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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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52 replies

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 18:03

5 years ago I listened to BBC Radio 2 tell me that I should not refer to myself as a breastfeeding mother but rather a chest feeding birthing person. As a mother of a 6 month old at the time, who had battled with a latch and was proud for breastfeeding, I was outraged. This was the first I had heard of this.

I searched online for “anti trans” protests - surely this must be being fought in the public forum? Nothing. I found my way to Mr Menno - I wasn’t going mad!!

I left another prominent parent website and discovered Mumsnet. I found this forum. I have lurked and read and soaked up information.

My now 5 year old daughter is in a special school. She has autism, SPD, ARFID, is non verbal and requires personal care.

As part of her EHCP, her specialist nursery were asked “does the child identify with the gender they were born with?”. Armed with the information from this forum I logged a complaint with my LA and the question has been removed from this form.

On visiting each school prior to my daughter joining I asked if they had read, absorbed and agreed with the interim Cass Review.

At work, after returning from maternity leave, I was told that a man is now a woman and he is working towards surgery. Knowing my rights under the Maya Forstater case, without being rude, I did not hide my views from my team (while being perfectly pleasant to him).

After the Supreme Court clarification of the EQA2010, I have asked my daughter’s school if they will abide by my request for single sex care as she moves through the school.

My oldest friend asked me why I didn’t believe in gendered souls and asked if I didn’t agree with gay people. I had done my research, gave my argument, to which she said “But that means any bloke in a skirt can walk into the womens toilets?!”

My mother, from whom I learned feminism and what it means, could not understand why I was so incensed. Could not understand why I did not want my daughter to be exposed to males in the changing room. She is coming around!

To all the wonderful women here, thank you. Thank you for arming me with simple facts, for organising my thoughts, for keeping me up to date. Thank you for the wisdom, the clarity, the outlet for getting away from it all (even as a lurker!).

OP posts:
Cosmosforbreakfast · 21/05/2025 18:08

OP, thank you to YOU! You have done amazing work fighting for your daughter, challenging your employer, your mother and your friend. In doing this you are helping us all fight for our children and challenging whoever needs challenging.

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 21/05/2025 18:10

Thank you!! For being brave and strong and fearless when advocating for your daughter.

Gassylady · 21/05/2025 18:12

@Nomorebullshitnotavailable I couldn’t agree more this place has taught me so much. I have to be very careful in what I say in my work setting (NHS) but have voiced my concerns more openly as time has passed.

Gassylady · 21/05/2025 18:13

Pressed send too soon well done for advocating so well for your daughter

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 18:18

I’m so glad I finally had the courage to post, thank you to you all. No one (other than, thankfully, my husband) understands why this is such an enormous issue. I fear that I do too little, in comparison with the many, many brave women here. It has moved me to tears to just feel that my (tiny and somewhat insignificant) voice has been heard.

OP posts:
Arran2024 · 21/05/2025 18:24

I too came to this via my daughters. They are adopted. They have loads of additional needs, partlyborganic but also to do with the neglectcand abuse they experienced in their birth family. Both had ehc plans - they are adults now. They are highly vulnerable and need the scaffolding of single sex spaces when they are in the community. I couldn't believe that their needs could be pushed aside to affirm the desires of a bunch of men. I was told I was weaponising their trauma and that I should teach them to be less anxious. But it's hard wired into them. It makes me so mad that trans activists don't care at all about them.

spannasaurus · 21/05/2025 18:39

Every parent who challenges their child's school is not just making things better for their own child but for all the other children at the school. That's not tiny or insignificant.

IwantToRetire · 21/05/2025 18:42

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 18:03

5 years ago I listened to BBC Radio 2 tell me that I should not refer to myself as a breastfeeding mother but rather a chest feeding birthing person. As a mother of a 6 month old at the time, who had battled with a latch and was proud for breastfeeding, I was outraged. This was the first I had heard of this.

I searched online for “anti trans” protests - surely this must be being fought in the public forum? Nothing. I found my way to Mr Menno - I wasn’t going mad!!

I left another prominent parent website and discovered Mumsnet. I found this forum. I have lurked and read and soaked up information.

My now 5 year old daughter is in a special school. She has autism, SPD, ARFID, is non verbal and requires personal care.

As part of her EHCP, her specialist nursery were asked “does the child identify with the gender they were born with?”. Armed with the information from this forum I logged a complaint with my LA and the question has been removed from this form.

On visiting each school prior to my daughter joining I asked if they had read, absorbed and agreed with the interim Cass Review.

At work, after returning from maternity leave, I was told that a man is now a woman and he is working towards surgery. Knowing my rights under the Maya Forstater case, without being rude, I did not hide my views from my team (while being perfectly pleasant to him).

After the Supreme Court clarification of the EQA2010, I have asked my daughter’s school if they will abide by my request for single sex care as she moves through the school.

My oldest friend asked me why I didn’t believe in gendered souls and asked if I didn’t agree with gay people. I had done my research, gave my argument, to which she said “But that means any bloke in a skirt can walk into the womens toilets?!”

My mother, from whom I learned feminism and what it means, could not understand why I was so incensed. Could not understand why I did not want my daughter to be exposed to males in the changing room. She is coming around!

To all the wonderful women here, thank you. Thank you for arming me with simple facts, for organising my thoughts, for keeping me up to date. Thank you for the wisdom, the clarity, the outlet for getting away from it all (even as a lurker!).

You should also thank yourself for starting to look for the information you wanted.

Well done you!

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 18:53

Arran2024 · 21/05/2025 18:24

I too came to this via my daughters. They are adopted. They have loads of additional needs, partlyborganic but also to do with the neglectcand abuse they experienced in their birth family. Both had ehc plans - they are adults now. They are highly vulnerable and need the scaffolding of single sex spaces when they are in the community. I couldn't believe that their needs could be pushed aside to affirm the desires of a bunch of men. I was told I was weaponising their trauma and that I should teach them to be less anxious. But it's hard wired into them. It makes me so mad that trans activists don't care at all about them.

That’s horrific - “weaponising their trauma”?? Oh yes how dare we put girls and women’s needs above the desires of men. How terribly selfish and regressive of us.

OP posts:
Waitwhat23 · 21/05/2025 18:53

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 18:18

I’m so glad I finally had the courage to post, thank you to you all. No one (other than, thankfully, my husband) understands why this is such an enormous issue. I fear that I do too little, in comparison with the many, many brave women here. It has moved me to tears to just feel that my (tiny and somewhat insignificant) voice has been heard.

You've actually done a hell of a lot. Well done to you!

But no contribution is too tiny or insignificant in this fight - don't do yourself down. For all the lurkers, every email sent to an elected representative, every conversation started where there's even a possibility that the other person will start a thought process of 'hang on', every penny put towards a crowdfunder, every challenging of a policy etc etc is important and significant.

Davros · 21/05/2025 19:00

@Nomorebullshitnotavailable I think you are amazing 👏

RedToothBrush · 21/05/2025 19:01

No thank you.

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 19:15

It was because of the notice from this forum that I emailed our MP recently, with a personalised version of the Sex Matters text. I’ll try to copy and paste his reply.

OP posts:
Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 19:17

Reply from the MP:

Thank you for contacting me about recording data on sex and gender.

Last year, the previous Government commissioned Professor Alice Sullivan to conduct an independent review of the accuracy of public data on biological sex and gender. Professor Sullivan was tasked with identifying obstacles to accurate data collection and research on sex and on gender identity and setting out good practice guidance.

I am grateful to Professor Sullivan for her work, the first part of which was published by the Government earlier this year. It makes for damning reading – cancer screenings have been missed and criminal convictions overlooked because public bodies have conflated the concepts of biological sex and gender.

Public bodies should be collecting data based on biological sex. In the NHS, there is a real risk to patients when doctors are not aware whether someone is male or female, especially when it comes to clinical care, sex-specific cancer screening, and safeguarding.

As Professor Sullivan has made clear, this is not an either-or between sex and gender. Where it is appropriate, separate data can be collected on transgender and gender-diverse identities.

The Opposition tabled amendments to the Data Bill which would have the Government accept Professor Sullivan’s recommendations, requiring police forces and doctors to record the sex of offenders and patients and tightening up best practice in light of safeguarding concerns. For the reasons I have given, recording biological sex makes sense. I expect the Government to accept these independent recommendations.

I am grateful to you for taking the time to contact me.

OP posts:
JellySaurus · 21/05/2025 19:40

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 18:18

I’m so glad I finally had the courage to post, thank you to you all. No one (other than, thankfully, my husband) understands why this is such an enormous issue. I fear that I do too little, in comparison with the many, many brave women here. It has moved me to tears to just feel that my (tiny and somewhat insignificant) voice has been heard.

You have done masses. By advocating for your dd, an gf therefore positively influencing school policies, you have advocated for all the children in her school. Well done!

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 19:46

JellySaurus · 21/05/2025 19:40

You have done masses. By advocating for your dd, an gf therefore positively influencing school policies, you have advocated for all the children in her school. Well done!

Thank you so much. I can’t tell you what a relief this thread is. Outside of my house it feels like no one agrees and I just don’t know why, it feels so obvious!!

OP posts:
MrsOvertonsWindow · 21/05/2025 19:58

What a wonderful thread. Thank you OP and well done for advocating for your daughter so powerfully.
You and all women who are challenging this oppressive and bullying ideology are helping to return society to sanity. Remember this all started with #nodebate, women know your place. But we've successfully stood up to the threats, the intimidation, the bullying and coercive control. And our daughters will be safer for that.

Flowers
TheywontletmehavethenameIwant · 21/05/2025 20:02

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 19:17

Reply from the MP:

Thank you for contacting me about recording data on sex and gender.

Last year, the previous Government commissioned Professor Alice Sullivan to conduct an independent review of the accuracy of public data on biological sex and gender. Professor Sullivan was tasked with identifying obstacles to accurate data collection and research on sex and on gender identity and setting out good practice guidance.

I am grateful to Professor Sullivan for her work, the first part of which was published by the Government earlier this year. It makes for damning reading – cancer screenings have been missed and criminal convictions overlooked because public bodies have conflated the concepts of biological sex and gender.

Public bodies should be collecting data based on biological sex. In the NHS, there is a real risk to patients when doctors are not aware whether someone is male or female, especially when it comes to clinical care, sex-specific cancer screening, and safeguarding.

As Professor Sullivan has made clear, this is not an either-or between sex and gender. Where it is appropriate, separate data can be collected on transgender and gender-diverse identities.

The Opposition tabled amendments to the Data Bill which would have the Government accept Professor Sullivan’s recommendations, requiring police forces and doctors to record the sex of offenders and patients and tightening up best practice in light of safeguarding concerns. For the reasons I have given, recording biological sex makes sense. I expect the Government to accept these independent recommendations.

I am grateful to you for taking the time to contact me.

Thanks for your post, I share you appreciation for all the information I've learned on this site.
That was a good response from your MP, unfortunately their expectations were not meet, the response from mine is below.
.
.
.
.
.
.
I've got a rubbish MP.

I've copied and pasted some of your MP's response into my file, so if my MP does reply, I can show him how a real MP thinks, maybe mine will learn something.

334bu · 21/05/2025 20:04

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 18:18

I’m so glad I finally had the courage to post, thank you to you all. No one (other than, thankfully, my husband) understands why this is such an enormous issue. I fear that I do too little, in comparison with the many, many brave women here. It has moved me to tears to just feel that my (tiny and somewhat insignificant) voice has been heard.

Nothing insignificant in you bravely advocating for your daughter, especially when merely stating these truths has and still is labelled " on the wrong side of history" Well done !💐⭐

murasaki · 21/05/2025 20:06

Good work OP, your daughter is lucky to have you.

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 20:07

MrsOvertonsWindow · 21/05/2025 19:58

What a wonderful thread. Thank you OP and well done for advocating for your daughter so powerfully.
You and all women who are challenging this oppressive and bullying ideology are helping to return society to sanity. Remember this all started with #nodebate, women know your place. But we've successfully stood up to the threats, the intimidation, the bullying and coercive control. And our daughters will be safer for that.

Flowers

This means a lot, thank you. I’ve never been one to agree to no debate and it’s been so heartening over the years to see I’m not the only one.

I’ve felt I’m going crazy at times, I haven’t understood how other people can’t see the natural implications of this. I’ve obsessed and researched and argued…and STILL some people cannot see how children and women are affected.

OP posts:
Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 20:09

TheywontletmehavethenameIwant · 21/05/2025 20:02

Thanks for your post, I share you appreciation for all the information I've learned on this site.
That was a good response from your MP, unfortunately their expectations were not meet, the response from mine is below.
.
.
.
.
.
.
I've got a rubbish MP.

I've copied and pasted some of your MP's response into my file, so if my MP does reply, I can show him how a real MP thinks, maybe mine will learn something.

Edited

That’s super, I’m glad it was of some help

OP posts:
RedToothBrush · 21/05/2025 20:09

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 20:07

This means a lot, thank you. I’ve never been one to agree to no debate and it’s been so heartening over the years to see I’m not the only one.

I’ve felt I’m going crazy at times, I haven’t understood how other people can’t see the natural implications of this. I’ve obsessed and researched and argued…and STILL some people cannot see how children and women are affected.

Cannot see or don't want to see?

IsoldeWagner · 21/05/2025 20:11

Well done you, @Nomorebullshitnotavailable ! You sound like a brilliant Mum. You've faced many challenges, but be strong knowing that there is a legion of strong, determined and intelligent women who will support you.
Excellent 👌!

Nomorebullshitnotavailable · 21/05/2025 20:16

RedToothBrush · 21/05/2025 20:09

Cannot see or don't want to see?

They don’t want to see, do they? Yet again women’s voices, needs and safety is put aside because The Men Have Spoken. To see beneath the veil and risk ostracisation is frightening.

OP posts: