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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Neil Gaiman accused of sexual assault

1000 replies

WandsOut · 04/07/2024 18:06

www.yahoo.com/entertainment/sandman-writer-neil-gaiman-denies-142813982.html

Story still unfolding in the news

OP posts:
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75
YellowAsteroid · 09/08/2024 17:41

Made it clear that we would no longer be stocking, promoting or supporting any of his books in any of our events.

Brava!

Binglebong · 09/08/2024 19:25

As you are in the publishing industry have you heard anything or ad anyone confess to hearing rumours?

IBelieveInFerries · 09/08/2024 20:08

notathenabutcassandra · 06/08/2024 18:34

I was 'reliably' informed that a statement was imminent days ago... No sign yet...

Do you think the lack of statement is because there is more to come out? Each time Tortoice Media release a podcast they always ask for comment from NG.

notathenabutcassandra · 10/08/2024 08:04

Binglebong · 09/08/2024 19:25

As you are in the publishing industry have you heard anything or ad anyone confess to hearing rumours?

Only since this came out. Nothing prior - I've always been a fan and couldn't have supported him if I'd heard even hints of rumours (we've had DW on our no-go list for YEARS because of the open secret in the industry about his predatory behaviour, and we've steered away from using his publishers because they know about his behaviour and have enabled it).

notathenabutcassandra · 10/08/2024 08:06

@IBelieveInFerries I hadn't actually thought of that, I think you might be on to something. The source was pretty credible and the fact that we've seen nothing could very well indicate that something new has happened in his camp...

notathenabutcassandra · 10/08/2024 08:08

Apologies for missing the counter of days without statement yesterday. It's been a bit of a week here. I do it partly to keep this thread alive so that this doesn't fade away, but thankfully people were commenting yesterday anyway. Will get back on it today.

taylorswift1989 · 10/08/2024 09:53

notathenabutcassandra · 10/08/2024 08:04

Only since this came out. Nothing prior - I've always been a fan and couldn't have supported him if I'd heard even hints of rumours (we've had DW on our no-go list for YEARS because of the open secret in the industry about his predatory behaviour, and we've steered away from using his publishers because they know about his behaviour and have enabled it).

Who's DW? (Sorry if I've missed this earlier in the thread!)

VictorianBigot · 10/08/2024 09:57

David Walliams?

notathenabutcassandra · 10/08/2024 12:46

VictorianBigot · 10/08/2024 09:57

David Walliams?

Yep! Sorry been out this morning 😊

StainlessSteelMouse · 10/08/2024 20:02

The other NG subreddit has been doing some digging.

Omlettes · 10/08/2024 20:07

taylorswift1989 · 07/08/2024 09:58

I saw a clip of Ed Sheeran saying, "If I wasn't a musician, I'd be a virgin." I don't think he's a creep at all, but it's a good example of how a lot of men seem to think - being rich or famous will "get them girls". Obviously there's a wide range there of guys who are hoping to meet one lovely person and think that being able to play guitar will do that, and men who see access to women and girls as part of their salary and bonuses.

That motivation explains his shit music.

hihelenhi · 10/08/2024 20:24

StainlessSteelMouse · 10/08/2024 20:02

The other NG subreddit has been doing some digging.

Edited

Yes, they're not letting it go. Good for them. And VERY interesting.

Isn't it amazing though, how all it takes is one thread to unravel and suddenly everything that has apparently been "known" (by whom?) for decades comes tumbling out? Just how many people were enabling him exactly and who are they? I've no doubt many were unwitting, but who were the ones who actually knew?

notathenabutcassandra · 10/08/2024 20:26

Back on it 😉

Neil Gaiman accused of sexual assault
IBelieveInFerries · 10/08/2024 21:08

notathenabutcassandra Thank you for keeping this going.

StainlessSteelMouse · 10/08/2024 21:11

hihelenhi · 10/08/2024 20:24

Yes, they're not letting it go. Good for them. And VERY interesting.

Isn't it amazing though, how all it takes is one thread to unravel and suddenly everything that has apparently been "known" (by whom?) for decades comes tumbling out? Just how many people were enabling him exactly and who are they? I've no doubt many were unwitting, but who were the ones who actually knew?

I can think of some semi-famous people who I've known - not in publishing - who I knew to be really dodgy, but who had mysteriously high reputations. I could say "I know X reasonably well, he shouldn't be allowed around young women" and be literally shouted down by people who had met him once or twice and thought he was a cool guy.

I keep thinking of that line in Flashman where the anti-hero says that once you have a reputation, good or bad, people will always want to add to it. NG has had this very carefully curated persona for a long time. These personas are really hard to deconstruct.

Also, if David Tennant pops up and claims ignorance, I will view that the same way as I view Meryl Streep launching Time's Up while claiming to have never known what her good friend Harvey Weinstein was up to.

Someone on that sub puts it very well - as a NG fan, they feel that the fans were groomed into being character witnesses for him.

Truthlikeness · 10/08/2024 21:27

A friend in publishing several years ago told me NG wasn't very pleasant - but I'd got the impression that was more in an arrogant than lecherous way. I only read American Gods - which wasn't really my cup of tea - but then I remember him writing a very self-centred blog the day of the 7/7 London bombings which really put me off him and I never read or watched anything of his again.

LilyBartsHatShop · 11/08/2024 11:30

"they feel that the fans were groomed into being character witnesses for him"
Maybe it's irrational, because I love her so so much, but I wonder if something similar didn't happen with Tori Amos?

VictorianBigot · 11/08/2024 11:55

LilyBartsHatShop · 11/08/2024 11:30

"they feel that the fans were groomed into being character witnesses for him"
Maybe it's irrational, because I love her so so much, but I wonder if something similar didn't happen with Tori Amos?

There’s some speculation on the Neil uncovered sub that she’s talking about him here:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KHe3hUnPeec&t=460s&pp=2AHMA5ACAQ%3D%3D From 8:30 onwards.

That video was uploaded 2 years ago but not sure how old the interview is. The LE graphic novel he worked on was released 2 years ago so… It seems doubtful. Not sure how much she’s talked about him since.

There’s also speculation that at least one of the rapes took place in her Cornwall home since apparently Neil stays there.

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?pp=2AHMA5ACAQ%3D%3D&t=460s&v=KHe3hUnPeec

VictorianBigot · 11/08/2024 11:58

Seems plausible

Neil Gaiman accused of sexual assault
MaidOfAle · 11/08/2024 12:56

Iamiams · 07/08/2024 19:32

Humans are a great ape species like chimps, bonobos, orangs and gorillas. They are not a monkey species.

Ook! Ook ook ook ook ook ook! 💯

🍌🍌🍌

Iamiams · 11/08/2024 14:37

Actually many chimp groups don’t eat much meat. Bonobos, gorillas and orangs are mostly vegetarian too.

Gaiman said he wanted to be a wolf. I think this may have been discussed upthread but this is a bit from his journal in 2004 which you can see online:

‘When I was a boy, when I grew up I wanted to be a wolf. I never wanted to be a wolfman. I didn't really want to be a werewolf, except for a few years in my early teens. I wanted to be a wolf, in a forest or in the world.

Later, as an adult, I remember encountering the story of Red Riding Hood in its original form, a French version that predated the cleaned-up ways of telling the tale I'd already encountered, and the bleak sexuality of the story came through: when she encounters the wolf in her grandmother's bed, he eats and drinks her grandmother with her, then tells her to take off all her clothes and throw them on the fire -she wouldn't be needing them any more, -and, finally, she joins him in the bed naked. And then, with no more ado, he eats her. And there the story stops, sometimes with a direct moral -not to talk to strangers -and sometimes without it. The story disturbed me, and I put it into Sandman, in the Serial Killers' Convention story, where it represents a number of things at once, and is also itself.

The wolf defines Red Riding Hood. He makes the story happen. Without him, she'd just be another girl on her way to her grandmother's house. And she'd leave her goodies behind, and come home, and no-one would ever have heard of her. But he's not just her wolf: he's all the wolves on the edge of the world, all the wolves in all the stories, all the wolves in all the dreams of wolves; flashing green eyes in the darkness, dangerously honest about what he wants: food, company, an appetite.

And if I could be any literary figure, I think, today, I'd be strangely happy to be him.’

So the girl is only a minor character to his exciting wolf - he really makes the ‘dangerously honest’ bit dangerously clear.

MrsWhattery · 11/08/2024 14:48

Humans are a great ape species like chimps, bonobos, orangs and gorillas. They are not a monkey species.

Hmm but we also have a "lizard brain" which means brain structures that we inherited from even earlier, that can drive some kinds of impulsive behaviour. We are most recently descended from chimp-like apes, before that from something much more like a monkey, before that something like a rat, before that a reptile and so on. Humans didn't evolve all-new parts, we retain lots of evolutionary features from much earlier creatures.

MrsWhattery · 11/08/2024 14:54

So the girl is only a minor character to his exciting wolf - he really makes the ‘dangerously honest’ bit dangerously clear.

Yes you've got to wonder about someone who explicates a very negative and dangerous idea of what the wolf means, then happily and openly identifies with it. His assessment of the story is also very one-sided. There aren't many fairy tales about wolves wandering around the woods on their own, eating deer and rabbits. You could just as well say the wolf is important/exists in the story through the lens of being Red Riding Hood and the female view of facing the world and its dangers.

VictorianBigot · 11/08/2024 15:49

MrsWhattery · 11/08/2024 14:48

Humans are a great ape species like chimps, bonobos, orangs and gorillas. They are not a monkey species.

Hmm but we also have a "lizard brain" which means brain structures that we inherited from even earlier, that can drive some kinds of impulsive behaviour. We are most recently descended from chimp-like apes, before that from something much more like a monkey, before that something like a rat, before that a reptile and so on. Humans didn't evolve all-new parts, we retain lots of evolutionary features from much earlier creatures.

The lizard brain is a myth https://cos.northeastern.edu/news/its-time-to-correct-neuroscience-myths/

DeanElderberry · 11/08/2024 17:59

The 'cleaned up' versions of Snow White the silly sod encountered are equally French and come from equally old roots, and in them Snow White well and truly 'defines' the wolf with the help of the woodsman's axe. Maybe NG should be more careful about what he wishes for.

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