Schools referred 160 children directly to GIDS

[impossibletoday]

More than 30 were under 10

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/17/children-gender-schools-clinic-young-referrals-foi-cass/

Yes to all of this ⬆️

Interesting reading the answers back; we've since had the publication of the Cass review which centres child wellbeing and makes it clear that social transition is not a neutral act.

She seems to be ignoring/forgetting this important fact when positioning the well-being of children in her answers. Her words are much more closely aligned with the dos and don'ts of the Dentons' document, and the latter strategy documents that followed it, than with the Cass Report.

I don't expect Kemi Badenoch's politics to ever align with my own (given I'm still Lib Dem at heart) but it's provided an opportunity to see what our politicians are really like in action. She's impressive when put on the spot and would make a phenomenal opponent at the dispatch box against Keir Starmer if she's elected as leader. I hope that she is.

Schools are clearly the next front line in how this will play out, including the fight for women's rights. Reading the Denton's document really helps to highlight this. Schools aren't specifically mentioned as a strategic route but the value that they bring to trans activism strategy is hiding in plain sight within that document.

This document from 2021 (post Dentons) has been added to the currently active thread about trans activism co-opting black history:

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5fd0f29d0d626c5fb471be74/t/61b13d00236e2f7f2dbb9a36/1639005441624/Transgender+Youth+and+the+Freedom+to+Be+Ourselves.pdf

Its suggested tactics are particularly relevant to the current situation in schools. It centres around race as the way to make trans activism socially acceptable, but it's equally applicable to general curriculum reform in the current climate of political change from right to left. It also highlights the dangers (to trans rights activism) of public awareness growing.. and specifically women's sport being the weak spot.

Good points B.

Does anyone remember if she was in the chamber when Kemi was giving her fabulous speech and q and a about the trans guidelines?

That document is horrific. Such a cuckoo plot.

jfc these people are deranged.

I wonder if the FOI names schools. I'd bet a lot of money that there will be some schools referring a lot and others not at all - a lot of sensible headteachers (and senior leadership) have not broken the law, but those schools who allowed the gender zealots to take over have. Those referring a lot should be taken to court on the basis of breaching safeguarding. I hope the FOI provides more detail so parents can take legal action.

It should be possible to search for it

Though there's over 400 requests.. 😬

I don't have time but this from 2012 caught my eye.

Someone was asking about policies as far back as 2012!

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/policiesliteratureeregenderrid#incoming-290380

I also have not yet found it in the 400. The search function isn't that great.

I am reassured how many lovely sex realist women there are out there trying to hold Institutions to account for safeguarding women and girls though. Immensely cheering.

The standard of some of the responses is piss poor e.g. not answering the original question while pretending they have. Can it be taken further if they do this?

Really interesting, as is the reply to 3 regarding diagnostic questionnaires used:
Any questionnaires, surveys, or similar, issued to patients in
the course of diagnosis, treatment, or evaluation of treatment for
GID.
WE USE THE FOLLOWING STANDARDISED QUESTIONNAIRES, AS APPROPRIATE:

1. Child Behavior Checklist (CBCL)
2. Youth Self Report (YSR)
3. Teacher's Report Form (TRF)
4. The Childrens Global Assessment Scale (CGAS)
5. Kid Screen - 52 (Wellbeing)
6. Social Responsiveness Scale
7. Gender Identity Review
8. Utrecht Gender Dysphoria Scale (UGDS)
9. Body Image Scale (BIS)

10. Recalled Childhood Gender Identity Scale 11. Dimensional DSM Criteria-GID List (DDC-GID) - developed by the Dutch Gender Team

My child’s ROGD began in 2016, and we started down the referral path 2017, although weren’t actually seen until 2019, 2.5 years later. Relied on CAMHS psychiatrists (different one every time as we only saw those on 6m placements during training, so they rotated out) and had a few forms to fill in from Tavi when initially referred. However, NOT ONE of these was used. NOT ONE.

Shocking yet simultaneously not surprising. I'm getting the sense quite a lot of responses are lies of various degrees. It would be nice if there was some actual accountability for not telling the truth in these publicly funded institutions.

And of course even more accountability for the lack of professional service and harm done, so sorry this was your experience @WarriorN

@Dumbledoreslemonsherbets I think that was @CautiousLurker 's experience. Which I'm also sorry was so bad.

It was appalling @Dumbledoreslemonsherbets and @WarriorN

However am slightly heartened as the message, esp post Cass, does seem to be getting out there and I am trying to be optimistic that there will be seismic change in how kids like mine are treated going forward with people like Kemi Badenoch and Wes Streeting (ie on both sides) fighting to make this happen.

WRT my kiddo, now 19, there has been progress over the last year as being out of education and away from institutions and peer groups that actively championed all this seems to have helped. I think she is also taking on board, given the news lately, that my fierce refusal to support her going down any medicated routes was the right path. We do not expressly discuss anything trans related (politically or wrt to her own ‘identity’) but she was finally diagnosed with ADHD on top of ASD and through the service we have found an amazing psychotherapist who specialises in ADHD and supported her finding the right medication (has taken over a year to get that right). She is now going back to FT Ed to do an access course and planning on applying to uni and qualifying as a skateboard in structor on the side… and actively choosing to avoid courses/institutions where this stuff is foregrounded. An open day at a London Art college last term was interesting: a blue haired prospect was overheard chatting to another, stating her pronouns - my DD turned towards me, rolling her eyes and shaking with laughter. I was wearing my well practiced poker face.

The recent boxer saga has also been instructive - I received a 20min feminist rant that seemed to indicate she had been peaked (is that the right word if it is teen lesbian who still dresses/presents rather masc?)

So, I guess I am saying that I utterly believe the medical protocol should be watchful waiting. ASD kids take longer to grow up emotionally/socially and I am beginning to see the light at the end of the tunnel (though I have no ideal how long that tunnel is 🤣). I think psychometric inventories and investigation as set out above SHOULD have been carried out, as a benchmark process - a bit like we use the GAD ones for depression so we can monitor and measure improvement post therapy. My dd has had little to no therapeutic input. I resented that for a while, but given affirmative therapy would have been more damaging than no therapy, I am now bloody grateful the waitlist at the Tavi was so long she was never seen and that CAMHS were too inept/lacking in GI specialists that they couldn’t fuck her up even more. I’ve only just reached this position recently, though!

(Formerly BusyMummy, btw, in case my rant seems familiar - I flounced off in the summer and returned last month in my new identity!)

I'm so pleased to hear she's doing better cautious/ busy; I do remember your posts. I'm also glad you were able to get private diagnosis and steer her towards healthier environments.

Your description of the Tavi sounds like they absolutely did not ever follow their own procedures and policies. I do wonder what prompted that FOI, and why they made it in 2012.

@WarriorN I wondered that too, but do see some of the big name activists on this say that they were warning about this back then, that they’ve been in this fight for more than a decade. I feel bad that it was only when personally impacted I became ‘woke’ to it [eye roll].

There was an interesting - and lengthy TwiX post yesterday by DrP discussing whether ‘Gender Dysphoria’ is actually a differential diagnosis, given it was only added in 2013. I’ll attach the link here as I shared it.

https://x.com/JustBusyWriting/status/1825847251412877326

Lovely post @CautiousLurker. It must have taken a lot of courage to hold the line in the face of so many useful idiots in various professions pushing transitioning at your DD. So many parents are finding that their children are cutting themselves off if parents don't acquiesce and obey all demands in the face of this explosion of self harm.

One thing that we all can do is to keep records. Names, dates, copies of letters, training materials, screenshots etc. As the wheels fall off this and these vulnerable children and young people realise the full extent of the harm that's been done to them, having names, records and evidence (medics, schools, therapists, lobby groups, individuals "advising" institutions etc) may help some of them in the future court cases.

That article is a game changer! Completely blows apart Gender Dysphoria. It really needs a thread of its own. I'm just off out but if nobody's had the opportunity, I'm happy to start a thread about it this evening.

@MrsOvertonsWindow

I have started a thread. Sadly MNHQ have hidden the full text copy and paste that I did for non-TwiX users, but hopefully they will release it once it’s been ‘investigated’.

You may need to follow it up with MNHQ, unfortunately.

Was there a threaderapp or similar version that non-TwiX might consult?

The article by Dr P is absolutely astounding!!

If we care about this, we should all feedback not he Brighton trans toolkit - it's that toolkit that go the kids referred to GIDS most likely

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5142945-trans-inclusion-schools-toolkit-have-your-say

Thank you @MrsOvertonsWindow. I hope that both individual teachers and schools are sued by those poor children. Absolute dereliction of duty in every conceivable way.

I Googled the Utrecht Gender Dysphoria Scale:

https://emerge.ucsd.edu/r_3etmpkvnvszl1yi/

I must say, that sounds very scientific ...

Thank you @WarriorN and many many perimenopausal apologies @CautiousLurker

That'll teach me to post on a night of no sleep right before my perimenopausal period! I'd have no bloody chance with wrong-sex pronouns!

So delighted to hear your daughter is doing better Cautious. Well done for holding the line - it's not easy for parents at all yet I do think those who manage it will be very grateful (and their children better off) in the long term.

I always think it's a bit like when my toddler demanded I feed them ice cream for every meal. They very genuinely identified as someone who might die if they couldn't eat icecream exclusively, and lay on the floor and cried for many hours with the strength of their feelings, and made it VERY VERY clear that I was making them VERY unhappy by giving them cucumber, but at the end of the day I did know best. Even then it was harrowing as a parent but it must be many magnitudes of worse when it's a teenager and they're been groomed by others.

It's so awful this toddler tantrum ideology is indoctrinating vulnerable young people into thinking that 'affirmation only' is ever a reasonable way to conduct human relationships. It's so clearly unhealthy and abusive. It's even more awful that therapists and institutions have adopted this approach - so many young people have been failed. Every single person who's applied a tiny modicum of common sense and gone 'umm, this doesn't seem a good way to treat young people and there's no evidence...' has been so brave.

It sounds like your daughter is on the right track now Cautious I hope the end of the tunnel arrives sooner rather than later.