Headteacher backtracks after calling for 'gender neutral' uniform

[hellooooooomama]

He was going to ban skirts.

Parental feedback was not sought initially, but they've had plenty of it since the change was announced!

My opinion. Police the children effectively if they're not wearing it properly. Don't punish the girls who are following the rules.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c9915zgvjk4o?at_link_id=743ED69C-41D3-11F0-AA25-C9355B601FDF&at_campaign=Social_Flow&at_ptr_name=facebook_page&at_link_origin=BBC_Essex&at_link_type=web_link&at_bbc_team=editorial&at_medium=social&at_format=image&at_campaign_type=owned&fbclid=IwQ0xDSwKuxqJleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHk6aensTQMd06TSswic5MxNQHZ2Ru4bMWTwlqBl_l3XOBjgDph5zvELMd7g9_aem_wrAH7AjLCJqPj7Nn6TwJcg

You are either a man or genuinely can't get your head round what's been said or both.

Girls aren't doing any of these things and endless female teachers wear tight leggings with crotches visible to do PE and it's fine, you should be looking at women's faces not their bodies. There is nothing offensive in this and never been.
Ban men from wearing grey tracksuits I don't want to see their balls jiggling around.

I'm not.

I'm saying they think they are attractive because the only way to be attractive is through sex and the problem is the normalisation of children as being sexy.

Attractiveness isn't necessarily about about sexiness. Attractiveness is a whole range of things. Desperately pandering to others and trying to be cool isn't an attractive quality. It smacks of desperation and attention seeking. Being confident enough not to do that can be attractive. Understanding you are free to say, no I don't want to play that game might be attractive.

The whole point is the difference in parenting rather than this idea that 'wearing what you like' is necessarily a free choice and empowering. There are plenty of different ways to value yourself and others that are healthier and make you attractive.

Before we do go anywhere controlling girls the way one or two on here have suggested, lets crack down on male teachers scratching their balls or boys squeezing their privates in full view which I've seen a lot more than what one or two have described in relation to girls uniform.
Or mens shorts and their balls falling our when they manspread.

I'm beginning to think pickles doth protest too much

Why not both? My 12 year old tried manspreading in my car and got short shrift my daughter was taught underwear is kept underneath clothing and if she wants to climb trees trousers are far more practical 🤷‍♀️

Nope nope nope no leggings for teachers in my local schools unless accompanied by a long tshirt no crop tops no tight tops nothing like that and they tend to wear knee length shorts like the male teachers

See and be seen

I’m not a man. And I can understand perfectly well that the flip side to women being forced to cover up shouldn’t be girls being socialised into thinking baring as much flesh as possible is in any way beneficial to them for a number of reasons, none of which have anything to do with being responsible for male behaviour.

Yeah right. Where do you live that these things are the norm?

OMG the talk about girls arses and knickers is still going strong 😁this topic attracts the controlling types and oddballs.

All the girls in our area wear black cycle shorts under the school skirts. Promise they're not looking to flash their bits. It's a trend, this age group likes to follow trends. No we don't allow all trends, mine don't even have smart phones or social media and eldest was recently highly commended for their for professional conduct during their 6 months volunteering. And they were appropriately dressed!! 😱

And still, I have no problem with rolling up skirts. With the girls in our area there is nothing to see, just legs either in tights or not. If anyone has problem with girls legs thats a bit worrying.

And too funny how some posters are trying to explain what attractiveness means and what it doesn't. The teens won't care, don't try and mansplain to them how they should consider and make themselves attractive, it's seriously overstepping the mark and simply cringe.

This topic of school skirt length is really sexist and certainly like honey to the bees to some. Odd, odd, odd.

I totally get where the Head is coming from tbh. Policing girl's skirt length was an effing nightmare/ minefield when I was a teacher. There were tons of girls who would do the 'rolling the waistband up' thing and were pretty much flashing buttocks. (And let's be honest, I'm prepared to bet there are Mumsnetters on here who did it in their day too. It's hardly a new thing.) But it is especially awful for the male teachers who don't know where to look and are terrified of being accused of ogling girls.

Honestly, teachers don't have time to be dealing with making sure everyone is wearing uniform properly. It's a stressful, tough job as it is. Why is having a 'no skirts' policy such a bad thing?

Yes this thread is very weird. Regular posters being accused of all sorts...

@hellooooooomama

"Interesting to note they have a higher than average proportion of SEND pupils at this school."

I hardly see why this is relevant. But as you flag it, there is a specialist autism hub attached to the school. (I'm local to Honywood and it's a good school.)

Because it's mysoginist, it punishes girls for men's behaviour, it's body shaming and slutshaming. Why are they looking anywhere than girls faces. Why don't we just ban women so not to accidently arouse men. In fact some countries have done it.

Why is having a 'no skirts' policy such a bad thing?

I'll bite. Because most girls prefer wearing school skirts. Almost all schools have trousers as a second option and while some girls do prefer trousers many don't.

Do men on the street also have to oggle young girls in short skirts or is that just the poor male teachers that can't help themselves?

This whole conversation is messed up and creepy. And very sexist.

But you keep going over and over this weird trousers only phantasy we all need dreams😂

And on a feminism board, no less. I've come across some strange takes from self-identified feminists over the yearssome believe it's perfectly normal for their sons to inappropriately touch girls, as if it's just a part of growing up (boys will be boys), while others seem to think all girls should be forced to wear long trousers at all times.

Maybe this whole thread is a covert ad for M&S modest clothing range 😆

Where do you draw the line in what girls can wear to school? If a girl turned up in a sports bra top would that be ok? What about just a lacy bra on top? What about if she was six years old and wore a lacy bra as her only top wear on a summers day?

How is girls rolling their school skirts up short beneficial to girls? What positives does it bring to their education?

I must say, the creepiest posters in this thread that I can see are you and Pickles. The neither of you seem to have any real understanding of what feminism or women’s liberation are.

No. When you call concerns about how female clothing is sexualised and how girls are dragged into this body shaming and slutshaming (WTF, btw? Are girls in short skirts sluts now? Nasty misogynistic term) you are shutting down debate, to the detriment of girls.

Why does it have to beneficial? Why does everything girls want to do have to be justified? It doesn't seem to matter whether it's rolling up a school skirt or liking a boyband, they can never ever be left to just be.

Two completely different things.

It matters because it’s school uniform within an educational setting.

Aww we just don't have enough feminists that think women need to cover up and restrict themselves in order to not make men uncomfortable.

What did your grandma burn her bra for?

Or may be you work for the M&S "modest" range. Which was the beginning of the end of M&S, so all well that ends well 😂

It took me a long time to realise that feminism is not just about what I, as a woman, want or what I might want for my female relatives or friends. It is about working to take all women to a better future. That includes girls who are in care, or who have suffered at the hands of abusive relatives or who are being poorly parented for whatever reason. It includes girls that are living in housing for DV victims, girls who are refugees from war torn lands and girls who are in danger of being groomed. When we consider rules for modelling behaviour we should make sure that we are not disadvantaging these girls. Whether we advocate for trousers, skirts, uniform or non-uniform we should always consider the bigger picture than just feisty young women, who have a supportive family background that has been able to give them a strong sense of boundaries.

So okay for a man to say no skirts for girls and they need to cover up?

People on the feminist board helping justify and excuse his proposal.
Beggars belief.