The Guardian on Angela Carini - 'An Uncomfortable watch...'

[Omlettes]

Well well well Kath Viner...
This is extraordinary the Guardian is turning, slowly, but turning. Its not the Observer either people, but the G, the paper that has actively promoted lies for 6 years on this topic, done no reporting and suppressed reporters who try.
Hadley Freeman and Suzanne Moore hats off to you, OJ must be delighted ...😂https://www.theguardian.com/sport/article/2024/aug/02/boxing-olympics-lisa-nandy-imane-khelif-lin-yu-ting

Some people need to go to spec savers i know what i can see with my own two eyes.

Great to see something which acknowledges that something is happening, but I am so disappointed in Lisa Nandy's remarks.
The biological factors are not complicated.
You cannot "balance" inclusion, fairness and safety. Safety comes first in dangerous sports. Fairness trumps inclusion every time. A robust female category with clear and rational eligibility rules promotes inclusion for women.

Maybe. I remain unconvinced at this point. Especially as both boxers competed unsuccessfully in Tokyo.

So much BS if they're going to be inclusive they need to give us all gold medals. Fucking idiots

Now thats very interesting....
thank you. All pigs at the trough apparently.

"Had modest sucess ' being the operative phrase. Shades of Lia Thomas and every other gender cheat.

Has anyone seen any footage for this fight?
Are they hiding it?
www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5133473-no-live-footage-of-lin-yu-ting-vs-sitora-turdibekova?reply=137252223

I haven't seen what form her reported dsd took, but to label someone who was a girl at birth and who has lived as a girl and a woman a cheat seems unnecessarily vindictive.

This isn't about someone clearly born Male then transitioning and demanding to compete in women's sports.

I have eyes. I watched the fight. Khelif is a man.

It's unlikely that a VSD wasn't recognised during adolescence when there was no sign of menarche etc. but puberty was underway.

@Hatfullofwillow so it is said that they were born female and have lived as a female how do we know if that is true?

From the IBA on the IOC

" For clarification on why the IOC permits athletes with competitive advantages to compete in their events, we urge interested parties to seek answers directly from the IOC. "
https://www.iba.sport/news/statement-made-by-the-international-boxing-association-regarding-athletes-disqualifications-in-world-boxing-championships-2023/

Thanks to the poster who alerted me to this

He is male.
Even if he didn't know it when he started boxing, he has known since the 2022 world championship when he failed a sex verification test the first time.
He failed again the following year.
He started an appeal at CAS but withdrew it and accepted the results of the test - XY chromosomes. This acceptance made the result legally binding.

I've no idea about the other boxer, but Khelif has documentation that shows she was born a girl and is socially & legally recognised by Algeria as a woman.

What we don't "know" is what the IAB test was that she failed and what it showed. We have Umar Kevlev who told Russian news agency Tass that it proved she had xy chromosomes. That's it.

“Lisa Nandy, the UK culture secretary, described the Olympic boxing bout between Khelif and Carini as “an incredibly uncomfortable watch”.
^^
acknowledged concern about “getting the balance right” in boxing and other sports when it comes to female competitors. But she said the “biological facts are far more complicated than is being presented on social media and in some of the speculation”.
^^
She said: “I think as sporting bodies try to get that balance between inclusion, fairness and safety, there is a role for government to make sure that they’ve got the guidance and the framework and the support to make those decisions correctly and it’s something that I’ll be talking to sporting bodies about over the coming weeks and months.”

So has Nandy changed her position now? I thought Nandy said that sporting bodies could be trusted to to use their judgement and leaving them to so so was rhe right approach a couple of weeks back?

Yeah and too many men will be caught out.

The IBA said they had tested the boxers twice, in 2022 and 2023.

https://www.iba.sport/news/statement-made-by-the-international-boxing-association-regarding-athletes-disqualifications-in-world-boxing-championships-2023/

I love their statement
"For clarification on why the IOC permits athletes with competitive advantages to compete in their events, we urge interested parties to seek answers directly from the IOC.
Yours sincerely,
International Boxing Association"😂

Things are escalating:

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/article/2024/aug/02/boxing-olympics-lisa-nandy-imane-khelif-lin-yu-ting

The Hungarian Boxing Association has protested to the International Olympic Committee over its decision to allow the Algerian fighter Imane Khelif to compete at Paris 2024, before her quarter-final bout with one of its boxers.

I dislike Orban as much as the next person, but knew Hungary would go into bat about this.

It's the 'even a stopped clock is right twice a day' thing here with him

The IOC is digging their heels in regarding the IBA decision to change the gender rules:

“The current aggression against these two athletes is based entirely on this arbitrary decision, which was taken without any proper procedure – especially considering that these athletes had been competing in top-level competition for many years.”

So because we allowed cheating for ages, no one is allowed to put procedures in place to stop it.

That article starts ok but then descends into batshittery.

what's wrong with that? it stops self id dead in its tracks if biological reality is the ultimate backstop. Cue wailing and gnashing of TRA teeth. cannot have that now, can we?

Like the meaningless womens 800m at the Rio Olympics.