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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

ChatGPT describes how to butter toast in the style of Judith Butler

82 replies

IwantToRetire · 26/03/2025 17:34

The act of buttering toast is not merely a neutral, mechanical operation but rather a performative enactment of breakfast itself, one that is inscribed within a broader matrix of cultural norms and expectations. To grasp this act fully, we must interrogate the implicit structures that render toast and butter legible as objects within the epistemological framework of morning consumption.

One does not simply butter toast in an autonomous, self-evident manner. Rather, the gesture is citational, reiterating a series of habitualized practices that constitute the normative boundaries of what “buttering” and “toast” mean within the hegemonic discourse of breakfast. The knife, a seemingly benign implement, operates as an extension of the subject, its movements governed by the tacit knowledge of what constitutes an appropriate distribution of butter. But whose butter? Whose toast? And who determines the adequacy of coverage, the sufficiency of spread?

To spread butter is to engage in a spatial-temporal negotiation with the toast’s surface, a surface that, like the body, is neither neutral nor inert but already implicated in the conditions of its own reception. The butter itself, melting into the porous texture, does not merely adhere but interpellates the toast as toast-that-has-been-buttered, a new ontological state that emerges through the process of application.

Yet, this process is neither universal nor without contestation. Alternative subjectivities and resistant practices—margarine, jam, dry toast—gesture toward the instability of breakfast norms, revealing the contingency of what is often taken as a given. In this sense, the act of buttering toast is not merely an individual choice but a site of discursive production, where the subject is both constituted by and constitutive of the structures that govern legibility, taste, and the performative materialization of the morning meal.

(Saw this on facebook and thought I would share as I know how highly FWR values JB's thought process. Apparently there is a whole number of these, eg how to eat a banana in the style of Judith Butler.)

OP posts:
NoviceVillager · 26/03/2025 21:49

Brilliant, that is hilarious

TempestTost · 26/03/2025 22:11

MarieDeGournay · 26/03/2025 18:44

I ran that para through Copilot [the first time I've ever used it!]:

This passage discusses a theoretical shift in understanding social and power relations. It moves from a structuralist perspective, where capital is seen as uniformly shaping social relations, to a hegemonic perspective, where power is seen as dynamic—shaped by repetition, convergence, and rearticulation. This shift emphasizes temporality and moves away from Althusserian structural totalities, focusing instead on the contingent and flexible nature of power. Hegemony is reimagined as tied to specific, ever-changing strategies and sites where power is redefined. It highlights the evolving and fluid nature of social and structural dynamics.

Now why didn't you say that in the first place, Judith Butler?Grin

Because when it's put like that it's clear it's not that interesting.

murasaki · 26/03/2025 23:25

I read both the toast version and what she wrote to DP. He pronounced both bullshit, but was more interested in the toast.

He knows full well who she is as her election as a fellow of my previous employers contributed to me leaving.

The phrase used was 'ah, that mad one again?'

ErrolTheDragon · 26/03/2025 23:53

SinnerBoy · 26/03/2025 21:19

I think the best one on that thread was the Harold Pinter one act play.

As I don't know know how to do it, I'd love to see an Alan Bennet version, hopefully with a sniping row about the proper pronunciation of scone...

I had a couple of bashes, forgot about the pronunciation the first time

Can you write instructions for making cheese scones in the style of the playwright Alan Bennett

ChatGPT said:

Cheese Scones, an Alan Bennett Recipe
(Or, A Modest Afternoon Diversion with Butter and Regret)
You’ll want the oven on first—200 degrees Celsius, gas mark six if you’ve not yet succumbed to one of those sleek modern affairs with buttons that light up in a rather knowing way.
Now, in a bowl of unassuming character (perhaps one that’s seen better days, or still bears a smear of jam from last week’s Victoria sponge), sift together 225 grams of self-raising flour with a pinch of salt. Not too much, mind, just enough to remind you of Auntie Jean’s brisk approach to seasoning.
Rub in 50 grams of butter, using your fingertips as if you were half-heartedly counting out change at the Post Office. It should resemble breadcrumbs—albeit the sort that, if found in the cutlery drawer, would prompt a brief but heartfelt sigh.
Grate 100 grams of mature cheddar, the sort that bites back a little but wouldn’t cause a scandal at the church social. Stir it in with a heavy sense of purpose.
Make a well in the centre (as one makes space in the back of a cupboard for a well-meaning but impractical gift from a relative) and pour in 150 millilitres of milk. Stir gently, bringing it together as though coaxing a reluctant Labrador in from the rain.
Turn it onto a lightly floured surface, pat it down—none of this rolling pin business, just a firm but fair hand. Cut into rounds, roughly the size of an old ten-pence piece, though obviously thicker, and place on a baking tray lined with parchment. If feeling daring, brush the tops with a little extra milk.
Bake for 12-15 minutes, until golden, puffed up slightly, and possessing an air of quiet satisfaction.
Serve warm, preferably with butter, and eaten in a kitchen where the radio drones on about things that used to cost a fraction of what they do now.
Best enjoyed in silence, or with a murmured, "Well, that’ll do."

4o
You said:

Good attempt though not sure you’ve quite caught his tone. Can you include some gentle sniping on the correct pronunciation of the word ‘scone’.

ChatGPT said:

Cheese Scones (or, A Minor Domestic Tragedy in One Act)
(A recipe by Alan Bennett, in which nothing truly awful happens, yet disappointment lingers like the smell of boiled cabbage in a church hall.)
First, preheat the oven to 200 degrees Celsius (Gas Mark 6, for those still clinging to the reassuring certainty of a dial). This gives you time to reflect on how, despite your best efforts, the kitchen remains slightly sticky.
Take 225 grams of self-raising flour and sift it into a bowl. This will seem unnecessary, but one must maintain standards, even in a world where people wear jeans to funerals. Add a pinch of salt—just enough to remind you that life is, if nothing else, a series of small disappointments.
Now, rub in 50 grams of butter using your fingertips. This should be done briskly, in the manner of someone pretending they don’t resent having to make small talk with a neighbour in the queue at the Post Office. The mixture should resemble breadcrumbs—though, let’s be honest, they’ll be the sort of uneven, slightly disappointing breadcrumbs that suggest your heart isn’t really in it.
Grate 100 grams of mature cheddar. Not the sort that comes pre-grated in a bag, for we are not animals. Stir it into the flour mixture with the resigned air of someone realising they’ve once again forgotten to buy decent tea bags.
Make a well in the centre and pour in 150 millilitres of milk. Mix together with a butter knife—none of this modern silicone nonsense—until it forms a dough. Turn it onto a lightly floured surface and gently pat it down to about an inch thick. Do not, under any circumstances, roll it out with a rolling pin, unless you wish to be silently judged by the ghosts of generations past.
Cut out rounds with a cutter, or if you can’t be bothered to look for it, a drinking glass will do. Place them on a baking tray lined with parchment and, if feeling ambitious, brush the tops with a little milk.
Bake for 12-15 minutes, or until golden and ever so slightly smug-looking. They should be left to cool slightly, but not so long that they become emblematic of missed opportunities.
Serve warm, ideally with butter and a little self-recrimination. At this point, someone will invariably attempt to start an argument about whether it’s pronounced ‘scone’ to rhyme with ‘gone’ or ‘scone’ to rhyme with ‘bone.’ The correct pronunciation, of course, is ‘scone,’ as in ‘what’s gone is gone,’ which, if you think about it, is rather poignant.
Eat in silence, or with the quiet, shared knowledge that, however they are pronounced, they are always slightly better in someone else’s house.

ErrolTheDragon · 27/03/2025 00:06

Then I thought we could do with a counterbalance to butler’s buttering so I asked:

Can you describe buttering a piece of toast in the style of a chemistry lab report

Laboratory Report: The Application of Butter to Toast

Objective:
To investigate and analyze the controlled application of butter to a toasted bread substrate, ensuring optimal spreadability and uniform coverage while minimizing structural compromise.

Materials:

  • 1 slice of bread (pre-toasted, medium brown, ~10% moisture retention)
  • 10g salted butter (room temperature, ~21°C ± 1°C)
  • 1 stainless steel butter knife (length: 15 cm, mass: 35g)
  • 1 ceramic plate (control surface)

Methodology:

  1. *Preparation of Substrate:*
The bread sample was subjected to thermal treatment via a domestic toasting apparatus (Model: Dualit 2-Slice, Setting: 4) for approximately 120 seconds, yielding a surface Maillard reaction indicative of optimal crunch-to-softness ratio. The sample was then rested for 30 seconds to allow heat dissipation and mitigate excess butter absorption.
  1. *Butter Sample Preparation:*
The butter, having undergone controlled thermal acclimatization at ambient room temperature, was deemed sufficiently pliable for application. A 10g sample was extracted using a stainless steel knife, ensuring consistent thickness and minimal fragmentation.
  1. *Application Procedure:*
The butter sample was introduced to the toast surface via a single-point deposition at the geometric center. Using a standardized lateral sweeping motion (~30° inclination, 2.5 cm/s velocity), the butter was distributed radially towards the edges. Edge regions received secondary, perpendicular sweeps to ensure full coverage and eliminate excess pooling.
  1. *Observations:*
- Initial contact resulted in a phase transition from solid to semi-liquid state (~30% liquefaction observed within 5s). - The butter exhibited a viscosity gradient, with greater absorption at high-porosity regions and surface pooling in lower-density zones. - The knife encountered intermittent textural resistance due to local topographical inconsistencies (crumb peaks). - Final coverage was estimated at ~95%, with minor butter residuals on the knife, indicating effective material deposition.

Conclusion:
The experiment successfully demonstrated the application of butter to toast with minimal structural disruption and optimal spreadability. Recommendations for future studies include the impact of pre-buttering techniques, variable butter fat percentages, and knife-heating methodologies on spread efficiency.

NoBinturongsHereMate · 27/03/2025 00:48

I suspect Alan Bennet still bakes in imperial measures. And would never make a scone as ridiculously small as a 10p piece.

NorthernBogbean · 27/03/2025 00:49

Fabulous. The Butler stuff is giving me Vietnam-style flashbacks.

IwantToRetire · 27/03/2025 01:12

Or, A Modest Afternoon Diversion with Butter and Regret

Flowers
OP posts:
Britinme · 27/03/2025 01:29

These are jewels.

SinnerBoy · 27/03/2025 06:29

ErrolTheDragon · Yesterday 23:53

Thanks for that! My favourite was the second one and like Binturong, I think he'd use ounces...

ErrolTheDragon · 27/03/2025 08:26

NoBinturongsHereMate · 27/03/2025 00:48

I suspect Alan Bennet still bakes in imperial measures. And would never make a scone as ridiculously small as a 10p piece.

Well yes, and whoever would call a florin or two bob an ‘old 10p’?

MarieDeGournay · 27/03/2025 10:00

Hmmm. I haven't panicked much about AI taking over the world and destroying humanity ['meh, it probably won't, and humanity isn't all that great anyway..'] but I am proper disturbed by the fact that ChatGPT can 'do' Alan Bennett so well.

It's time to panic. No-one and nothing is safe from AI. Run for the hills - for all the good that will do you, as we are all doomed anyway, doomed I say.. well when I say 'all', we're not all as doomed as that poor Alan Bennett chap who is now completely redundant.
Grin

borntobequiet · 27/03/2025 10:19

Britinme · 26/03/2025 18:25

I love that! Who'd have suspected AI of having a sense of humour? Or (dreadful thought) was it being serious?

I think we need an AI take on whether AI has a sense of humour. Unfortunately I have stuff to do, or I’d ask it.

IHeartHalloumi · 27/03/2025 10:44

Toast is an inherently unstable context that had shifted in both it's socioeconomics accessibility and role in the cultural zeitgeist over the millenia. Once a high status product requiring careful hand crafting with toast fork over open fire, toast is now open to all - which has clearly contributed to it's down grading through the desirability scale of breakfast goods. The failure of toast to achieve instagram worthy status is noteworthy.

One must consider the role of the toaster in trans-Atlantic relations, particularly in the context of the close adherence to the kettle - often seen in matching garb in the UK, in what is arguably a faux-heteronormative nod to traditional marital roles.

When is butter not butter? The act of keeping butter in the refrigerator, at an unnaturally low temperature simultaneously prolongs it's life whilst denying the maternal bond between cow & calf, an orphaning acted out in the difficulty in spreading cold butter

Britinme · 27/03/2025 12:08

I am now wondering if @IHeartHalloumiis a poster with a degree in sociology or whether ChatGPT has signed up to Mumsnet as part of its training.

YourAmplePlumPoster · 27/03/2025 12:14

🤣😂

fromorbit · 27/03/2025 12:14

Anyone else worried Butler’s advocacy of trans-positive views taints and discredits them? :)

EdithStourton · 27/03/2025 12:24

That's hilarious. It reminds me slightly of 'How many historians does it take to change a lightbulb?'

@ErrolTheDragon 'ever so slightly smug-looking' exactly describes a good scone.

lcakethereforeIam · 27/03/2025 13:01

There's always something janky about AI generated stuff, a 10p sized scone for example or something Judith Butler inspired that's actually readable.

ErrolTheDragon · 27/03/2025 14:03

MarieDeGournay · 27/03/2025 10:00

Hmmm. I haven't panicked much about AI taking over the world and destroying humanity ['meh, it probably won't, and humanity isn't all that great anyway..'] but I am proper disturbed by the fact that ChatGPT can 'do' Alan Bennett so well.

It's time to panic. No-one and nothing is safe from AI. Run for the hills - for all the good that will do you, as we are all doomed anyway, doomed I say.. well when I say 'all', we're not all as doomed as that poor Alan Bennett chap who is now completely redundant.
Grin

Ooh no, a nice stroll up Ilkley Moor on a moist Sunday afternoon will set you right.

SinnerBoy · 27/03/2025 14:05

With, or baht 'at?

MarieDeGournay · 27/03/2025 14:28

SinnerBoy · 27/03/2025 14:05

With, or baht 'at?

With, I reckon, if it's a moist day, otherwise baht 'at so it dun't ruin 'air-do😄

thirdfiddle · 27/03/2025 14:48

Well well, I had not flagged sociology departments as the first to be displaced by AI.

NoBinturongsHereMate · 27/03/2025 15:23

Surely they're the logical first to fall - reams of incomprehensible, unfalsifiable nonsense have been the bedrock of many a sociology career.

Kucinghitam · 27/03/2025 15:42

thirdfiddle · 27/03/2025 14:48

Well well, I had not flagged sociology departments as the first to be displaced by AI.

Long before "artificial intelligence" as we know it, they became defunct in 1996 thanks to the Postmodernism Generator. Basically, no "intelligence" was required Grin

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postmodernism_Generator

Postmodernism Generator - Wikipedia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postmodernism_Generator