Woman dies by euthanasia after becoming paraplegic trying to commit suicide after gang rape

[AComplicatedWoman]

This is one of the most heartbreaking news stories I have come across.

Noelia Castillo had a difficult childhood and spent much of it in care homes. She was sexually assaulted by her ex-boyfriend of four years after she had taken sleeping pills to help her sleep, and was assaulted on another occasion by several men in a nightclub. She attempted suicide in October 2022, and it left her unable to use her legs and in a wheelchair. Noelia conducted a long legal battle with her father for the right to end her life and she died by euthanasia on Thursday.

RIP Noelia. I am so sorry that your life was destroyed by these abhorrent abusive men.

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/noelia-castillo-euthanasia-law-spain-b2946671.html

She was 25. With a decade of mental health issues behind her. She should never have been considered a candidate for euthinasia.

Idealistic tomfoolery. We do not want to encourage people at the depths of their despair that the best thing they can do is to not be here.
We need to support them through the darkness.
That takes money.

No, most suicide methods aren't horrific and violent, or particularly painful. The three celebrities I mentioned above probably would've died quickly, without much pain, so I don't think that's a good reason.

And I imagine, without euthanasia, people's families might have some idea of what they're going to do, or the person could leave a note so no one stumbles over their body unawares.

My issue is that when suicide can be committed by oneself, then it's probably best not to involve the state in something that normalises killing the unwell and suffering rather than trying to spend money and resources to treat them. I think in cases of terminal illness that will cause imminent death, or when a person physically can't do it themselves, it might be acceptable for the state to step in...

But otherwise, I think if someone wants to die, they should do it themselves.

I also think that having to do it oneself is a hurdle that may put off people whose lives later improve, which the government removes if they provide it.

If you're talking about hanging, I don't know how painful it is, as I have never been hung (have you?), but it's certainly violent. And it carries a very high risk of permanent brain damage if an attempt fails (yes, that does happen a fair amount).

As for the others, you don't think blowing your brains out, overdosing and suffering severe abdominal distress and vomiting, slitting your wrists, jumping in front of a vehicle or off a high surface, etc., are violent or painful...? Not to mention extremely traumatic for any witnesses.

"And I imagine, without euthanasia, people's families might have some idea of what they're going to do, or the person could leave a note so no one stumbles over their body unawares."

I'm sorry, but that is just not how it works at all. The comment before yours referred to my highly considered and deeply-felt opinion as "idealistic tomfoolery", but this is something else...

I'd rather not go into instructional details, but there are in fact methods of hanging that result in loss of consciousness within seconds, and people (such as the ones I've mentioned) use them all the time, or carbon monoxide poisoning, etc. While some attempts do just go wrong, most of the time, attempted suicides that don't 'succeed' (horrible way of putting it) aren't wholeheartedly committed.

I'm sorry, but that is just not how it works at all.

There have been cases I've read about in the past where people have done exactly that, actually.

This has made me so so angry. This adult man fighting her through court like this. She was a grown woman with her own mind and wishes.

I completely understand the parent's instinct to protect but this is not that. Her childhood background backs up this.

It's control. It's traumatising. It's just horrid, and further proof of why we choose the fucking bear. 🤬

Money doesn’t necessarily make any difference.
A woman I’ve been friends with from school, we are in our 50’s now, has suffered from manic depression, think they call it bi-polar now since we were about 15. She’s been sectioned many many times. She’s tried to kill herself several times.
Her mother and various relatives had the same or similar maladies.
They are very wealthy, she has had the very best of treatments over the last 40 years, no expense spared. She’s been abroad for treatment, many residential stays at places like the Priory. No waiting lists, whatever drugs were considered optimal, but she is still much the same. Nothing has really helped. I’m pretty sure if euthanasia was available to her she’d take it.

If your friend is mostly able bodied and she is determined to die, she can do it herself. She can do the research online on reliable and pain free ways to do it. I have done so myself. There have been multiple people on this thread who have said they suffered years, even decades of severe mental illness and eventually improved. Do you not consider that there may be other people with the same illness as your friend who may also have felt deeply suicidal at some point, who eventually found some level of satisfaction with life, but if they had had the option for assisted suicide when they were younger would no longer be here now? Why should those people be robbed of the years extra they gained? Most people who feel suicidal find it difficult to carry out on their own, the strength of will it takes makes it extremely rare. This is the way it should remain. It at least give people a chance to improve even when some might go a long time believing it's impossible.

Yes, its not unusual that long term MH issues just cannot be changed

But thats not the basis of her application, it was due to the disability and the pain.

And again, another poster upthread makes a comment about 'her childhood background backs this up' in terms of what family support she has or doesnt have. There is no information about her childhood background other than she came into care at 13.

Her mother appeared to be very much in her life.

What people are reacting to about this case is not purely th question of assisted suicide / euthanasia. It is the troubling nature of the role of the Spanish state.

If your family have a history of abuse or drug use or grinding poverty or mental health issues you start at a disadvantage, and we have arrived somehow at the expectation that the state should intervene to improve things for young people facing those issues.

For the state to achieve 100% success is impossible.

However, the allegations that Noelia was sexually assaulted while the care of the Spanish state are appalling and exacerbated by the failure to take any kind of action against those who assaulted her, and the simultaneous failure to provide sufficient mental health support, so that she attempted to kill herself.

Having failed to protect her rights to safety from assault, to an investigation of her attack or to provide adequate treatment of her PTSD, it appeared very possible to protect her right to die, and allegedly her organs were donated.

If the state can’t be trusted to help its citizens with the rights that protect them and enhance their lives, it seems morally repugnant to exploit the ‘rights’ that sacrifice them. Spain really appears to have come up short here.

What allegations about sexual assault while she was in care?

But sometimes it’s not going to get better.
What if someone is autistic with adhd, has learning difficulties, anxiety, depression, can’t cope with work or hold down a job but probably wouldn’t qualify for disability either.
where is the hope then?
Should they be made to struggle through years and years of mental distress and suffering just to get through life when there is a way out? Is that not kinder?

Good god. I cannot believe Im reading that

Well be glad you’re not living it.

These sort of posts are exactly why, despite my initial support for assisted dying, really shouldnt become law here. Shocking and frightening.

I am someone who has had lifelong mental health issues. Had a breakdown at 14, sectioned at 16. Never finished school or had a job, Hardly ever leave my home. I didn't start to improve at all until my late 20s. Like I have said in other posts I'm still not a happy person. But I find little pockets of pleasure here and there that keep me going. Food, music, video games etc. Unless someone is terminal then yes, there is always a possibility for improvement, even if it seems unlikely. I don't mean that they will be cured of their illness, but they may eventually find that life isn't 24/7 misery. There are still days when I think I don't want to exist anymore, and others that I'm glad that I was around to experience some of the moments I have. I'm going to guess you're in the U.S. if someone with depression and learning difficulties wouldn't qualify for disability/state benefits? If that is the case, then THAT is what needs to be fought for. Rather than saying that such people should just be put out of their misery. More help is needed for people who are not physically disabled but have other struggles that prevent them from living productive lives. I haven't had much help with my mental health, but I do thankfully at least get benefits that allow me to stay house and fed.

And yet we don’t.

the Samaritans are a charity. Many MH support services are charities. These days in MH having actually tried to kill youself won’t even get you any kind of treatment. Maybe a gp appointment and some anti depressants.

I just think if someone is in severe pain be that physical or emotional it should be an option open to them. Why shouldn’t they, just because it offends you. It’s their life to do as they wish with is it not?
Why should people have to endure extra years of misery on the chance that it might get better. I can’t see the Spanish girls paralysis improving can you?

You know full well the ‘all lives matter’ nonsense it trotted out in response to BLM.
same mentality as why isn’t there a international men’s day and where is white history month.

It's like you just ignored everything I wrote. It's not "because it offends" me. It's because I've been in that position, and know damn well if that option had been open to me I would have taken it, as would many others who have suffered prolonged severe depression. There is no way of knowing when you are in that state of mind if things will improve. For some they will, for others they won't. If you are dead you will never find out. I still think at some point in the future, suicide is the most likely way I will die. Probably when my mother is gone and I am left alone, who knows for sure. But then if I want it enough I will have to handle it myself. I don't want state assistance to make it easier for ME when I know that means it will also be made easier for people like my younger self.

This is true but we dont generally (and its not we anyway because the UK doesnt have these laws) but assisted dying surely doesnt become a replacement for MH suicidal ideation does it?

Or does it?

Remember she made her application on the basis of the injuries and the consistent pain.

Well firstly she isnt paralysed, she can walk with support frames

Secondly, why are we even bothering with suicide prevention then? Why are we providing MH services (such as they are, scant as they are) to support suicidal ideation?

I wasn’t just saying such people should be put out of their misery I was saying that’s my wish and I don’t want to suffer anymore. I feel I should have a choice instead of trying to somehow get through each day.
I am glad you have managed to find support and benefits, maybe that does change things for people.

We should be suspicious of the argument that she only wanted to die because of the physical pain. She wanted to die - and tried to - before becoming disabled. Did the pre-existing mental health issues just evaporate afterwards?

Good point

I suppose it gave her more ammunition, which is why the thresholds and the criteria is so dangerous then

So going back to the people Ive worked with over the years who have removed their own limbs, obviously they were significantly mentally ill prior to that, hence the attempts

Its normal to see her suicide attempt as a reaction to the rapes, but equally we dont know (although lots of posters have made assumptions on here without backing up with evidence) what her mental state was from years before that. She started recieving psychiatric interventions at 13, around the time she came into care. Its easy to assume it was about her care entry, but was it?