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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Anneliese Dodds: what has happened to her?

116 replies

Calling · 06/07/2024 11:48

Annelise Dodds was re-elected as MP in a safe seat and I had thought that she would be Minister for Women or similar. I can't find any reference to her as chair of the Labour Party or as Minister and I checked the Labour Party website etc.
I spotted her in a red dress* at the place outside where MPs were waiting to be called to see Starmer, having been summoned, but it was confusing because she was not allowed to go forward for a while when others were (or simply was early and had to wait). She didn't seem very happy about that).

*That's how I noticed her.

OP posts:
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zibzibara · 06/07/2024 20:12

It's like how academic departments changed Women's Studies to Gender Studies. Just more erasure.

Retiredfromthere · 06/07/2024 20:14

zibzibara · 06/07/2024 15:14

They also claimed that Fergus Walsh of the BBC had blocked another journalist from emailing him, again with no evidence offered that he'd actually done that. The only screenshot they provided was cropped so you couldn't see the reason why the BBC mail system had rejected the email.

And your evidence for disbelieving the claim is ...?

ResisterOfTwaddleRex · 06/07/2024 20:24

I don't understand the attacks on journalism SEEN. They do a good job of explaining the issues to the public, and what goes on behind the scenes before stories get to us.

Over here - at the end - there's similar confusion on the role allocated to Dodds. It's not journalism SEEN being rubbish.

Do we know who the new Minister for Women will be, or if we will even have one? Maybe Minister for How I Identify. www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/5112867-do-we-know-who-the-new-minister-for-women-will-be-or-if-we-will-even-have-one-maybe-minister-for-how-i-identify

zibzibara · 06/07/2024 20:29

Retiredfromthere · 06/07/2024 20:14

And your evidence for disbelieving the claim is ...?

The screenshot they cropped is the same type of rejection message you get back from GMail if the email you sent is too large or has keywords that hit a spam filter or loads of other possible reasons.

GargoylesofBeelzebub · 06/07/2024 22:14

This is interesting.

x.com/anneliesedodds/status/1809691988280615263?s=46&t=AjtjSItRj-kgZwRzL-pdyQ

Floisme · 06/07/2024 22:52

Is this Rachel Reeves' sister?

GCAcademic · 06/07/2024 22:53

Floisme · 06/07/2024 22:52

Is this Rachel Reeves' sister?

Yes.

Calling · 06/07/2024 23:45

GargoylesofBeelzebub · 06/07/2024 22:14

Thanks. She had been Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer but that was taken away from her and now she is no longer party Chair.

Have Starmer and Dodds fallen out or something of that nature? Could 'gender' be the reason? Mind you, she is in the cabinet.

A member of her staff was asked "what is a woman? " and her answer was "it is how you feel".

OP posts:
dougalfromthemagicroundabout · 07/07/2024 00:02

DrBlackbird · 06/07/2024 20:10

🤣

She needs to be made the Minister for Centaurs.

Because that would make a lot more sense than someone who thinks women have penises being in charge of equality for women.

I mean I presume she believes in Centaurs too given the magical anti-reality thinking.

And yes, very Umbridge adjacent.

KasperBells · 07/07/2024 07:31

It will be interesting to see who he does decide to put in that role- will show what he really feels with regards to women/ women only spaces.

KasperBells · 07/07/2024 07:34

… I do also wonder if they are going for a change to the title of the role, hoping to slip that one under the radar and no one notices that ‘woman’ has been erased from the post title (because presumably it’s a bit of a ‘controversial’ word these days).

Shortshriftandlethal · 07/07/2024 08:36

DrBlackbird · 06/07/2024 20:10

whether they would remove the word 'Woman' and just have it as the 'Equalities'

If Labour follow my union’s suggestion they may well change the Equalities brief (Committee) to become the ‘Liberation’ Minister. Which though repeatedly proposed at my union meetings has not yet been accepted but give it time.

Tony Blair is currently advising him not to get bogged down in "wokeism". Hopefully he'll pay some attention to that advice

Shortshriftandlethal · 07/07/2024 08:45

zibzibara · 06/07/2024 20:12

It's like how academic departments changed Women's Studies to Gender Studies. Just more erasure.

Problem is that now 'Sisters are Doing it for Themselves' ( or to themselves, anyway).

In consenting to the easure of 'woman' they see liberation from everything associated with being a woman ( pregnancy, childbirth, childcare and their consequences, mainly). Meanwhile lots of other young women are also trying to escape from the sexualisation of women by 'becoming men'.

Men, on the other hand, are now liberated, to become the ultimate fantasy of whatever 'woman' means to them or represents, but without the downsides that actual women have no choice about.

RedToothBrush · 07/07/2024 09:10

Shortshriftandlethal · 07/07/2024 08:36

Tony Blair is currently advising him not to get bogged down in "wokeism". Hopefully he'll pay some attention to that advice

Does that mean getting rid of the minister of equalities and women completely or is it that Dodds is now toxic or is it that they can't have a department for equalities and women until they have a cabinet meeting to decide the legal definition of a woman?

RedToothBrush · 07/07/2024 09:11

There is a sense of trying to quietly bury things here though isn't there?

Shortshriftandlethal · 07/07/2024 09:58

RedToothBrush · 07/07/2024 09:10

Does that mean getting rid of the minister of equalities and women completely or is it that Dodds is now toxic or is it that they can't have a department for equalities and women until they have a cabinet meeting to decide the legal definition of a woman?

I suspect Blair refers to 'wokeism' more generally...all the identity politics stuff, and that obviously does include gender identity politics. He obviously senses, quite rightly, that the general public have no time for any of it...and the gains Labour has made could be so easily lost if they become a caricature of identitarian 'progressive' politics - U.S style.

Shortshriftandlethal · 07/07/2024 10:04

Labour can rely on the newly enlarged LIb Dem ( And Greens) party for support and votes when it comes to getting gender identity stuff through parliament, but no so the Conservatives ( what remains of them) , not so Reform.

Also it will be interesting to see how the newly elected Muslim Independents evolve - into being having to be representative of more than just the Palestinain cause/anti Israel position they were elected on. I cannot imagine this Muslim electorate are going to be too much enamoured of gender identity politics, or certain other forms of 'wokeism', either

RedToothBrush · 07/07/2024 10:13

Shortshriftandlethal · 07/07/2024 10:04

Labour can rely on the newly enlarged LIb Dem ( And Greens) party for support and votes when it comes to getting gender identity stuff through parliament, but no so the Conservatives ( what remains of them) , not so Reform.

Also it will be interesting to see how the newly elected Muslim Independents evolve - into being having to be representative of more than just the Palestinain cause/anti Israel position they were elected on. I cannot imagine this Muslim electorate are going to be too much enamoured of gender identity politics, or certain other forms of 'wokeism', either

It's really not about votes in parliament.

I will keep saying this, cos it's important to grasp,
It's always about the next election and getting votes.

The Conservative party have an identity crisis. They are likely to look towards this areas but as a separate choice from the more extreme elements of Reform.

If they can position themselves as that, then Labour may lose votes.

Equally UKIP previously capitalised heavily on Labour votes in the past, particularly in northern towns. There is still that potential for Reform to take this.

Labours position is a lot more fragile than they will admit.

Shortshriftandlethal · 07/07/2024 10:21

RedToothBrush · 07/07/2024 10:13

It's really not about votes in parliament.

I will keep saying this, cos it's important to grasp,
It's always about the next election and getting votes.

The Conservative party have an identity crisis. They are likely to look towards this areas but as a separate choice from the more extreme elements of Reform.

If they can position themselves as that, then Labour may lose votes.

Equally UKIP previously capitalised heavily on Labour votes in the past, particularly in northern towns. There is still that potential for Reform to take this.

Labours position is a lot more fragile than they will admit.

Absolutely, Labour's majority will not translate into an easy ride at all. Now they have to contend with multiple vectors of opposition.

RedToothBrush · 07/07/2024 10:37

Shortshriftandlethal · 07/07/2024 10:04

Labour can rely on the newly enlarged LIb Dem ( And Greens) party for support and votes when it comes to getting gender identity stuff through parliament, but no so the Conservatives ( what remains of them) , not so Reform.

Also it will be interesting to see how the newly elected Muslim Independents evolve - into being having to be representative of more than just the Palestinain cause/anti Israel position they were elected on. I cannot imagine this Muslim electorate are going to be too much enamoured of gender identity politics, or certain other forms of 'wokeism', either

I actually think that this vote is less about a distinct emerging Muslim vote, but more about a movement towards grass roots groups putting up Independent candidates in their local area to represent local interests.

There is already a growing trend for this in local politics. I expect that to not change.

I think one of the themes I'm seeing emerging in terms of opposition is also the narrative about the liberal elite having regained control - now this needs a bit of explaining but one of the things that came out of Trump and Brexit was this concept of the educated politician or official who didn't see things from any other viewpoint and was too arrogant to see criticism from where it came from and instead wrote it off as stupidity or bigotry. That's not simply about wokeism though. That's about education and an attitude to less well educated. The nature of this got noted as being similar to a reinvention of a class war somewhere else.

Starmer has so far appointed a number of figures that I think are probably going to go against that. Firstly Patrick Vallance as Science Minister. His pet interest isn't disease control which he's known for, but green issues. Now obviously this is an area that we need to be tackling but equally as a figure his role during COVID kind of plays into the infamous comment by Gove during the Ref about 'having enough of experts'. The ridiculous nature of the COVID restrictions hit the NW particularly hard with regional restrictions which made no sense and a sense of not understanding the reality of the workers who kept everything going.

Youve also got the return of Alan Milburn. His work in reforming the NHS was lauded but he also played a fair role in privation and PFI. So I think his return is controversial to say the least (Open Democracy have already been expressing concern about conflicts of interest too).

'Wokeism' isn't just about identity politics in my opinion. It's also about this intellectualised snobbery which is very dismissive of anything which isn't presented in a certain intellectualised way. That is also why Cass is starting to cut through - it's everything we've said here and has been ignored because it could be dismissed because it wasn't intellectualised and in a format that was acceptable to this new political class. It's all about data collection and formalisation. Which I actually support but only to a point.

If it is close minded and doesn't think to ask the crucial question of 'what are we missing? Have we covered every angle? What might not show up in our research and data? Why might it not show up?' then you miss a huge part of the issue.

Speaking to people very politically removed from me, I always find this really interesting. They have problems and issues that are valid and unaddressed, but are recognised. We have a grievance culture thats formed around it and allowed clever politicians to harness this and establish narratives that don't necessarily reflect issues but suit their agenda for power. This is because other parties have failed to adequately recognise the grievance, instead dismissing it or misinterpretating it because of a lack of capacity to listen to anything that doesn't come in 'approved language' or at a certain standard.

I still think there's been a massive lack of understanding of what the Brexit vote represented and why it happened. Those issues haven't gone away. It was never actually about Europe. Only 7% of voters voted with actual EU only related reasoning (research done shortly after the vote). It's a fascinating statistic and one that I've not really seen reflected on anywhere.

Shortshriftandlethal · 07/07/2024 11:02

Where I live, and I imagine in a lot other places too, a substantial section of the politically motivated working class population became radicalised as a result of Covid and the lockdown. Actually, I think it had already started before even that. They certainly do not appreciate being referred to as racists and bigots, or now as cranks and conspiracists. They very much see themselves as being anti establishment.

Floisme · 07/07/2024 11:06

Just to chip in about independent candidates - I voted for one after a lifetime supporting Labour, and it wasn't entirely a protest vote. I genuinely liked the idea of an MP who lived in the neighbourhood, who wouldn't have one eye on a ministerial post, whose only ambition was to represent their constituents and who would have to answer for any parliamentary decisions primarily to their neighbours and local businesses rather than to party whips.

Yes there would be drawbacks - if all MPs were selected this way, how would your form a government or an opposition? - but it's still an idea that has a lot of appeal to me in the current climate.

RethinkingLife · 07/07/2024 11:14

It's also about this intellectualised snobbery which is very dismissive of anything which isn't presented in a certain intellectualised way. That is also why Cass is starting to cut through - it's everything we've said here and has been ignored because it could be dismissed because it wasn't intellectualised and in a format that was acceptable to this new political class. It's all about data collection and formalisation. Which I actually support but only to a point.

Matt Goodwin describes the rise of the "epistemic class" that shapes the prevailing culture, conversation, politics, arts, policy in a way that means all that they survey is familiar to them but unrecognisable to others outside that group. (This overlaps with Rob Henderson's observations about luxury beliefs for which the harms accrue to others, and not those that espouse them. And Mark Fisher's Vampire's Castle.)

For much of the last half century, the new elite, whose families often descend from the professional and managerial classes, benefitted far more than others…
Shaped by their privileged family backgrounds, their educational qualifications, and their much greater ‘cultural capital’…the new elite hoovered up most of the gains from Britain’s embrace of hyper-globalisation and a political economy which was rebuilt around them, which both demanded and rewarded their skills.
They’ve benefitted culturally, too. After flooding into the creative, cultural, knowledge and public sector institutions, becoming a new “epistemic class” which creates, filters and determines what is or what is not acceptable or desirable within the national conversation, the new elite watched the prevailing culture be completely reshaped around their far more socially liberal values, tastes, political priorities, and interests.
Increasingly, when they’ve looked out at the institutions and what they create -the television programmes, films, adverts, books, museums, galleries, columns, and the national conversation more broadly- they’ve seen their worldview staring back at them while millions of others struggle to recognise their worldview at all.

https://www.mattgoodwin.org/p/rise-of-the-new-elite

Rise of the New Elite

How Britain's new ruling class lost touch with the country

https://www.mattgoodwin.org/p/rise-of-the-new-elite

UtopiaPlanitia · 07/07/2024 17:13

Shortshriftandlethal · 07/07/2024 08:36

Tony Blair is currently advising him not to get bogged down in "wokeism". Hopefully he'll pay some attention to that advice

Well, the advice comes from a man so I’m sure Kier’ll take it seriously 😏😬

WhereYouLeftIt · 07/07/2024 17:31

StickItInTheFamilyAlbum · 06/07/2024 12:30

To get back to Anneliese Dodds -
Labourlist has now been updated, and Dodds is listed as Development Minister
in the Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office.

Which looks like a demotion to me. She was a Shadow Secretary, now she's just a Minister.

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