Have I completely misunderstood GCSE biology...

[proximalhumerous]

...or is the purpose of spotting an anomaly not specifically to disregard it in order that it doesn't lead to an inaccurate conclusion?

If so, why is everyone fixating on DSDs as "proof" that sex is a spectrum, when the anomalous 1.7% (if indeed it is as high as that - from what I've read that figure is only achieved if you include conditions such as PCOS which have a tenuous claim at best to be one of the "intersex" variations) is clearly a set of results that don't fit. Because something has deviated from the norm. It's not like calculating the mean of a range of heights, FFS.

Please can someone more scientific than me explain what is going on here? Or is it simply that certain factions are so hell-bent on arguing that anyone with ladyfeels can be a woman they're happy to completely disregard any sort of science or logic in order to do so?

And nuts 😁

There are more biologists (and adjacent scientists) on this thread than there are sexes.

So back to biology.. what do female spiders and pumpkin plants have in common? It is a very basic biological question.

I think that it would definitely help you to read something about what chromosomes actually are made of.
From that, something about the SRY Gene, and what happens when it is on the X chromosome, only partially active or inactive.
The Midline PLUS site has some reasonably easy to understand pages on the SRY Gene, with drop down boxes that might be the start of your quest for proper information.

Typo "mediline PLUS"

You seem to be avoiding people's questions anteater.

The title of this thread is "Have I completely misunderstood biology?".

It seems for most on this entire site is - YES!

I think that it would definitely help you to read something about what chromosomes actually are made of.

I could draw every nucleotide even uracil (only in RNA, I know), could you?

Can you explain about the sry gene and what it does in your own words

I’ll bite. As you are quite confident that no one here understands biology, are you a biologist @Anteater1 ? Or a geneticist? Some specialist scientific background? Often posters will say ‘I’m a lawyer’ (or not) or ‘I’m a GP’, which is helpful in understanding that posters comments.

Anyone who suggests only people assigned female at birth can get pregnant are wrong.

Yes absolutely. I wasn't AFAB, and yet I've given birth twice. But that's because sex isn't "assigned at birth". It's observed and recorded. I was observed Female at birth.

Also @Anteater1 could you quote who you are replying to please. It makes it much easier to follow.

I will ask again. Are you arguing that the classification of sex should be completely removed from UK law? In short no sex on the birth certificate, drivers license, no sex segregation in sports, prisons, toilets, changing rooms. Everyone can use everything.

this means transwomen and those formerly known as women now share with transmen and those formerly known as men. Are transwomen ok to sharing with men?

there is also no longer same sex attraction and also no longer homophobia, because just like sexism, you cannot argue something that longer exists in law.

happy now? Not sure what you achieved btw.

There are lots of medics who will assert that there is no such thing as sex - biologically.

That is different from the ADMINISTRATIVE system of assignment of a sex which we do for all sorts of purposes including everything from pension planning to building control.

In a growing number of nations a third option is provided for those who do not fit neatly into one category or another, be that "Diverse" in Germany, "x" in many other states, "other" in others.

THAT would be a sensible option and has proved so in many places.

And whether you agree or not, as soon as someone born in Canada, Germany, India or anywhere else who was assigned something other than male or female, arrives in the UK, whether as tourist or to live.....it demonstrates how silly our centuries old system is.

Do you think Professor robert winston is incorrect when he says there are only two sexes?

Haddy....we administratively "assign". THAT is the legal process. Medics DON'T do that. They observe.

But it is the administrative assignment that is recorded.

So if a doctor observes the sex of a baby as male can the Registrar decide to assign that baby as female in the administrative process? And if they did would the baby be male or female?

And no, it's not about 'round production of a particular of gamete' as those who produce BOTH are proof of. (Please actually read the medical research referred to).

The medical research overwhelmingly says that people don’t produce both gamete types. One possible case was reported, no follow up that I’ve seen.

It says that rabbits do, very rarely, produce both types and there has been a little discussion in the literature whether the same could happen in humans. A report of self-fertilisation in a rabbit. References to the birth of Jesus. These are very rare conditions anyway and if it does happen it has to be exceptionally rare. It certainly isn’t verified in humans as you’re suggesting.

What have you linked that says otherwise?

In general though, I do agree that sex classification by gamete type doesn’t necessarily hold up when it comes to some very rare dsds. (I think I differ from some others on the thread in that belief?) A very small minority of dsds are difficult to ‘classify’ medically and sometimes it comes down to patient choice.
That doesn’t mean that human sex occurs on a spectrum however, it simply means that rare medical conditions exist.

Spanassaurus...(leaving aside chimera and mosaicism cases) ....we ALL start off in the biological default as 'female'.
Any variation from that depends on sperm containing the SRY gene.
The gene can be on the Y or X chromosome and can be active, inactive and every level in between.

IF the SRY gene impressed itself during fetal development, that will change the foetus from the female starting point to male looking genital, mixed genitals, both sets or NO gonadal tissues of any kind.
Later in the pregnancy, other genes and hormones together with the mother's hormonal environment shape development of the brain.

The brain, like genitals...has structural differences caused by the specific genes and hormones during pregnancy.

There is no guarantee that a person with female type genitals will have a female type brain. No guarantee a person with make type genitals will have a male type brain.
And lots of people with mixes and mismatches.

Those two processes (broadly) explain DSDs and incongruence (bring trans).
Just natural biological processes at work.

Humans are either male or female from conception we don't all start as female by default

Spannasaurus. I think you should read what I posted rather than worry what I might think about Robert Winston.

And you've misunderstood what I explained about assignment. When it is biologically not possible for any medic to tell a parent what sex their child is, the Registrar STILL insists that parents arbitrarily tick a box....regardless of how wrong that might prove to be.

So based on what should this administrative sex be based? Feelings? Why do we need a feelings based administrative classification? What good does it bring society?

I argue the only reason you want to keep this is so that some people who are now classified as male, can reclassify themselves as women so that they can use the century old system of man and woman to their own advantage.

I argue we are then better of completely removing the system.
We could also setup another system of people with an active sry-gen or not. Would you support that?

Span etc....it really would help if you read a basic introduction to human biology and the SRY gene.
You just don't seem to understand.

I really really don’t think there are lots of medics who think this.

No they don't. Parents would wait for further genetic testing before registering the birth in cases of DSDs.

You might do well to read some of what Prof Winston has to say about sex as you might learn something. The main thing being that there are only two sexes.

Unless of course you think you know more than him about human sex

Sanluca ....I've already explained my position
If really interested in the problems of two box admin systems, the case of Y v France 2023 is quite a good case to study. It involved a person born with absolutely no sex markers objecting to being called one thing or the other.