Non binary children

[ArabellaScott]

I realised I haven't actually heard of such a thing as a non binary child before. I'm talking specifically about pre pubertal children.

How does a 'non binary' child present? What does it involve?

How is a 'non binary' child different from a 'trans' child?

Someone mentioned the fad there was some years ago for having what was known as "An Indigo Child". It too was fashion led, and attention seeking. though, of course, some people with unusual, obviously non conforming, autistic, or nascently gay children may well end up looking to contemporary trends and rationales to label or understand their child.

Though telling your child they have no sex is not harmless or without repercussion - either for them, or for other children around them.

They are who they are......the trend bit is in labelling the way they are as 'non binary'.

That is what all good, non invasive parents do......they just don't have to label it in such an artificial and untruthful way. Though having your child believe they can choose their sex is not a neutral act.....it is an irresponsible act which will lead to much confusion later.

When my daughter was 4 we got her a garage and some cars for her birthday and when she opened them she asked me why there wasn't a girl in the picture 😬 obviously I didn't go in to all the gender stuff with her then and I just said "because some people are silly and think that cars are just boys toys" lol she is 14 now and we do have a lot of discussions about all the gender stuff that is going on and she rolls her eyes at it. I could have easily made it an issue back then and sent her on some weird path where she is confused because she likes cars but she is a girl 🤨 I think it is the parents pushing this on to their kids at a young age. There are a few non binary and gender fluid kids at her school and I asked her not long ago why she hasn't declared to be non binary like some of her friends (I like to hear her views about the world lol) and she shrugged and said because it's a non issue and why should anybody even care what others think they are because we are all human and not that special lol urgh I realise that this post sounds like I'm bragging about my wonderful level headed daughter lol I'm not I just taught her what does and doesn't matter in this world, she has been kicked out of a couple of different classes over the last few years though for apparently having the wrong opinion about some stuff but she takes it in her stride and just comes to the conclusion that the teacher doesn't know what they are talking about. She gets frustrated that some fully grown adults believe things that are just not correct (can change sex) she isn't argumentative with them though but she has expressed her worry for humanity lol I think I have raised a mini me

There's a worrying mental health condition in some parents where they fabricate illnesses in their children.There's nothing wrong with bringing your child up avoiding sexist stereotypes. But when parents of young children (as opposed to teenagers) pretend (in the face of all the evidence) that their child is not a boy or a girl then there really should be some investigation into whether the parents are using their child to push their own personal political views / niche beliefs.

Hopefully most parents will not mean to psychologically screw up their young children, but Munchausen's Syndrome by Proxy / Fabricated Illness is definitely a thing.

www.nhs.uk/mental-health/conditions/fabricated-or-induced-illness/overview/

Parental desire is a strong thing......Some parents strongly desire to have a child of one sex or the other, and can be deeply disappointed when that child is not of that sex.

I was mistaken for a boy as a 10 year old, due to enforced short haircut and hand me downs from 2 older brothers

I think non-binary is the thin end of yet another wedge to take 'woman' away from women.
If non-binary means you are neither a man or a woman then that turns 'woman' into 'performing femininity' and conforming to female sterotypes.
So in the future all of the women who don't conform to 'performing femininity' won't be considered women any more.

Are you talking about a baby? I mean that is pretty much universally true for babies.

First comes propping up of sex based stereotypes. Next, judgemental parenting. Not many non binary children in big housing schemes. It's a load of homophobic, Patriarchal shit. The first 30 years of this century will be remembered for this.

I agree, but most people would try and reconcile the fact that they didn't get a child of their preferred sex, rather than moulding the child to either be the opposite sex or non-binary.

In a normal world, parents who did deny their child's actual sex would be considered mentally unstable, but sadly we are living in a world where they are applauded and encouraged.

Can you give some examples of these 'ambiguous' things?

That level of desire, though, can transmit itself unconsciously to the child.

There was an excellent documentary on Neflix a few years ago 'La Peite Fille'.. about a young French boy who wanted to be a girl, and was socially transitioned, in spite of reisitance from his school. His mother was very open about the fact she was devastated not to have a much longed for daughter. Children pick these things up.

I had dolls when I was a child but I also loved going next door to my friends house because her brother had a hot wheels set. I loved it.
Nobody thought it was weird.
My friend brought her DD round and DD brought a couple of Barbie dolls along. My sons spent all afternoon fighting because they all wanted to play with the barbies .
Again nobody thought it was weird.And nobody grew up to be non binary or trans. They were just having fun playing with different toys.
Oh the good old days 😌

I distinctly remember overhearing an adult conversation when I was a child in the 1970s. A family friend’s boy had asked for a doll like Tiny Tears for his birthday. The adult conversation went along the lines of shock and surprise, and then a collective “well, why not, it’s just a toy” from the entire group. The boy got the doll and he loved it and the world carried on turning. But I remember the adult reactions really well as they all processed a new bit of information and not one of them could come up with a reason against the idea. They all knew it wouldn’t make him a girl or gay. Working class Northern city if that makes any difference.

I don't want to blame it entirely on fashionable trends and attention seeking.

I can kind of see the logic partway, in that one wants to question stereotypes and sexism, and start from a position of not wanting to limit your child by imposing stereotypes on them.

I just think it then swerves suddenly into madness, declaring a 'third category' that doesn't exist, fetishising this lack of conformity (I don't in this instance mean 'fetishising' in the sexual sense, I mean in the obsessive hyper-focus sense) and for some reason deciding this means said child is part of a rainbow cult that may (god almighty, how) necessitate medical treatment.

Non conforming children is fine. What I also find baffling is that one then slaps a label on the child. It's as though we really struggle to genuinely accept a child as an individual with disparate interests and feelings, and decide that if they don't cleave to either pre-decided 'girl' stereotypes or 'boy' stereotypes, they must then be this other thing, with a flag, and a label, and a whole mythos, rather than just a unique individual (like everybody else).

I know it is piers Morgan but it is worth a listen - skip to 6 min in to hear the main points. Basically parent buying into this non binary trend & forcing into their child.

Yes. And I would suggest sharing a young child's 'identity' to the extent of waving flags about and making speeches in public on the subject is loading that child with far too much. How is that in the best interests of the child?

So as a politicians who hates the way people are limited by their sex, he’s decided not to use his position to fight sexism in society, but instead to pretend his child will never see their own genitals and twig they are a boy or girl.

What a Numpty.

And yet, paradoxically, despite them both claiming to be 'non binary', if she is involved in a sexual relationship with this non binary partner she will have a very binary choice about whether she will need to use contraceptives or not, depending on both their sexes...

I think a lot of people forget that children are people.

Is NB a mainly female thing - that is when the child / adult chooses to identify that way rather than imposed by parents?

As a former tomboy who ran with the boys at primary school and thought girl's stuff was a bit silly, isn't this just a way for girls to disassociate themselves from 'stupid girly stuff'.

All very normal, been going on for decades, now it's an ideology espoused by eminently clever and erudite luvvies.

You have just described me as a child. I didn’t care what I was, as long as I could play out with my friends (who were both male and female, and equally as unbothered).

I can’t help but wonder whether some (not all- some people have always questioned their sex) people just don’t have enough to think about, or enough freedom to work off their stress physically, so start to overthink life.

I can kind of see the logic partway, in that one wants to question stereotypes and sexism, and start from a position of not wanting to limit your child by imposing stereotypes on them.

That's exactly what 'gender critical' people do. It's not criticising gender nonconformity, it's criticising the bloody gender stereotypes.
We were using the term on this board before 'trans' issues arose - it's the logic that produced 'let toys be toys'.

There's simply no need for the swerve into declaring your child to be some sort of special case - no child should be bound by regressive stereotypes.