It’s all a bit ‘cringe’

[lnks]

Has anyone else with teenagers noticed how they seem to think the whole trans movement is just a bit ‘cringe’ — as my 15yo DD would put it?
They’re just not taken in by it at all. If anything, they see it as attention-seeking and I can see my dd and her friend’s inwardly eye roll when they’re talking about it. It gives me hope for the future generations

My 14yo DD and her friends all think it’s “cringe” and a bit attention seeker-ish, however we live very close to a very high interest teenage transgender murder case and so, understandably, the ripples from that are still very palpable.

I agree.

FWIW @napody I have a 18 year old who is GC. He believes that if a boy want to change his name and wear make up and dresses then they should crack on but going to the girls loos and changing rooms is unacceptable because a boy in a dress is a boy. (And vice versa for girls)

That’s not toxic or misogynistic. You don’t have to be a feminist to think that males wanting to use female changing rooms is fundamentally weird and wrong.

I have a mixed bag my adult child definitely believes promotes and parrots TWAW she attempted to refer to me as cis and I shut that down fast she tried using the "it's old English language" argument at me I said its not how I identify you WILL respect how I identify as I respect how everyone else identifies she shut up because she knows I do with her friends

My middle 16 year old he is very black and white he tries to respect pronouns but finds it baffling he is a boy always has been doesn't understand the confusion the only time he has stepped out of his amenable personality is when a female said she was male at his school he came right out and said she isn't getting changed with us right? (They were pushing for it at the time) the school were annoyed he said the quiet bit out loud and said maybe he could get changed separately as he had a problem? He said he didn't so much have a problem as a concern that it wouldn't be safe a teacher would have to supervise (as he was doing anyway half the time because of piss poor boy behaviour) school then decided a seperate changing room for the trans was better than a male staff member being in charge of watching them get changed and they couldn't have a female staff member supervising a group of males and it all became a bit problematic they then decided that it wasn't the attention they wanted and slowly went back to being a girl....occasionally a boy when attention is wanted

12 year old no idea no opinion on anything he has sen and is definitely vulnerable to ideology but I'm watching closely

Bizarrely my 50+ child free relative is TWAW to the extreme mocks transmen but she has always been a pickme handmaiden type and proud of it

I supposed it depends on your social circle but the London MC liberal type millennials are definitely captured.

I think it’s because when we were teenagers gay marriage was the big issue (new atheism as well) so once the next social justice thing came along many assumed it was the same.

Also a lot of the arguments and rhetoric have changed over time and people haven’t clocked on. 15 years ago it was a “medical condition”, non binary/ infinity genders wasn’t a thing either. Most people aren’t aware of how bonkers it’s become.

40 year old Millennial here! Don’t think it’s a ‘millennial’ thing…
However, agree with OP, DD13 definitely sees it at as attention seeking and thinks they need MH help, so hopefully, it’s a phase in history that will be looked back on on with bewilderment and shock!

My son’s first encounter was at uni, no one was identifying as this, that and the other at his school. He always said he wouldn’t be a jerk about it but it’s not something he’s ever bought into or had any interest in (he’s twenty one). His uni friend is non-binary (male) but my son thinks it’s more attention seeking (comes from a very wealthy family so was possibly not getting much attention as a kid). My son likes ‘them’ though and says he’s not too in your face about it but he doesn’t really see the advantages of being like it.

This has been the case for the past ten odd years or so. Identical outfits, long straight hair, etc, for girls. It seems to me that this extreme gender conformity has been running alongside the 'trans' stuff. Perhaps in response partly to online social media's massive focus on appearance, filters, a pornified aesthetic, plastic surgery, etc. Perhaps also no coincidence that consumerism has been pushing heavily coded pink and blue products all that time, too. Plus the bloody 'gender reveal' stuff.

I really hope it softens a bit and kids feel more able to relax and focus on other things.

There is, I think, a section of sort of theoretical genderism that is much softer than the militant trans activist stuff. 'Nonbinary' people who are really just gender non conforming. Not about medicalisation, or changing sex. It still has some potential issues and blindspots, and could end up sending people down some rather misguided paths if they get too far into it, but will often just mean a bit of experimentation with hair dye, pronouns, and possibly sexuality while at uni, which will be quietly dropped as they progress through life.

Apparently, a speaker advocating for trans women in women’s in sport went down badly at a talk at my son’s school. It’s an all boys school, so I was pleasantly surprised that it bothered them enough to audibly object. I underestimated them. They are quite a sporty school though so I think they understand the effort that goes into training. They seem to be a step ahead of some sports bodies though.

So you've just come on here to scold women again? Referencing a right wing, anti immigration party, and conflating that with women being pleased and relieved that our definition as a sex class is in fact covered by law, really isn't the gotcha you think it is. We've had all this already, you're a bit late. I suggest you grow up ffs.

Yes, seems a bit odd this poster is compelled to visit the board to tell us all to stop 'crowing'. Again.

Perhaps marmalade can give us an approved list of topics to discuss, with notes on how they feel the tone ought to be pitched?

And also if they could specify the EXACT amount of time that we are allowed to discuss each topic, just to avoid us crowing again, because we wouldn't want that would we? Maybe they could return to each thread with a 'TIME'S UP' post, after which none of us are allowed to post, which I personally would find helpful given I have an inferior 'lady brain'.

I think you’re being very judgemental of teenage boys.

They don’t have to be your version of feminist to be realists and roll their eyes at all the trans nonsense that has been rammed down their throats.

It doesn’t make them
misogynists, or as you are now suggesting intolerant of non-conforming people or gay people.

And not everyone who goes to a grammar school is automatically middle class!

There’s a lot of projecting going on there….

My teenage son thinks it's all a load of bollocks and so do his friends.

Every age has had some extreme fads, but this one happened (past tense hopefully) to be a lot more dangerous than the usual ones involving clothing, hairstyles and music choices. First because it was more vulnerable to medicalisation and second because it was able to be fully manipulated by people with sexual fetishes. I do hope people like Starmer and Lammy look back in ten years time and do physically cringe at their ridiculous interjections. I have no sympathy for them, but I do for some of the parents, who are going to find it hard to walk back from this.

I work in a secondary school of 1500 pupils, we have a very small LGBT group....only 7 in the group and all identity as non binary. We have a couple of gay boys and 1 lesbian girl student but they do not go to the group. Apparently, they don't like the non binary kids.
All 7 have some sort of ADHD/SEN/autism in various degrees....says it all really. We have 1 trans girl who has a very troubled family history and is currently in foster care.

Absolutely!! My DC, friends DC's, and my nieces and nephews all between 12-16 y/o say it's not a "thing" really now and when the odd kid does come out as whatever-gender literally no one pays it any attention and carries on referring to them as their original name while the teachers desperately try to dish out detentions for mis-gendering and so on that no-one bothers going to 😬

How many gender neutral toilets would be needed in secondary schools do you think?
This is in addition to the unisex one at reception and disabled toilets?

In 2023, the DfE added it in to designs to say one on each floor. These type of toilets have an awful reputation.

That's not what projecting means.
No, rolling their eyes at transgenderism doesn't MAKE them misogynists. But they are exposed to a lot of misogynistic influences as you can't have failed to notice. And I think it's very important to keep the nuance and distinguish between ideology and individual.
Both misogynistic and transgender ideologies: harmful.
Young boys and girls: vulnerable to hoth in different ways.

I am writing to the DfE about the toilets as I don’t think they are risk assessed so it would be useful to have data if the trend is downwards.

I know @BundleBoogie

Shes autistic and has absolutely no time for shite. She’s awesome and smart and hilarious.

Ha, lots- am a teacher. No, plenty are not like that. But the uncritical way pps have been posting 'my teenage boys and their friends just think trans kids are weird' is not the unqualified positive they think it is.

I haven’t counted, but I reckon there are as many posts saying ‘my teenage daughter and her friends think it is all rubbish’.

Not quite sure what point you are trying to make tbh1

Totally agree with this. It's no coincidence. This feels like a potential turning point for gender stereotypes- clear language and educating about the difference between sex and gender expression could make all the difference.

To pps that think I was getting at teenage boys directly- I can see how my phrasing made it sound like that and I apologise- I know many wonderful teenage boys! But I think now the legal GC battle has been won we need to shift more of our attention to the influences of toxic masculinity- these boys are going to be running the country before long!

Those stories of teenage boys who are accepting of gay and gender non conforming peers give me hope!

Count! It's striking.

There are a few additions about very accepting teenage boys to counter the pattern I first commented on.

The first two pages:
Parents of boys: my teenage boy and his mates think it's hilarious/cringe/weird

Parents of teenage girls: my daughter and her friends know there's no such thing as changing sex but feel for kids who were drawn to trans ideology because they didn't fit in.

I was just commenting on this as a pattern.