"Love is Love" T-shirt by Stonewall and S&M (yes, really)

[BridgetPhillipsonIsACowardlyJobsworth]

One of Stonewall's contributions to the innocuous "Pride Month":

https://www.stonewall.org.uk/news/stonewall-launches-range-of-collabs-to-mark-pride-month

Stonewall has partnered with three top designers and a renowned comic publisher to create a range of merchandise to mark this year’s Pride month. All profits to go to supporting its purpose of creating a safe and equal world where all LGBTQ+ people can live, work and thrive.

The House of Kind “We Are All Equals™️” tee, created in collaboration with Single Swan, is designed to symbolise unity and allyship and features an embroidered equals sign and love heart as a reminder that all deserve to be treated fairly and equally. [My bold. I'd like to believe they meant this].

Oh, dear, one of their "collabs" is a brand called Scotty & Mirko (S&M - I kid you not!) with a T-shirt that says "Love is Love."
https://shop.stonewall.org.uk/collections/scotty-mirko-x-stonewall

Do they really not know anything about history, or are they just hoping we won't notice?

I know I don’t have to read threads but I actually enjoy them. I do agree with a lot of what’s on them but I find the hard line and lack of nuance surprising and enjoy having a good debate about it. I’m totally happy to be proved wrong when presented with actual facts and evidence…. I’m autistic so I am always looking for the truth/fairness (this is Big for a lot of autistic people).

I’ll have a look for the thread you are talking about and post it here if I find it - thank you for telling me.

I always think very logically and analytically and have been doubting that PIE used the love is love slogan for the reason you state above - I would think the Stonewall marketing people would want to steer very clear of paedophilia associations. Obviously I could be wrong.

The sort of nonsense ‘facts’ I have seen on here recently is that trans people pretend they are autistic, have ME/CFS, lupus, ADHD and a whole load of other health problems. It might be true but I doubt it. It sounded more like prejudice to me. Also, I cannot understand why that wasn’t deleted because I don’t see the difference between that and accusing people of a particular race of doing that.

I do agree with a lot of what’s on them but I find the hard line and lack of nuance surprising and enjoy having a good debate about it. I’m totally happy to be proved wrong when presented with actual facts and evidence…. I’m autistic so I am always looking for the truth/fairness (this is Big for a lot of autistic people)

What 'lack of nuance' are you finding hard as an autistic person?

Men are not women.

Women have sex based rights.

These are facts and the rights were hard won by our great grandmothers.

The sort of nonsense ‘facts’ I have seen on here recently is that trans people pretend they are autistic, have ME/CFS, lupus, ADHD and a whole load of other health problems

They pretend to have autism or it was shown in the GIDS investigations that many of them DO HAVE autism? It was shown that many people who say they are the opposite sex DO HAVE comorbidities.

I’m autistic so I am always looking for the truth/fairness

and

The sort of nonsense ‘facts’ I have seen on here recently is that trans people pretend they are autistic, have ME/CFS, lupus, ADHD and a whole load of other health problems. It might be true but I doubt it.

Interesting. So, clearly, your facts are more factual than other people's facts. I wonder how that works out for you in real life?

I find the hard line and lack of nuance surprising

And, yet, here you are, perpetuating them.

Give me a link to some robust evidence that says trans people like pretending they have all sorts of illnesses and neurodivergence and I will take it on board. It sounds more likely to be prejudice IMHO but I did acknowledge above that it might be true.

I saw 3 tweets just this morning by people who say they are the opposite sex, saying that men who think they are women have periods. And that the 'menstrual cycle' is not 'periods'. Whatever that is supposed to mean for men.

Baffling!

What is baffling to you?

As someone with autism it might help if you explained why you are baffled.

This literally is the issue, these people are completely deluded to varying degrees. From the 'I'm the tru trans, the rest are just fakers' to those men that freeze tinned tomatoes and allegedly stick them up their arseholes or film themselves writing around in 'pain' on their 'periods'.

men have periods. I think I am thinking thr same a you?

Sorry, full sentences would be grand if you are trying to make a point.

Men have periods.

No men do not have periods.

I do not know what you are thinking about men pretending to have periods.

I find the hard line and lack of nuance surprising

And, yet, here you are again with the "hard line" and "lack of nuance" - are you the only one who gets to do this?

You have missed my point by miles.

You say that you are autistic, and we are supposed to believe you implicitly just because you say so.

At the same, we're not supposed to doubt anyone else who says they are... whatever they claim to be.

That's not how things work online, I'm afraid, and there are posters on this forum who post lies every day just because they can. So, my default is that I don't trust what anyone says without evidence, unless I've seen them produce evidence before, and I'm afraid that's just the way it is with me.

How about you provide evidence that you are autistic, then I'll consider what you have claimed about everyone else?

I think you are being very unfair to say I am being hardline. I acknowledged right from the start that it might be true.

Asking a poster to produce some evidence for a claim that is not widely-known knowledge is totally normal online, especially in a case like this where the comment was rather derogatory to a small group of people. Misinformation online is like water dripping on any stone - it can be dangerous.

Obviously the poster does not have to provide any further information, but then they should also not be surprised if many people don’t believe them.

So I wouldn’t for example expect somebody who says that climate change exists to provide evidence because it is literally all over the news all tbe time but if they start making claims about particular details of climate change then in my view they should be prepared to back it up when questioned.

It is up to you whether you believe me or not that I am autistic but for obvious reasons, I am not going to prove it by posting my diagnostic report from my psychiatrist. It is not a fair comment to suggest I provide my personal medical evidence and cannot be compared with me asking others to provide non-personalized info.

Fair point! It was a bit unclear. Men don’t have periods, obviously.

Ok, we'll have to agree to disagree then.

Took one for the team, can't find any documented link.

Some people just want to see pedopholia and similar things everywhere. I think it says more about them to be honest.

Okay <shrugs>
If it's not on the Internet or ChatGPT, it didn't happen

It's certainly unusual for it not to have been documented and is also unfair/odd to expect everyone to make the association when we're talking over 40-50 years ago. So most people remembering it first hands are doing to be 60+.

Maybe it happened. But for the majority of people, certainly people below 50, love is love has nothing to do with pedopholia and it feels like just another go at linking lgbtq issues with pedophilia and illegality.

Firstly, no one is expecting everyone to make an association.

Secondly, no one is having another go at linking LGBTQ issues with p*dophilia and illegality.

The point is: for some people - yes, mainly oldies - the term has a connection with some murky groups and campaigns from the 1970s.

For far more people around the world, it is a happy, positive slogan associated with LGBQT. And as I already said upthread, that's a good thing. Wear the T-shirt!

It’s hardly “inclusive” is it?

Turns out I was wrong and it’s part of Stonewall’s branding. So not specific to this campaign.

Not sure I can get too worked up about the phallic association of arrows given how much they are used to simply indicate forward motion. But it does add to the whole lesbians thoroughly ignored by the gay rights and Pride narrative- which I think has lots of merit.