What is a man?

[Bannedontherun]

So piddled off with the debate that is about what a woman is.

It is so reductive, like the debate has quite literally made a journey up our collective innards, starting with our vulva, up the canal to our cervix followed by our womb and ovaries.

Tits are as side issue as we can plonk on some nice perky implants.

So as i asked what is a man?

A man is anyone who identifies as a man.

A miserable little pile of secrets

A man will tell you how powerful he is. A transgender ‘woman’ can’t answer the question because they don’t understand basic biology.

A man is someone who doesn't like it when you point out 98% of sexual and violent crimes are committed by men but can't quite articulate why they don't like it. If pushed they will often become aggressive in their behavior and fail to see the irony.

Over-represented on mumsnet (and everywhere else)

The sex class that is the default inheritor of privilege.

A man is asleep in the room next door
A man is someone I love
A man is not better at maths than me
Or map reading
A man is more anxious than me
And has a terrible memory
He won't play me at chess or scrabble or table football
(He doesn't want his pride dented)
I won't arm wrestle him
(I don't want my wrist broken)
A man has no idea what it is to be a woman

A man is the dick-owner next door who I can hear snoring, belching and farting through the walls.

Something to do with complete bollocks.

Body designed around the production of small gametes (aka sperm). Whether or not they actually can. Whether or not their testicles are internal or external or missing altogether. XY genes.

I feel like I deserve a prize since I've done in 5 lines what the IOC fat cats seem incapable of.

Of course if you're being honest it's easier.

Oh good, finally!
We should never have deigned a response to that fatuously provocative question in the first place, beyond feck off you twat!

It put us on the back foot from day one, and we've been justifying our existence ever since.

Yes! Journalists need to keep asking Kier Starmer - What is a Man?

So man is fully identity based?

What characteristics might they be identifying with?

If it burps or farts in your face and then apologises whilst laughing about it, definitely a man.
If it starts sentences with "well ACTUALLY..." Probably a man.
If it thinks doing the washing up that one time you had flu... MAN!
If it speaks over women... MAN
As for genetics... No idea.

For the bepenised amongst us, namalt blah blah blah

It’s the question that underlies the whole issue.

The definition of man is narrow, and viciously policed. You can’t be in the man box if you show any weakness - you’re a girl, a pussy, a big girl’s blouse, a cissy …I could go on and on.

It’s incredibly hard to hold on to your position in the man box even as a heterosexual dick swinger. Any small slip could lead to eviction.

In recent years a small show of emotion when winning or losing important competitions is tolerated. But there definitely isn’t room for men who feel like women. That’s why women are expected to shove up and make room.

Women dismantled their box in the early 20thC. It’s pretty much impossible now to think of anything that precludes a female from claiming space as a woman. Historically not being feminine enough lost you the protections afforded to the weaker sex and could, realistically, get you killed. Nowadays we’ve even demolished the barrier between the right and wrong type of woman.

It’s understandably baffling that women aren’t welcoming the rejects and refugees from the man box. Of course, if the definition of man could be widened to include all those born male irrespective of any expression of emotion, trait, sexual inclination or gender, it would be psychologically healthier.

Unfortunately, I think this is spot on. Which is why OP’s question is so important.

Nailed it.

I agree that men are far stricter in who they accept as their own sex. Manhood is policed much more than womanhood. There seems to be numerous ways to “fail” (obviously they are not really failing at being male) which seem to come down to what we would call macho ideals. So yes, strength, virility and power.

and lots of men the world over connect manhood with their genitalia. It’s a common euphemism for a reason.

It puts me in mind of Now You’re A Man by DVDA (Trey Parker and Matt Stone.)

To what Beforetheend said, I would add that when women sought access to higher education, the professions, Parliament and the vote, there were many years of debate about ‘the woman question’. The role of women was seen to be to marry and bring up children and how would society manage if women eschewed that? Could women do both? Were they too ‘manly’ if they did that? Would their ovaries shrink and affect reproduction? Would it end up with men tending to children and the downfall of the Empire? These were at the time big societal questions discussed in the periodicals of the day by male and female authors.

If - taking Beforetheend ‘s phrasing, we agree that women dismantled their box (and I disagree here to some extent, the box is continually re-cast) we need to be clear that when women fought for access to what were traditionally male public spaces and privileges, the word public is important here. Women did not seek to claim to be men, regardless of physiology, or seek to dismantle anything other than sex role stereotypes and the privilege that comes with the male sex role. Women sought access to male public spaces for reasons of equal citizenship and financial and legal autonomy, not because they thought they needed access tp male personal private spaces. Indeed, as part of gaining access to the public sphere, women needed female bathrooms and changing rooms and all these spaces built and their needs catered for. Female spaces in public life, in all aspects, had to be fought for, so women could be equal citizens.
Women have never claimed access to male bathrooms, male health services or male-centred counselling services to meet their political and liberation goals. They fought for their own.

So the parallel of men dismantling their box would be more like entering the aspects of life society had previously and still accords as women’s role. Men may indeed pick up their share of housework and childcare, nursing and caring jobs etc. Whether they do is another matter and there are still cultural barriers to an extent. That is the parallel of women dismantling their box. Not what a woman or man actually is, and changing the definition.

Rule 8 of Rules of misogyny.

1. Women are responsible for what men do.
2. Women saying no to men is a hate crime.
3. Women speaking for themselves are exclusionary and selfish.
4. Women’s opinions are violence against men, thus male violence against women is justified.
5. Women and Feminism must be useful to men or they are worthless.
6. Women who go around being female AT men by menstruating and breastfeeding babies deserve punishment.
7. Women should always be grateful to men for everything.
8. Men are whatever men say they are and women are whatever men say they are.
9. Men always know the “real reasons” for everything women do and say.

10. The worst thing about male violence is that it makes men look bad. 11. Whatever women suffer from, it is worse when it happens to men. 12. Women’s ability to recognize male behavior patterns is misandry. 13. Angry women are crazy. Angry men have trouble expressing themselves. 14. Women have all the rights they need: The right to remain silent. 15. Men are the default human. Women are strange subhuman others.

A man is a boy that has been around longer.

Man is defined as a human being and a woman as a female — whenever she behaves as a human being she is said to imitate the male.

Simone de Beauvoir.

Men would rather expand the definition of ‘woman’ to include ‘penis’ than expand the definition of ‘man’ to include ‘dress’.

A man is a dick.

A man is a loose, shifting constellation of biological, political and cultural phenomena which varies according to context, place & time

According to Shon Faye. Well that's what Shon thinks a woman is so I assume the same applies.