On the subject of apperance/being good-looking

[SolidGoldBrass]

Some people are basically better to look at than others. This is kind of a genetic accident just the same as being very clever, or very athletic.
I'm not suggesting BTW that there is any kind of absolute standard of good looks, what is regarded as a really good-looking appearance is culturally influenced, but whether what is preferred is height, thinness, fatness, light skin, dark skin, big earlobes or a sticky-out navel, these are things that some people are just born with, the same as a really powerful ability to calculate numbers, run fast or sing with perfect pitch. We can all improve to an extent on what we are born with by exercising, studying - or by the use of cosmetics, clothing etc - so what I'm wondering is whether it's maybe misguided to consider it 'unfeminist' to either pay attention to one's looks beyond the basics of being clean and tidy, or to condemn people who are 'good looking' for regarding their good looks as a workable asset in the same way that a person who is clever or musically talented or good at sports would do?

I think it's natural to make the most of yourself. We don't expect witty clever people to hide their light under a bushel, so why expect the bonny to downplay their attributes?

At the end of the day we all work eith what we've got, and brains and wit last much longer, so those who have them get the last laugh and needn't whinge in the grand scheme of things.

I don't know about "unfeminist" because men can preen too.

Ther'es a difference between scrubbing up well, and using your sexuality / appearance to get you something.

Subsconsciously, I think we equate looking good with health and cleanliness.

Dittany: What I was thinking about is something I read about 'good looking people' being more likeable/successful and the fact that there is a genetic component to really good looks irrespective of gender. Which is why I was using the term 'good looking' rather than 'pretty' or 'beautiful' or 'handsome'.
I was also partly thinking of the election and the fact that Nick Clegg is a lot more 'good looking' than either Gordon Brown or David Cameron. (Quite apart from the fact that to many people Clegg's policies are more appealing than Brown's or Cameron's).

'Good looking' and 'Looking Good' are 2 different things tho.
So Mammy reckons that I need to buy the right clothes to work in an office and get on in life ie. Looking Good. And tbh I think she is right and I realy dont want to buy into all that crap so I'll continue to wear what I do to work regardless of promotion.
OTH me in cycling shorts/tights and a baggy t-shirt seems to be 'good looking' to a lots of men according to the comments I've got (gratifing but personally I think they need glasses) so am not sure men are quite buying into all the media hype myself.

What Dittany said

Is it in our nature to want to be good looking? Would good looking women have been chosen first by alpha males by early man?

It's true you don't have to buy into pressure to conform. But the number of ads geared towards men to "improve" their appearance is not comparable.

Most of the men in adverts for aftershave etc are slim, toned, tall. They may show older men but they are very well preserved.

Natural selection isn't it cornsilk?

There is a biolgical basis to the 'good-looking' stuff.

Facial symmetry is seen to equate with good healthy genes, and the artifice of things like lipstick allude to sexually aroused genitals, high heels draw attention to the swing of the hips (an indicator of child-bearing ability) etc. Likewise in a man, shoulder pads in a suit exaggerate his masculine proportions.

We are programmed to find these things attractive- it is not all culturally-conditioned oppression.

Nancysgarden - I don't know but it would have been at one time.

I have heard and read the same Topsy. Why are women like Kate Moss so lusted after then?

It's not on every corner but it's very much there especially if you watch commercial TV, travel on the tube or buy any women's mags etc.

It used to depress the hell out of me, but I have wonderful girlfriends who are like-minded.

I personally wouldn't go for a man who wasn't attractive, as I think that ugly men may have been shit upon by more attractive women and become bitter.

Nice looking men tend to be nicer people. In my opinion.

My DH is lovely so I'm not actively judging men, but when dd1 is older I will have a word.