Headteacher backtracks after calling for 'gender neutral' uniform

[hellooooooomama]

He was going to ban skirts.

Parental feedback was not sought initially, but they've had plenty of it since the change was announced!

My opinion. Police the children effectively if they're not wearing it properly. Don't punish the girls who are following the rules.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c9915zgvjk4o?at_link_id=743ED69C-41D3-11F0-AA25-C9355B601FDF&at_campaign=Social_Flow&at_ptr_name=facebook_page&at_link_origin=BBC_Essex&at_link_type=web_link&at_bbc_team=editorial&at_medium=social&at_format=image&at_campaign_type=owned&fbclid=IwQ0xDSwKuxqJleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHk6aensTQMd06TSswic5MxNQHZ2Ru4bMWTwlqBl_l3XOBjgDph5zvELMd7g9_aem_wrAH7AjLCJqPj7Nn6TwJcg

Yeah, I agree tbh. I got bullied in both uniform and non uniform secondary for my look! And I'm ashamed to say I judged others also. Kids and teens sadly do.

So better you just wear your own stuff then at least you're authentic. Rather than 'oh your blazer is the wrong size, your ties too long, I'm gonna ridicule you.'

Then why allow for shorts?
The option to wear skirts was there but it's been taken away. Maintaining a small variation to allow pubescent girls some privacy. A bit like football clubs avoiding white shorts for their female teams.

I'm all for school uniform for various reasons. I think it's fine to insist on a minimum skirt length.

Most uniforms do have 'options' though. It took two seconds to see that even this particular school has different blazer and shirt colour options for example. There is no reason in this world that trousers OR skirt can't be one of them.

I thought it hasn’t been taken away. That it was mooted and now rejected.

But yes, if you have skirts you have to police them, unfortunately, but that’s to the benefit of girls.

Yes, that's why I said 'each to their own'. I appreciate that your experience is different.

I rolled up my skirt in an all girls school because it was a trend. You were seen as a geek if you wore it knee length. We didn't have a rule about length so after the first term everyone had their mum cut the skirt and sew it shorter.
Young girls like wearing short skirts.
It wasn't because I was considering a career in prostitution aged 11. 🫤

My niece goes to an all-girl school. The girls are all happy wearing their knee-length skirts. Whereas girls at the nearby mixed school all shorten their skirts nearly to their crotches. I am talking 11 and 12 years old here. If the choice is purely down to the girls why do you think they make those different choices?

Policies like this happen because the minimum length is ignored. Repearedly

Eh? What? That is not at all what I meant.

Teenagers wanting to be attractive to the opposite sex is not unheard of or unhealthy. We're talking about a high school. Sometimes the skirt rolling goes too far. Children need to be protected, especially girls and be given good boundaries to do this, including appropriate dress codes.

That's not what I know of all girls schools who don't care about skirt length.

So? At my school there was a cupboard ot shrouds available for anyone who rolled their skirt up too short.

Eleven year olds girls on Rotherham passed around by grooming gangs didn’t choose to become postitutes - they were groomed and then raped. And young girls at your school didn’t wear short skirts because they liked it; they didn’t want to be called geeks.

The school I work at has had a trousers only policy for at least a decade.

Never been an issue. The only change we've had was changing grey trousers to black, as grey trousers were harder to get hold of.

My only proviso to that would be allowing shorts in the summer. It’s getting hotter and schools can be especially boiling.
Given that lots of workplaces allow smart shorts I don’t see why that can’t happen in schools. And of course it’s the norm in places like Australia.

DD has attended both co-ed and girls’ only secondary schools (both private). Both have girls in teeny tiny skirts.

And let us remember sexual harassment at secondary schools is so prevalent that nearly every single girl will experience it. It is considered normal and they won’t report it because nothing gets done. But we are somehow meant to think that girls are making these decisions for themselves.

Short skirts don't cause sexual harassment.

No shorts allowed unfortunately! Thankfully my classroom as air conditioning, but if it gets ridiculously hot like earlier this year, a message goes out to parents saying they don't need to bring/wear blazers if they don't want to.

No, it doesn’t. But short skirts don’t benefit girls either.

Both of these things can be true.

How would this thread have gone if the headteacher was a woman ffs its not all about the "male gaze" I've seen mothers buying short skirts for their daughters and encouraging them to roll because "that's what they did" to my mind that's messed up stop normalising sexual behaviour in pre teen and teenage CHILDREN boys don't need overtight trousers that show off there underpants girls don't need short micro shirts for school

They need an EDUCATION

People need to put pressure where it belongs on clothing manufacturers to produce better fitting clothes not high tight fashion choices in school uniform

If you suffer from heavy periods, it's more likely that you'll get a bleed through with trousers in my experience - even if you use the belt and braces method of tampon plus pad. Plus, if you have to use a large pad, it's more likely to show in trousers.

This.

Otherwise we'd be saying

This thirteen year old has chosen to walk topless down the street on the way home whilst still in her school skirt. But that's ok because she's chosen to do it, and that's all ok because that's the fashion in school and no one should body shame the girl in involved.

Or would you say 'hang on a second' maybe we should be setting some standards here and saying there's a line which is there for the benefit of the girls themselves even if they don't recognise it, but unfortunately there are bad men and boys out there and whilst we should do everything we can to stop the said men and boys we also have a duty of care to minor girls to tell them that whilst they are uniform (and therefore can be identified and associated with the school) the school has a duty of care to say 'no don't do it'. Even if it's not enough for a referral for social services.

I see the comments referencing Rotherham. The issue with Rotherham was a multi agency failure to identify girls at risk and to try to act to protect them. This will have included behaviour at school. Overly sexualised behaviour and looking for attention from boys in early to mid teens should be looked through the lens of safeguarding first for this reason.

This isn't blaming the girls for the behaviour of boys or men. It is identifying a problem which needs girls need to be aware of - the line between trying to please and get the attention of boys to fit in and be cool and what is actually them being empowered and making free decisions themselves and to protect them from being photographed in a way that's going to be exploited and can't be erased.

This is why if a girl was filmed at the same level and it shared on social media it would be red flagged as safeguarding.

There definitely is an area where it DOES matter how a teen girl dresses and where school DOES have a responsibility.

We had our policy because we had a run of false accusations against male members of staff.

Trying to 'police' the length of teenage girls skirts is awkward enough, even more so as a male teacher.

Some particularly nasty girls made false accusations, were found out thankfully, but the policy was changed to make it easier/less dangerous for staff.

This thread demonstrates exactly why 'oh just have a minimum skirt length and police it' is a problem. It's not like any other uniform infraction. The minute teachers try to monitor skirt lengths they get accused of 'policing girls' bodies' 'misogyny' and worse 'being a pervert'. Male teachers are told that if they don't want girls' arses in their workplace, that's their problem and they 'shouldn't be looking' rather than it being a reasonable expectation that's maintained in basically every other workplace.
Monitoring skirt lengths leads to accusations being thrown around by both parents and pupils. It's fucking horrible.

Yes, they all roll their skirts up. They start year 7 in knee-length skirts, but by around autumn half-term, most of the girls are rolling them up. Around here, they also wear black biker shorts underneath Nike Pros, American Apparel, or similar so there’s no risk of anything inappropriate showing.

Honestly, I’m exhausted by the so-called feminists who are quick to sneer at teenage girls just for doing what teenage girls do. Policing young girls' choices while claiming to stand for female empowerment isn't feminism.

If my daughters want to roll up their skirts, that’s their choice. They’re smart, strong, hardworking young women who know their worth. I’ve taught them to spot sexism and call it out. I don’t have time for bitter, performative feminists who spend more energy judging other women than dismantling the patriarchy.