Transgender identity to be recognised across whole EU bloc

[Sandwichgen]

Can’t link, but a European court has just ruled that if someone is recognised as the other sex in their home state, they must be recognised as such across all EU states

rumania was a hold out on this

Ruling by the WU’s highest court

One version of the story here
https://www.barrons.com/news/eu-states-must-recognise-gender-changes-obtained-in-bloc-court-52a6dfb5

NB "Brexit has no bearing on the dispute, as the amendment was obtained before the UK's actual exit from the EU."

I cannot see any implications for the UK

As posted just before your post:

NB "Brexit has no bearing on the dispute, as the amendment was obtained before the UK's actual exit from the EU."

ie the UK is included in the ruling!

@IwantToRetire I read that as: because the amendment to his documents occurred while UK was part of EU (pre Brexit) that Romania has to change his birth certificate and other docs. He is Romanian (for those who have not read this). He is also a Biology teacher apparently. What a world.

This is GRA isn't it, surely the GRA needs to be repealed entirely in all countries anyway.

re Brexit - this case has nothing to do with the UK, but the report of the decision is saying because the ammendment under which the Romania won his case was agreed whilst the UK was part of the EU.

ie this ammendment is "law" in the UK.

Is it do with the transfer of recognition from one jurisdiction to another? As i understood it, recognition (GRC) has to be from the country of your citizenship, not where you reside. (MW comes to mind)

Even then EU rules that were decided around the time we left has no effect since we are no longer members we cannot be sanctioned financially by the EU.

So to me it is neither here or there

All those supposedly educated people, making all these decisions and yet most haven't even considered (or will even listen to) the rights and feelings of over 50% of their populations - it's absolutely, overwhelmingly shocking - I'm quite scared for the future.

EU nations have to accept changes of first name and gender obtained in other countries in the bloc, the European Union's top court ruled

(Interesting that it mentions first name only?)

IMO it is saying you can change your identity in any bloc country, and this has to be recognised by any countries part of the bloc.

This did and continues to apply to the UK because we were part of the court when this became a law / regulation.

I think.

@IwantToRetire I do not actually know myself just trying to apply logic. There are two courts, one which we are tied to by virtue of treaties, the ECHR, and the EUCourt which can only bind members of the EU. Where the EU court makes a decision then the domestic jurisdictions are then bound but since we have left the UE the UK cannot be bound.

From my understanding, this was an EU ruling so will have no effect here.

The article posted earlier isn't at all clear about what this means, but this article from last year explains the bit about the UK.

https://www.ilga-europe.org/press-release/romanian-transgender-mans-landmark-case-requesting-that-romania-acknowledges-his-uk-gender-recognition-referred-to-the-court-of-justice-of-the-european-union/

This case could set a precedent for other transgender people whose gender recognition in one Member State is not being acknowledged elsewhere in the EU, harming their ability to travel freely, reside, work or study across the EU, or even to vote.

The Court will also have the opportunity to confirm that the rights that EU citizens lawfully acquired in the UK when it was still treated as a Member State, such as Arian’s gender change, are portable when those citizens wish to exercise their free movement rights.

So this doesn't mean that the UK has to accept 'gender change' of EU citizens, because we're no longer in the EU.

Since his gender certificate was acquired in the UK the EU is not imposing some legislation?

They're bringing in self ID in Germany on 1 November which is quite bad enough by itself. The idea that every other country in Europe is going to have to recognise German self ID is worse.

My answer is simply this. You can call your gender anything you like. But keep the fuck out of our sex protected places.

From the Press release:

Next, the Court explains that the refusal of a Member State to recognise a change of gender identity lawfully acquired in another Member State hinders the exercise of the right to free movement and residence. Gender, like a first name, is a fundamental element of personal identity. A divergence between identities resulting from such a refusal of recognition creates difficulties for a person in proving his or her identity in daily life as well as serious professional, administrative and private inconvenience.

Finally, the Court holds that that refusal of recognition and the fact of obliging the party concerned to initiate new proceedings for a change of gender identity in the Member State of origin, which expose him to a risk of those proceedings may lead to an outcome that is different from the outcome before the authorities of the Member State which lawfully granted that change of first name and gender identity, are not justified. In that context, it also notes that it follows from the case-law of the European Court of Human Rights that States are required to provide for a clear and foreseeable procedure for legal recognition of gender identity which allows for a change of sex.

https://curia.europa.eu/jcms/upload/docs/application/pdf/2024-10/cp240158en.pdf

The people making these decisions really don't seem to properly engage their brains.

A divergence between identities resulting from such a refusal of recognition creates difficulties for a person...

So the fact that someone wants people to indulge their fantasy that they have changed sex and some governments are reluctant to participate in this fantasy and 'create difficulties' for that person becomes the fault of the government for being rational and not at all the fault of the person living in a fantasy world.

the case-law of the European Court of Human Rights that States are required to provide for a clear and foreseeable procedure for legal recognition of gender identity which allows for a change of sex.

The European Court of Human Rights has made it mandatory for member states to indulge the fantasy of people who think they have change sex and allow "legal recognition of gender identity which allows for a change of sex".

Why have so many people fallen for this insanity?

It looks like the CJEU is taking its mandate to create uniform rules throughout the EU, its substantive equality interpretation of anti-discrimination law, and an eccentric interpretation of freedom of movement, and mixing them all together to roll out German-style self-ID across the bloc.

It doesn't quite say all member states are obliged to have German-style self-ID, just a process for recognition of gender identities, while recognising identities acquired in other member states, but in practice the way EU institutions usually work is to apply the German approach to everywhere else.

I suppose it stands or falls on the willingness of East European member states to say "the CJEU can fuck right off with that".

I'm sure that will go down well.......most EU countries have had enough of Germany telling them what to do. The EU has been fracturing for a while now.

Have I misunderstood? He (Romanian Biology teacher) was in UK and got a GRC. In 2020 so pre Brexit taking effect. Romania don't wish to change his legal documents even though UK was at that time in the EU*. The fact that it has since left makes no difference to this recent court ruling that changes in gender in one EU country applies to others. But it does not affect UK.

He got his GRC in 2020 and leaving the EU was end of Jan 2020?

I hope Romania refuses.

Well this brings a whole new meaning to Brexit transition agreement.

Presumably Romania can ignore it and the sky won't fall in.

Brexit transition agreement

But since the UK is no longer in the EU it cannot be expected to obey a ruling which only applies to EU states.

As my comment said, in relation to this case, the UK is bound because of the date the case started.