British Army colonel claims trans personnel unlikely to be able to serve beyond 2026

[SingleSexSpacesInSchools]

https://www.forcesnews.com/lgbtq/exclusive-british-army-colonel-claims-transgender-personnel-are-unlikely-be-able-serve-beyond

Curious others thoughts on this.

I confess I haven't been following this thread in detail, so it was quite a while into leafing through the posts that it suddenly clicked -
Good grief, that half-dressed person in that photo in the OP is... a colonel in the British Army! addressing a public event!
A picture is worth a thousand words.

Or one word, 'inappropriate', written thousand times.

I didn’t guess wrong, I said most of.

’Normal Barracks’ as you put it are now primarily SLAM (single living accommodation) so self contained bedroom/bathroom. Lockable door and mixed sex corridors. Why would having someone who is trans have any impact on that setup? The main places to consider are phase 1 and phase 2 training establishments which are segregated by sex and transit accommodation.

Does this mean with there are new requirements around maximum pack weight? And that female personnel are expected to carry the same pack weight as male people for long distance treks - not just the PT annual check and entry checks?

How does this work in deployment? Or is the expectation that there will be no more military action requiring these previous fitness requirements?

Oh God, do I have to?

At least the message on the crop top is honest : ‘Politicise’. The question is ,how much politicising should be carried out by a serving officer, especially one in a discipliniary role

BTW I urge anyone to listen to the clip, it’s fascinating.

Mess kit can be worn at any black tie event, whether or not you are there in an official capacity. It's completely normal to see officers (including retired ones) in mess kit at wedding receptions, formal dinners etc. As this was an award ceremony then mess kit would be appropriate for a serving officer.

(not condoning the stunt btw)

Absolutely that.

Not to mention, at a time when stability in Europe and internationally is low, wtaf was he thinking to broadcast to the world that the British Army is led by people looking and behaving like this?

Male, happy to work in a war environment has trouble navigating the male toilets because its traumatic or something?

Did I get that right?

I think he's in the wrong career, especially given what actual women have to deal with in the military.

I do not and have not served. However, I take a keen interest and follow a lot of things around UK military etc. As far as I am aware, now females can do front line work, they are held to the same standards and equipment as males. I know you are not at all saying this, but females don't get a smaller gun that weighs less, they are carrying an (approx) 5KG SA80 variant, and that's it, if you can't carry your pack you can't do the job.

I was not referring to chefs and mechanics. If that is what your friends are doing, fine. But there are roles which have requirements that do have peak fitness standards higher than a chef. Can you please confirm that even there there is no difference at all in fitness assessment?

And you have then just jumped to 'deployment' as to temporary camp. I was not referring to those but to barracks or are you about to tell us there are no longer shared single sex accommodations for military personnel anywhere in the world that military personnel from the UK would be deployed to? Is that correct? That no where that UK military personnel will be deployed to will have shared single sex accommodations? Brilliant news!

Of course people will use pronouns for people, including in written correspondence and briefs. But are you saying that those using correct sex pronouns are not adversely impacted in anyway? That is great to hear.

The pack weight in the Annual Fitness Test varies by arm, from 25kg for infantry to 15kg for REME, AGC etc. In deployment, you carry what you need to carry - might be more, might be less, and kit will be distributed around a unit as required. For example in an infantry section, you might have one soldier who is an absolute ox and will therefore take more gear, whereas smaller and lighter soldiers will carry less. Soldiers, particularly while on deployment, have a very large degree of autonomy in how they organise themselves and how they use, organise, and even customise their kit - this is one of the defining characteristics of the British Army.

Ok. So part of the issue is that in the past (let's see what our current active service poster says) weight gets distributed around and female people on long treks are not expected to carry quite as much as male people. Because it is widely understood that they are prone to injury and the last thing a small grouping wants is to have to deal with an injury such as that.

The fitness test for entry and for annual testing will probably not reflect these practical applications that are needed for long trek exercises and deployment.

Yes. This was what I understood.

Yes, I understand that. My point is though, was this person there in a representational capacity or were they not and were using the uniform, as an active serving member, as a prop?

Were they there as a speaker from the British Army speaking about LGBT issues? This is where I believe there could be a grey area.

Unnecessarily dismissive about our chefs and mechanics tbh. I am not sure what part of job specific fitness tests isn’t clear to you? Look it up yourself. Same fitness tests to join the marines, SBS, SF. As it should be, not about gender but about ability to complete the job.

I’ve literally answered this in a previous comment.

It is actually actively encouraged to use personnel’s rank since it’s seen as earned. Report writing for example is upon the individuals preference whether theyd want their reporting officer to write gender or rank to avoid any unconscious (or conscious) bias at board. And obviously people do use pronouns, what I have maintained is that it’s much less of a big issue due to the regular use of rank.

So if it's all hunky dory, why is he so cross that he's expected to comply with UK law? Especially as he's a high ranking military police officer expected to uphold military and UK law?

Great, so no one will be punished at all for misgendering someone?

Are you saying that there is a regulation in the UK forces that protects anyone who uses correct sex pronouns? please confirm this.

And also confirm this:

"Are you about to tell us there are no longer shared single sex accommodations for military personnel anywhere in the world that military personnel from the UK would be deployed to? Is that correct? That no where that UK military personnel will be deployed to will have shared single sex accommodations?"

Just to be clear Btowngirl.

Are you confirming that at all times your trans colleagues are being treated exactly the same as all the other people of their sex in the military? That non of the UK military forces are making any special accommodations to include male people in female single sex provisions within the military?

Is that what you are saying here?

If so, that is great news. Your colleagues can be treated as the sex they are and there should be no issue. So... why would this senior serving member be saying that they and others will be excluded then?

And does that also include the exact same treatment of long term medical requirements and mental health standards too?

Look, everyone is entitled to whatever opinion they like on the matter. I am not here to argue with strangers on the internet, I literally came here with some lived experience/knowledge that I feel makes the whole argument a little less inflammatory. And partially as reassurance that not all women in the armed forces are being subjected to X Y and Z. It’s backfired on me as it seems like I’m now something else for people to be aggy about, and some of the lines of questioning I am clearly not going to have the answers to. So I am going to check out of the thread now and you ladies have a nice day.

Oh. So, you cannot confirm that male people in the UK military are being treated as their sex in all aspects of service and that the military is not expected to make special accommodations and allow them to access female single sex provisions?

Your answers have actually been rather confusing and contradictory to what this Senior Provost has said.

If there are no instances of male serving members of the military needing any special accommodations, why would this person be saying that the military will be ceasing the contracts for serving personnel with transgender identities in less than 18 months time?

Col Sangster-Wall was there as a keynote speaker at a defence award ceremony so I don't quite see how wearing mess kit could be seen as a 'prop'. It was used in a rather silly stunt, and will probably result in a bollocking from the CO, but that's a separate issue. It was a completely proper place to wear mess kit and use rank.

Yes Pharazon that is what I thought. I agree, it was appropriate wear because they were there in representational capacity. Entirely appropriate.

My point is that he used it as a prop to make a political speech while there in an official representational capacity. Hence it was not appropriate to remove it as he did.

There is no evidence that they were there in any sort of official representation capacity. Do you know otherwise?

Has no idea just hyperbole, though some of the comments here are equally wrong. Whilst they do have gendered facilities in some parts of the military, actually many roles do not, my dd shares a mess (sleeping area) with men sometimes when she deploys, because she shares with others doing her role for practicality, and she doesn’t mind at all. Toilets and showers are unisex too. (Be glad you actually have them now!) the guys are all really respectful apparently

as for mess dress, women are already allowed to wear trousers if they want anyway, my dd chooses a skirt

No. But surely as a key note speaker at a defence centred event that would be considered representational?

Besides which, would there any occasion where it would be appropriate to strip off mess kit on a stage with general public present while you were an active serving member? Just curious to know where and when it would be ok.