NHS Fife now says staff should use toilets based on biological sex

[IwantToRetire]

The Scottish NHS board at the centre of a high-profile legal battle involving single-sex spaces has said its staff should now use facilities that correspond with their sex at birth, rather than their gender identity.

NHS Fife has released an equality impact assessment after the UK’s equality watchdog told it to “progress corrective actions” on single-sex spaces without delay.

The health board stated its interim position will be to “provide a mix of suitable facilities” that follow the law.

The review says: “Where toilets and changing facilities are not in individual separate lockable rooms, separate toilets and changing facilities will be provided for men and women alongside additional gender-neutral facilities.”

It adds: “Where a facility is provided separately for men and women it should be used by people whose sex at birth corresponds with the facility.”

But the assessment also says that “no-one should be put in a position that they do not have access to suitable facilities that respect and protect their dignity and privacy”.

Article continues at https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/uk-supreme-court-kirkcaldy-victoria-hospital-b1250543.html

IS NHS Fife one of the 19 organisations the EHRC wrote to?

Talk about getting blood out of a stone. A massive, shaming employment tribunal and it still took them nearly 6 months after the supreme court ruling made their position clearly untenable.

But I very glad for all the nurses who work there.

The law is Fife must provide SSS

Where a facility is provided separately for men and women it should be used by people whose sex at birth corresponds with the facility.

“Where toilets and changing facilities are not in individual separate lockable rooms, separate toilets and changing facilities will be provided for men and women alongside additional gender-neutral facilities.”

Translatiom ^ spend a shit load of tax funding on toilets and changing provisions for a handful of staff diverting fund from community facing services

I'm happy with that in principle. But isn't that problem that TW don't want a gender neutral toilet/changing space? I thought the whole issue is that they want to use the toilet that is linked to their chosen sex as part of the experience of living as that sex. I'd be all up for campaigning for third spaces in public areas to support trans individuals, but I don't think it's what they want. NHS Fife have done the only thing they can do, but I doubt it's being done willingly, or that they've accepted biological reality.

That squeaking noise is NHS Fife backpedalling several miles out of Crazytown and back into a less ridiculous place. Only, when you zoom out, they’re not backpedalling, they’re being towed away by the EHRC (if I could at all draw, I would make a comic panel of this).

Considering NHS Fife employ multiple people across various roles (including doctors) who unflinchingly claim that TIMs are “biological women”, I have no faith in anything they say.

But the assessment also says that “no-one should be put in a position that they do not have access to suitable facilities that respect and protect their dignity and privacy”.

It’s shame they couldn’t incorporate this principle when they decided to give women’s facilities to men to use. Now they include this phrase for the benefit of trans people.

That’s on TW to deal with. As the CEO of ERC told women wanting single sex rape services, they just need to “reframe their trauma”.

I wonder if this might be more acceptable, once the craziness from the extreme TRA groups has died down?

I'd be super happy to campaign for third spaces - and an increase in disabled loos too, as we don't want people with disabilities to lose out.

As usual they forget safety. By these measures Fife don’t need to change a thing financially.

Women exclude themselves if they don’t feel safe, like the women’s changing rooms in the basement at Fife.

Privacy with isolation from help.

Not so hard to do was it? Perfectly clear, straightforward policy which respects everyone's needs. If only someone had thought to do it two or three years ago.

This was my thought too. What happens when you get belligerent arseholes like Upton who will swear til they're blue in the face that they are a woman, they are biological, and therefore they are a biological woman??

I'm concerned for Isla Bumba and that senior Dr who are unsure of their biological sex.

As a disabled person it makes me furious that more money and attention is given to protecting men’s feelings about which toilet they use than my ability to use any bloody toilet at all.
Nobody gives a shit (pun intended) about us.

It’s unbelievable. The government consultation for toilet needs was so dominated by a Stonewall campaign, that the results were skewed to the point that only 2% supported toilets for you.

The Lords discussed it here:
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld5901/ldselect/ldsecleg/3/305.htm

Are those claiming nebulous dog whistles being personally escorted to the ladies by consultants for their safety?

Or are they sucking it up and just using the gender neutral facilities?

As a side note it's outrageous that my local train company lner spent £58,000 on decorating a train with a progress pride flag colours while disabled people including Dame Tanni Grey Thompson have been left stranded because their requested assistance hasn't shown up. This regularly pops into my head as one of the most shocking DEI failures I've ever heard.

TIM says he will use them anyway https://www.reddit.com/r/transgenderUK/comments/1nv723e/nhs_fife_now_says_staff_should_use_toilets_based/

It was the comment that his boss said he should carry on using them that caught my eye. This knotweed is going to be so hard to eradicate.

yes, allegedly NHS boss and all. Assume thats going to end up a firing offence in the end....

The Reddit reception of this story if representative of the wider public’s view is sobering.

I don't see any coherent or reasonable argument/comments on that thread. But the general response, in my view, is aggressive, patronising and whinging. Quite concerning that they're prepared to ignore the law to pander to an individual's 'wants'. Typical of a typical man really...

Not even the most mainstream Reddit subs are representative of the UK public, never fear, let alone this one.

This is very true. It operates in a complete fantasy land of misinformation, and the moderators make sure that no views that counter this are allowed.

I saw a post a while ago where someone complained that their medical test results had their sex recorded on them. Most of the comments were about reporting the transphobe who carried out the test and getting the results changed. However, there was a very reasonable comment from someone who suggested that perhaps their biological sex was relevant to how the results should be interpreted, and there was no transphobic intent. This nugget of common sense was downvoted to oblivion, and the poster was chastised for using transphobic dog whistles such as biological sex. It's like a different planet on there.

“Where toilets and changing facilities are not in individual separate lockable rooms, separate toilets and changing facilities will be provided for men and women alongside additional gender-neutral facilities.”

Shall we take bets on how the cash strapped NHS is suddenly going to find the money to build individual separate lockable rooms just to ensure no one’s feelings get hurt?

It's the comment wondering what we are 'getting out of this' that is truly eye opening for me.

What we are getting out of fighting for our single sex spaces? We're (finally) getting single sex spaces back, you dummies! I think some of them genuinely can't believe that many women actually value single sex spaces for any real reasons. Like the whole issue is just because we are spiteful.

The whole time women have been begging these men for empathy, trying to explain why we need women's spaces and services and they really think we're just making it up.