Are you tired of winning?

[FlakyRobin]

Councils aren’t going for the ‘guidance’ and it is routinely ignored by trans people. When do you expect something to change?

Thats because the guidance hasnt changed anything.

Men have always been excluded from womens spaces, and risk being told to leave.

I don’t think that’s true at all. Didn’t the previous guidance say the exact opposite?

I just don’t think you should expect to always get what you want.

Straight up snort laughed at this. We're seeing innumerable men having full on tantrums at finally being told no and they're still saying 'we're going to do what we want - you can't stop us'.

Have some self awareness for pity's sake.

So TW who use the men's are self hating / degrading.

Arent the TW muscling in to the women's facilities degrading those women?

Or does it not work like that for reasons women's feelings don't matter ?

No trans person using the spaces for their gender is breaking the law.

Yet. Watch this space.

Do you not understand that the legislation supersedes the guidance and that the Equality Act has not changed?

Its really not very complicated.

That providers couldnt exclude males from womens single sex spaces?

Isn’t that just particularly horrible to someone like me who is a violent rape survivor.

I met one who did, right up until I contradicted something he said (that's TIM and passed, for those who have forgotten what your inane post said). Then the male privilege came to the fore, he started spouting the script, and eventually accused me of having said something really stupid that I would never say. (Clearly not all transwomen are rapists; a very small proportion of them have had their todgers lopped and are therefore incapable of rape in this country.) It seems there is never any need to out these twerps: they can't resist outing themselves.

They are going to be sharing spaces with men in e.g. Lambeth because, per the announcement, the facilities are all mixed.

Yes. The entitlement of these men in their determination to invade single sex spaces is particularly callous to those women who have experienced trauma. It's why their colonisation of rape crisis services enrages me so much.

The previous guidance was found to be unlawful.

It is pointless to create legislation that allows spaces to be single sex if it would be reasonable to object to the presence of somebody of the opposite sex, if it is impossible to object to the presence of somebody of the opposite sex.

What do you think the signs on the door are for? Decoration?

Agree.

They are completely stuffed then - because where-ever they go a man will be there! They can not but share a space with a man even when alone!

There is a deep deep irony and yet also horribly abusive notion in saying that they as men can't be with men because it is dangerous for men and women to be together - and that the answer is for them as men to force themselves on women in women's spaces... it is blatant hypocrisy and a total disregard for the safety of women...

There is no issue with men who pretend to be women using men's spaces - still waiting for all the evidence of why it is unsafe / the statistics that show men dressed up as women being abused in the gents...

as a bloke, I see no issue - you can have a man in a skirt come into the gents - go and pee and leave, and no-one will care...

and I am yet to see a 'trans woman' who isn't obviously male... they walk like men - they have all the characteristics of the stereotype they think makes them a woman etc.

fortunately the child has observed that the emperor has no clothes and more and more people are exiting their delusion... we all know that a man is always a man and can never be a woman - so we will increasingly move back to respect for women and stopping the drive to abuse them and their space.

Sounds remarkably like "what's mine is mine, and what's yours is mine".

Oh, the irony.

And what about the dignity, privacy and safety of women? That’s BIOLOGICAL women. You know, actual women, not a man in a dress?

If they want gender neutral spaces where there currently aren't any, they can campaign for them, the same way women had to - did you know women not only had to die for the right to have public toilets, men burned them down when they were finally built?

Can you cite any instances of trans identified men being attacked in the men's toilets? In the UK please. Especially in work places if you can.

If you're interested - this isn't just about toilets, and it's hugely privileged to be able to focus on that. How about - women in prisons? Women on hospital wards? But - why does a trans identified man get more protections than say, a disabled man? A teenage boy? Any other vulnerable man or boy?

Women deserve spaces away from men. And while it might be kind to pretend that trans identified men are women, they aren't. They are men, and the fact that they are totally happy to say "tough tits" to women who say no to them really just proudly displays how male they are.

And girls. Let's not forget that these are adult men telling us that they are going to use the same facilities as young girls.

Dunno about tired of winning, but I'm certainly getting tired of these selfish men whining!

If that is the case then it should also apply to trans people.
Some things won’t be possible for them and their expectations need to be adjusted accordingly.

If they want gender neutral spaces where there currently aren't any, they can campaign for them

it's not as though there hasn't been plenty of time to do this.

Even if there were confusion before 2022, the judgement then made it clear that the vast majority of people who identify as trans but do not have a GRC are legally regarded as their biological sex. It has never been likely that this would change. The 2025 judgement only clarified the situation regarding the minority with GRCs.

Even now, instead of getting to grips with what the law says or proposing alternative legislation activists are just relying on magical thinking.

And trans-identifying men who continue to do that that leave no one in any doubt that they are a misogynist who can’t be trusted. Trans-identifying men say they don’t like to be assessed in that way, and there is a very easy way for them to avoid that assessment. 🤷🏼‍♀️

”You shouldn’t expect to always get what you want” only applies to women, as the men saying it carry on in full expectation of getting everything they want. Because men are entitled to get what they want, right?

@FlakyRobin please can you direct me to the verifiable incidents where transwomen have been unsafe in toilets in the uk? UK court reports or coroner reports would be of use as that is the type of evidence I use rather than anecdotes.

Where transwomen have said they are unsafe it has been in the women’s toilets. I have been researching uk toilet safety for several years. The incidents of verbal abuse and physical abuse I have are unverified incidents of transwomen being shouted at then, in one case, two women pushed the transwoman out of the women’s toilet. No doubt that is distressing for all concerned.

However I do have incidents of transwomen assaulting women and girls, including verified convictions of men who say they are transwomen for the duration of being in the women’s toilets.

I have also collated many incidents of safety breaches around the U.K. involving both sexes. From this evidence, I know single sex designs are safer for everyone.

However, if transwomen are to use the women’s or vice versa, all designs have to become universal. Ironically (especially in England) they could look very similar (except different sanitary bin) but still would have to be designated male and female by a different pictogram on the door. Meanwhile individual privacy would be increased but Health and Safety, in real terms, would be reduced for everyone.

Why not be kind, and use the correct sex toilet so safer single sex designs are there for people who are the most vulnerable?

@iwishitwouldstartraining Lambeth may want all toilets to be mixed sex but they can’t be unless they break building regulations, British Standards, legislation, and HSE and BSR guidance. There’s a problem with urinals too and the Sexual Offences Act (2003). It won’t happen.