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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Sonia Sodha on Fife case

48 replies

lanadelgrey · 09/02/2025 11:14

Excellent piece so I thought it needed sharing separately. It also seems to be a bit buried on the Guardian site and is in the middle of thread no7 so some people may have missed it.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/feb/09/no-woman-should-be-forced-to-change-her-clothes-in-front-of-a-trans-colleague

OP posts:
CorruptedCauldron · 09/02/2025 11:17

Excellent article. I do hope Guardian readers see it.

Greyskybluesky · 09/02/2025 11:20

Great piece. So clearly laid out.

Chersfrozenface · 09/02/2025 11:29

Well, it's in the print Observer, which has a separate editor and seems to have a slightly different editorial line from the Graun itself. (And the Observer is up for sale.)

Still, it's on the Guardian website, which is how most people access the two papers' content. So maybe some will read it and take note.

Catiette · 09/02/2025 11:45

Excellent article. Excoriating - and how could an honest account of events thus far not be?

Catiette · 09/02/2025 11:49

Currently second-most-viewed in "Opinion", and tenth-most "Across The Guardian".

Chersfrozenface · 09/02/2025 11:53

Catiette · 09/02/2025 11:49

Currently second-most-viewed in "Opinion", and tenth-most "Across The Guardian".

Good news.

Justwrong68 · 09/02/2025 11:56

Catiette · 09/02/2025 11:45

Excellent article. Excoriating - and how could an honest account of events thus far not be?

I guess something this undeniable would thus far be ignored

scandalo · 09/02/2025 11:57

Sonia Sodha is consistently brilliant. What a fantastic journalist and sane voice. I've got everything crossed for Sandie, a brave woman.

Alalalala · 09/02/2025 12:00

It’s great this is in the usually MRA-oriented Guardian.

Great article.

MarieDeGournay · 09/02/2025 12:03

I have a special kind of admiration - not a greater kind, because they have certain privileges and they are not on the front line like SP - but a special kind of admiration for journalists like Sonia Sodha who think for themselves, and, unlike so many of their colleagues, get it. And are prepared to publish and be damned.
Swimming against the tide is never easy so, as we say in Ireland, 'fair play to ya Sonia Sodha'Smile

LoopyGremlin · 09/02/2025 12:04

Let's hope this opens a few more eyes. Sandie is an incredible woman.

eatfigs · 09/02/2025 12:16

A brilliantly clear piece, shows the importance of framing situations like this in terms of reality and not transactivist beliefs. None of this "a vulnerable woman was harassed and bullied by a bigot nurse" nonsense. Thank you Sonia Sodha.

DuesToTheDirt · 09/02/2025 12:25

My knowledge of the trial has mostly been from threads on here; based on that (rather than on some of the biased headlines I've seen), the article seems like an excellent summary of the facts and the issues.

hihelenhi · 09/02/2025 12:35

I fully expect much wailing and gnashing of teeth from the usual fake progressives at the Gruaniad and among their readership (not to mention those at the Beeb and on Sky News) who appear to think women should be compelled, against their will, to abandon any sense of personal dignity or right to privacy, to undress in front of males or be forced to watch them undress because otherwise the poor ickle vulnerable 6ft 2 men will be sad and according to this patriarchal, misogynistic view, it's supposedly the job of all women make sure the men's wishes are fulfilled at all times.

Fkin pathetic. And good for Sonia for laying it out so clearly.

Women are not validation tools for men's fantasy, appropriated identities. Neither are the spaces we had to fight for for our own privacy and dignity.

worrisomeasset · 09/02/2025 12:54

Catiette · 09/02/2025 11:49

Currently second-most-viewed in "Opinion", and tenth-most "Across The Guardian".

I’ve just had a look and is now the most viewed in Opinion and fourth in Across the Guardian. There’ll be much wailing and gnashing of teeth amongst Grauniad staff, who’ll be furious that the Observer shares a website with them.

Edit: just noticed that the previous poster also used the wailing and gnashing of teeth phrase. I apologise for my repetition.

Abhannmor · 09/02/2025 13:00

Straight from the shoulder, Sonia. Great article. The Observer still has editorial independence. I see the Graun is trying to sell it off. Hmm.

Theuniversalshere1 · 09/02/2025 13:03

The thing that gets me, is it is a form of misogyny in itself. For a man who identifies as a woman, to have more leverage to be in a woman's space than a woman, who was feeling unnerved to be there,pushed out then suspended for expressing their views.

Where the man identifying as a woman, has all the rights and can use patriarchal roles to cause misogyny.

RethinkingLife · 09/02/2025 13:05

Truly excellent summary. Even tho' it's an opinion piece, I find it interesting that it must have passed lawyerly scrutiny for publication.

On the other thread, somebody mentioned that the original anonymity application also covered Searle who has an interesting role in this. My uncharitable take is that she's a flying monkey cum drama llama. My more measured response is that as lead for Patient Safety, Workforce etc. it's plausible that she had Stonewall-influenced training on which she based her guidance to Upon actions and responses, no matter how "intemperate" (to use Cunningham's description).

user1471538275 · 09/02/2025 13:22

They are asking for responses of up to 250 words to be emailed. I think it might be useful to provide them with a variety from the non gender ideological viewpoint.

I will be attempting a response.

Greyskybluesky · 09/02/2025 14:08

Someone on transgender reddit has already written to the G to complain. Apparently it's transphobic of the journalist to have referred to Upton as a man identifying as a woman!
Do they understand anything about this case at all??

mountainlow · 09/02/2025 14:57

Excellent.

Justwrong68 · 09/02/2025 14:59

I've put a comment on it, the type that they might publish. I'm outing myself!

RayonSunrise · 09/02/2025 15:11

Sonia has been shining a light on this subject for some time now. I've been really grateful for her bravery in insisting on raising these stories again and again on the Guardian's site.

EasternStandard · 09/02/2025 15:27

I haven't read it yet but I was pleased to see the headline appear on my phone

transdimensional · 09/02/2025 16:02

Abhannmor · 09/02/2025 13:00

Straight from the shoulder, Sonia. Great article. The Observer still has editorial independence. I see the Graun is trying to sell it off. Hmm.

The sale's gone through, in fact. Some time within the next few months, a separate Observer website will be set up, probably paywalled unfortunately.
The new editor, Lucy Rock (formerly deputy editor), was confirmed at the same time that the sale to Tortoise Media was confirmed, so I think the appointment was agreed with, or maybe even decided by, Tortoise, but either way it doesn't seem to represent a change in editorial line (the Observer had published good articles on this previously, though possibly this one is the best yet?).