Women's Hour - TRA barrister on

[Apollo441]

Anyone care to discuss the content of today's women's hour. They had RMW on who's interpretation of the Supreme Court judgement seems questionable. Please stick to discussing content as we have already had a thread deleted.

This argument that "it will be outing to use the male spaces" - why?

Surely to TRAs that means that both M and F spaces are mixed gender.

Both male men and male women will be going into the males, and female men and female women will be going into the females.

Why is sex suddenly relevant to TRAs? It's how you identify inside yourself that is the defining thing about a person, isn't that their position?

Female men?

It’s all a bloody grift as far as I can tell. The whole shebang / herbang

I have had a career change this afternoon - if anyone is interested I'm at SirChenjins@TransRightsBarristersRUs

I've decided to identify as a legal specialist and am now available for all sorts of lawyer-type questions relating to the rights of men to use women's toilets. I especially want to hear from you if you're a man with nice hair who wears pretty dresses and who's never been challenged in toilets by women before.

Why has he kept his man's voice? I don't get it

Because he didn’t want to lose any gravitas in the courtroom.

His words, not mine!

This argument that "it will be outing to use the male spaces" - why?

As i always say: all this bollocks about "it will be outing". They out themselves 99.9% of the time. Even if it wasn't in the public domain, who would be surprised to learn that some of the most prominent TW aren't actually women at all?

There is an issue with the outing themselves argument beyond the obvious one (that hardly any of them pass in the first place).

By talking about 'passing' and 'outing', they are admitting that they are passing themselves off as someone they are not. That the whole idea of a trans identity is based on pretending to be the opposite sex. Nobody has yet convincingly explained why it is beneficial to the whole of society to have a group of people who are pretending to be something they are not, while everyone else is expected to play along with the pretence. They have never explained why it is less harmful for society as a whole that everyone plays along rather than 'outs' the person (i.e. notices the correct sex of the person).

Beyond reasonable doubt and all that - as if proof were needed.

I once saw RMW being interviewed with a GC person, can’t now remember who it was. The interviewer pressed the GC woman about how they saw RMW and eventually said they ‘read’ RMW as male. RMW looked utterly gobsmacked. Transwomen often think they pass when they really don’t

Memoryhole I think that was possibly Maya Forstator, RMW self-described as “somatically female” or somesuch weirdness. Stand by for link.

Have some lovely Mr Menno

I think this is where the discussion on voices came from.

https://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/essays/gender-wars-two-opposing-perspectives-on-the-trans-and-womens-rights-debate

'...while I look female, I sound male as I have done little to alter my speaking voice, as it is something I rely on in my job as a barrister.'

Well, I disagree with the first assertion, but I understand the argument is that surgery might have risked damaging vocal chords, which might have impinged on work. To be fair, that doesn't necessarily mean that RMW deliberately wished to retain a male voice. Possibly just that RMW didn't want to have a damaged voice.

https://archive.ph/P6ObC

Maya’s face throughout that interview was gold.

It is interesting how often transwomen don't change their voices. They place great importance on their bodies and faces and general appearance, why not the voice? I understand not wanting risky surgery but some level of training is possible without surgery I'd imagine.

Third spaces would have plenty of women in them, it would be a mixed sex space.

It's all bollocks.

They want to be with the women who say no, in a room of women in a state of undress, with the word 'women' on the door. Otherwise the buzz just isn't there. I'm afraid that's all this is. Third spaces cock block. End of.

@ChimpanzeeThatMonkeyNews i just rewatched it, the debate was about the need for clarification of the PC of sex.

and now we have it

no wonder RMW is pissed of as finally he lost the argument.

Oh he claimed the gym he attends asked the wims if they were okay with his presence, and apparently they were fine with it.

My arse.

Indeed.

Yes that was the one. Thank you. RMW give a ‘Buttergasp’ ievel of a response reaction

They have never explained why it is less harmful for society as a whole that everyone plays along rather than 'outs' the person (i.e. notices the correct sex of the person).

They haven't explained why because there's no good argument. It's clearly much better for safeguarding of women and children for people not to lie about their sex and for everyone else not to have to pretend.

It's unpleasant to call a man a man?

It's unpleasant to require a woman to lie for a man's ego.

RMW expressly said they would continue using the facilities they always have done, whilst 'living as a woman' so they'll be using the ladies loo, even though the SC have said no men should use a single sex space provided for women....a barrister openly breaking the law is not a good look

But why? They're both mixed gender spaces now. To a person who believes gender is relevant and sex isn't, what is the difference?

RMW is proving that they do, actually, think there is a difference between female mixed-gender spaces and male mixed-gender spaces.

Exactly as we do and exactly why we've been fighting. Yet RMW is still dishonest enough to say that we are wrong.