Be Kind 2.0 and the "Persuasive TRA"

[BridgetPhillipsonIsACowardlyJobsworth]

This is a spinoff from another thread so as not to derail the original.

I thought it would be helpful to have a separate thread to discuss, and document, a phenomenon I have been seeing more regularly recently: the Persuasive TRA.

It occurred to me, after a few posters noted that the recent U-turns by a couple of politicians, and the wheedling TRA responses to the EHRC guidance, were akin to an abuser changing tactics and also asking us to "help" them in the new single-sex regime, that the whole thing is starting to pan out exactly as an abusive relationship often does. When is the most dangerous time for a woman in an abusive relationship? Normally, when she is leaving.

Well, women are leaving the abusive relationship with non-reality that men forced upon us some 15 years ago, and I would argue that now might be our most dangerous/difficult moment.

This is what I posted on the other thread:

I'm starting to see a bit more of what I am calling (in my own head) "Persuasive TRA." Now that they have lost everything that they bullied women for, some activists seem to be changing tack. Women must now fix the situation that TRAs have found themselves in. It seems to pivot on a sort of Be Kind 2.0.

I think women who have been in the game long enough will see through it, but we should be watchful. Stonewall is pivoting, activists are pivoting, and they will be preying on women's socialized kindness: watch for the destination and be on your guard.

I have read several posters on different threads appealing to everyone (women) to help calm trans-identified people's (men's) fears about what this new reality will look like, what it will mean for them (the men) now that they can't just do whatever they want anymore. What about the men's toilets? Are they safe? Where will they go? (Who will fix this problem?)

Well, apparently it is a problem that women can fix, if they just take a moment to think about it. Trans-identified men will be unsafe in the men's, so women need to join the fight to give these men something of their own.

Notice the pivot? The pleading? If you just... If you weren't so.... It can be different if you just... Sound familiar? To any woman who is in, or has escaped from, an abusive relationship, this will be all too familiar.

This is Be Kind 2.0. It's very similar to the original, except that instead of being forced to enjoy our abuse, we are being asked to fix it. And the "Persuasive TRAs" seem to be mobilizing, from what I have seen.

It won't start in the middle (with the women); it will start at the top (infiltrating government, think tanks, charities, etc.) and the bottom (schools). But they will use women to get this moving. Why not? It worked so well last time. And I believe that organizations like Stonewall will be leading the charge: the campaign can be something like Safe Spaces for Trans+ : All of Us Together.

If anyone else has seen this in action, it might be useful to keep a record of it here.

I imagine this thread will eventually be taken over by activists, but, until then, I would be interested in your thoughts.

If I’m called Sam or Chris I guess I don’t have a sex?

Also, I didn't get a utility bill in my own name until I was 25, university then shared houses and all that, was I not living as a woman during that time?

An ex colleague pretty much tried that re her email signature, having no photo on the website or departmental board. Obviously it was clear to us all and her students in person, but otherwise she preferred not to. She was often assumed to be male over email if people hadn't met her.

Not because she was non binary but because some man, presumably a cleaner, had wanked in her desk drawer and left the evidence.

So she preferred not to advertise herself as a woman where possible.

Your handy activist handbook summary.

Periodic Summary 2 - The "Persuasive TRA"

The Word Salad tactic (really, a Classic):
"No, those aren't really problems or uncomfortable facts - if you were as clever as me you'd know that.'

The "it's segregation" tactic (especially relating to the EHRC guidance and the EA)

The "it's unworkable" tactic (especially relating to the EHRC guidance and the EA)

The guilt-tripping women into not complaining tactic (especially relating to the EHRC guidance and the EA)

The use of data to 'prove' there wasn't a problem tactic (when they refused to allow the collection of data in the first place, e.g. recording "gender" instead of "sex")

The "it's part of a right wing plot to distract us all from... (defunded public services)" tactic

The delay changes, obfuscate, plead confusion, argue that it's too difficult, etc., tactic (currently being used in some charitable circles)

The inappropriate literature tactic (using transactivist 'literature" designed to normalise sex change, gender identity and the erosion of boundaries to children) - this one is not new, but ongoing, but is subterfuge, and links to activists in schools

The Rapid Onset Women with Alopecia, Cancer Survivors and Butch Lesbians Concern (or Rapid Onset Everyday-looking Women Concern) tactic: women who look "like men" will be challenged in women's toilets and changing rooms

The Tiny Number tactic (shifting seamlessly from toilets to opportunities: 'it's just a tiny minority (of boys and men taking sporting opportunities, scholarships, funding, awards, places on teams and endangering others) so why worry?')

The Criminal Gender tactic (akin to Rapist Gender but broadening out now to include "everyone we don't think should be included as true trans because we really don't like the optics.")

and previous summary:

Periodic Summary 1 - The "Persuasive TRA"
possible activist tactics to try to remove rights from women and girls
(many are as old as Time, but some new ones seem to be creeping in):

mirroring
wearing our arguments
wearing our history
'gender policing' - re toilets, esp. trans-identified women
Fog of Confusion (see also word salad and is/ought)
piggybacking
appropriation
bargaining and bartering
pleading (see also Can't we agree to disagree about gender?)
Mental health impact on trans people
using AI: 'use GC arguments to defend your position'.
manufactured outrage
is/ought
Treating minorities like they're conspiracies
Dehumanising transpeople
escalating the drama
Hoax=Not Real Trans (AKA hoaxer-gender)

AND... (the Classics)
➡ALL OF THIS, AKA "full on throwing things"
Refusal to talk. NoDebate.
BeKind.
Verbal aggression and belittling.
Walking on eggshells eg loss of jobs.
Darvo.
Gaslighting aka mirroring.
Whining.
emotional blackmail
word salad
drama and hyperbole
women’s objections appear mean, petty, almost obsessive (see "hysterical ")

Great summary 👏

The sad thing is that until these gitwits started in during this century, it all worked pretty well and there was no particular confusion; only their interfering with it and demanding extra privilege for themselves and their chums spoilt a working system. With luck, if they can be stopped, it could revert to the way it was, which wasn't particularly difficult or complicated..

Thanks, just collating from other people's evidence and musings. It should be helpful to have it all in one place.

I'm a massive cynic, and I suspect part of the reason for the recent change of tactic from aggressive to persuasive is that Andy Burnham wants to be PM.

Interesting, although I'm not catching your drift? Can you elaborate please?

Huh?

This is an interesting one, it took me a while to get through to my ‘DH’ that trans activists declaring these men were women was a real issue that was negatively affecting me. He now accepts I was right but he doesn’t want to share toilets with these men either now he has seem some of the news reports I’ve provided him to show why women have good reason to be uncomfortable.

"they think we're so stupid we'll forget the threads of violence and take pity on them"

Because absolutely all TRAs are absolutely identical and there is absolutely no room for nuance, right?

What "nuance" would you like to see?

If a trans person or ally knows that tsupports a group that not only intimidates and threatens violence but have people that have acted upon those threats of violence then they are supporting that violence.

There's not much nuance in a threat of rape with a splintery rolling pin, as made by one of the TRAs finest.

Not, I strongly suspect, for the first time in your life, you've completely missed the point.

Pop question; do you believe all TERFs are the same? Do you even identify yourself with that label? What does it mean to you?

No, of course not all the same, but we agree on these issues.

Yes, happy to be called a TERF, as I do not want biological men claiming the word woman or being in single sex female spaces. I am happy to include transmen in my feminism as they are women and i am glad they have protedlcted maternity rights etc. But not men claiming to be women.