panel and if that was me and the start of the evidence was a malicious colleague's records I would not begin with a good impression of the case. Disciplinary hearings like this are not uncommon in LAs and often don't lead to dismissal. Apple does need to get someone to sit down and help her sift logically through the evidence though, hopefully the employment lawyer will be able to help with this.

If there are days when she has accidentally recorded herself as being in work when she wasn't, due to the upset of her Mum's illness, then this is where she really needs specialist advice. Regardless of the utter nonsense that the rest of the evidence is, the hearing would have to take this seriously unless they are given good reason not to.

tinkcantwaittomove · 24/05/2012 14:00

thinking of u stay strong xx

eurochick · 24/05/2012 14:14

Hey apple. I followed your earlier thread. I didn't realise there was a second one. I'm glad you have decided to engage a solicitor. They will be able to advise you behind the scenes for now, even if they can't come to the disciplinary hearing with you. If you get a good one, this help will be invaluable.

Please keep your chin up and get this nasty bully put back in her box!

CheeseandPickledOnion · 24/05/2012 15:57

Hope you're ok Apple.

TheUnsinkableTitanic · 26/05/2012 07:36

oohh apple, i have nothing constructive to add, but just to let you know i am thinking about you

saintlyjimjams · 27/05/2012 09:16

Y, y to putting in a grievance about bullying.

KittieCat · 27/05/2012 22:09

Hi apple I've been checking in regularly and really hoping things improve for you. It WILL get better, look after yourself and I hope there is better news soon. Got everything crossed, hope you feel stronger soon.

MummyPocPoc · 28/05/2012 21:54

Hi Apple,

I worked for a LA a couple of years ago, and they had a clear internet usage policy which allowed 20 minutes a day internet usage for personal use. This was in addition to any net use required for doing your job.

Please check this is the case with your employer, so if you have had any reasonable use of the net you can defend it as it is allowed.

Good luck btw, I check this thread regularly. Appalling story, and your colleague is a bunny boiling evil cow - I really hope the pendulum swings to shine the light on her evil doings, and she gets booted Grin

Putthatbookdown · 28/05/2012 22:28

I would still have a good lawyer in the background IF YOU WANT TO KEEP YOUR CAREER. Employers are obliged to think not only of themselves but also how their behaviour impacts on your FUTURE career. With bullying (and especially so with harrassment ) it is known that people are sometimes so disappinted that they leave the field altogether. I am NOT saying this WILL happen to you and I hope it will not but it is ONE factor. It is important for YOU and your future. Another factor and more likely is that claims for bullying attract UNLIMITED DAMAGES so a lawyer will be vital later. Meanwhile you must exhaust all internal procedures (without a lawyer ) Also if any corruption is going on you have a duty to report it . This is possiblysomething to have up your sleeve-are there whistle-blowing procedures ?

DogEared · 28/05/2012 22:40

I think the fact that they've stated such bloody ridiculous websites that you've never visited is a good think. You can prove you don't bank with Lloyds TSB (or whoever they said): You can bring in bank statements to prove you never deposited money to online bingo.
Thinking of you a lot... Remember you have a mumsnet army behind you here...

Bearcat · 29/05/2012 06:57

Hi apple
I'm exactly same position as you now and having to prepare for disciplinaryShock
Found out a week ago after 8 months of suspension.
Sleeping is difficult. Eating is very difficult (never thought I'd be one to say that, and have lost half a stone in a week).
My everyday is consumed with the injustice of it all, I was a whistle blower.
I haven't watched TV, listened to the radio or read a paper for a week. I only look at MN for 10 minutes going to bed, and am doing this whilst DH in shower. I have no idea what is going on in the outside world (except that Harlequins won the Aviva Premiership trophyGrinand I was there, but even then my mind was wandering.)
I am working all day until 11pm at night trying to pick apart the evidence against me, even with evidence my employer had in their file that certain things have not happened (incompetence).
I am starting to feel slightly calmer, the more work I am doing in forensically trying to take this case against me apart, but will be unable to settle again until I have done this.
DH as usual being fantastic, going to work and then working on my defence until midnight or 1am.
I am not doing this for my job (how can I no longer care about a job and career that Ioved?) but for my reputation and to try and see that justice just might prevail (but I'm not holding my breath).
Sorry to hijack your thread again apple, but just wanted to say again you are not alone.
Got tears running down face now. Good job DH down stairs!
Rebecca Brooks (Leverson inquiry - or is it enquiry?) is my hero now. I want to be as strong as she looked there, and outside court after she had been charged. I try and think of her in my flakier moments, and hope I can maintain that composure in my disciplinary (as I did manage to in fact in my investigation meeting).
Lots of hugs to you apple. I'm sure we're not alone.
Got to get up and get working now.
X

Princesslovelyboo · 29/05/2012 18:17

Hi apple Just another good luck hows it going post from me.

PreviouslyonLost · 29/05/2012 21:09

Long time lurker on this thread...Bearcat and apple, I am (just) on the other side of a possible disciplinary matter. apple sounds like an Industrial Tribunal is the way to go...you have been treated appallingly.

Bearcat...cannot imagine 8 months of such torture, though know of a colleague who endured a year of similar injustice (and who is now back at work, but very bitter) Wish you both the very best of luck to come through this difficult time.