New sexuality/gender group set up at daughter's school - how do I respond?

[stabledoor]

My daughter is in Y8. So far her school (large suburban comprehensive) has been remarkably free of any issues around gender. But yesterday there was a notification that a new lunchtime club for those who are 'confused/questioning their sexuality/gender identity' is being started by a teacher. I wrote to the teacher immediately yesterday asking some very neutral questions around which year groups it's aimed at, what she thinks they'll do at the club, what resources or information she'll be using. The teacher has responded at length, and I can share her response, but don't want to make this first post overwhelming. I just would appreciate some help in terms of what I do next. It's raised lots of red flags for me. My daughter is very interested in these issues, and there's a big conversation (which I have been avoiding) that I need to have with her at home around gender ideology. But I feel my priority right now is to manage what's happening at school. I'm so shocked that post-Cass, a teacher still thinks it's appropriate to set up this kind of group.
Should I respond to the teacher for the moment, or should I write to the safeguarding lead? What are the points I need to be making? I'm a little overwhelmed by this whole area, and just not quite sure where to start.

This is the email I received from the teacher:

Thank you for your email enquiring about my club beginning in July. In answer to your questions the club is currently open to students in KS3-KS4 (year 7 to 10 as year 11s are sitting GCSEs), however I am thinking about branching it out to KS5 too as it may be nice for the younger students to have some older pupils to support and look up to.

I have created a google form for students to sign up to keep confidentiality and ensure only students that have registered a genuine interest are coming along. It will be held during Wednesday lunchtimes and the first session will be a chance to get to know everyone and discuss any LGBTQ+ role models they may have and what their hopes are from the club as I want the club to be for them and meet their needs. Once we have established interests and everyone's hopes we will decide on weekly topics such as music, history, reading, sport, tv and film etc etc. and we can have a designated student or students to present on the subjects each week, if that's what the pupils would like or simply have everyone discuss their knowledge and opinions on the topic, allowing students to be introduced to new interests or guided towards certain books etc. they may enjoy. Once I have gotten to know the students and what they are hoping for and how they would like it to run I will have a more structured plan, but for now I would like it to come from then and be built upon as after all it is a group for them.

In terms of resources and information I have found some brilliant resources on Just like us such as reading lists for each Key stage. Stonewall also provides some great information and resources and elop youth has fantastic mentoring services to support the wellbeing of young LGBTQ+ people. If this is something any of the students feel they will benefit from, information can be provided. I have also been in touch with a teacher from XX school who has a similar successful club to see what guidance and support she can give to make the group flourish.

I have wanted to begin the club for some time now, but it has taken a while to plan the logistics of it. I think starting as Pride month comes to an end is fitting because awareness should have been raised during PSHE/form lessons and hopefully by the end of summer the club will be well established and ready to continue successfully as of September.

I hope the above answers your questions, but if you do have any more questions or concerns please do get in touch.

Yes, I’d be worried too. What qualifications does this well-meaning teacher have to deal with such issues? The very fact she’s gone to Stonewall is a worry in and of itself.

Safe Schools Alliance has some good info:

https://safeschoolsallianceuk.net/schools-resources-and-policies/

^“Children who are questioning their sexuality may benefit from an LGB support group. However, schools should be aware that any group specifically set up to provide support on issues around sexuality is likely to be targeted by those who seek to groom and abuse children. Some children may have been groomed or exposed to inappropriate content online, and may have absorbed very harmful messages that are then shared with other children in the group. This may occur between children of the same age, or when children are grouped across a wider age range. All adults involved must be aware of these risks and have procedures in place to mitigate them.
A student support group for children who are questioning their ‘gender identity’ has a considerable number of additional safeguarding risks.
Children with gender dysphoria have clinically significant distress. Children who are experiencing this level of mental distress should not be expected to be ‘supported’ by other children, particularly those who may themselves be experiencing significant distress. It is an abject failure of safeguarding to expect clinically distressed children to provide support to other clinically distressed children; at the very least, any such support group would need to be closely supervised in a clinical setting, circumstances which clearly are not possible in a school.
In addition to the distress of gender dysphoria, children who are trans-identified are disproportionately likely to have undiagnosed autism, to have suffered sexual abuse or trauma, or have comorbid mental health issues. Again, children experiencing these issues cannot be expected to support each other outside of a closely supervised clinical setting.
It is likely that children in an LGBT support group will encourage each other to socially transition. There is no long-term evidence base to support the affirmative approach to gender, and social affirmation can lead to a gender identity becoming embedded, which in turn increases the risk that the young person will seek to medically transition in future. Schools must not create situations in which children are facilitated to encourage social transition.

• How will the school ensure that children do not encourage each other to socially transition?
• How will the school oversee children’s interactions online with groups that encourage transitioning, often by romanticising the idea of a ‘true self’ that will be publicly ‘celebrated’ once a child has transitioned?
• How will the school oversee children’s interactions online with groups that view any questioning of gender ideology as ‘transphobic’ and encourage children to separate from their parents unless they are immediately affirmed?
• How will the school oversee children’s interactions online with groups that promote adult involvement with children’s emerging sexualities? “^

Nonono, this is not a matter to be explored at a school club. This is a matter for families, GPs and the appropriate channels. Lego club, chess club, science club are all fine. This is not like those.

I can understand why you're worried. This shouldn't be a school issue, schools have already shown they're not to be trusted in this area and have bought in to the ideology.
I've no idea really where you should go with this, but I think this teacher needs pointing towards the Cass review, and there need to be discussions with the safeguarding head.

To add to some of the questions put above, how will the teacher manage/identify issues around ND/previous SA/trauma being the prominent co-morbidities around gender and body dysmorphia?

I was pointed towards SEEN on another thread - I wonder if it's worth contacting SEEN in Schools and find out if there is a local teacher/member of staff who is a member and can advocate for you?

SEENinSchools@SEENinSchools

''SEEN in Schools membership is open to teaching and non-teaching staff in UK schools and academies who support our mission and share our values, this includes teachers, teaching assistants, administrative staff, other support staff and school governors''

As others have said. This is a massive overreach with senior staff failing to exercise due diligence
I'd stop engaging with the member of staff and go straight to the Head with a formal letter / email asking for an explanation as to why they're allowing a member of staff to target children "confused/questioning their sexuality/gender identity"?

Ask for the teacher's qualifications in discussing sex, sexuality and the contested area of gender identity with children in an unstructured situation.
Ask what management supervision of this there will be?
Ask how safeguarding will operate and who will oversee it?
Ask what records will be kept and how younger children will be protected from age inappropriate issues being raised?
Ask to see details of the curriculum being used.
Ask what measures are in place to ensure older children and adults involved will be protected from any allegations of grooming younger children during discussions of sexuality with a mixed age group?
(quick list off the top of my head)

Link to the draft guidelines about gender questioning children:
https://consult.education.gov.uk/equalities-political-impartiality-anti-bullying-team/gender-questioning-children-proposed-guidance/supportingdocuments/Gender%20Questioning%20Children%20%20nonstatutory%20guidance.pdf

It's completely unacceptable - but parents are now in a stronger position as following Cass and a range of DfE guidelines about SRE, adults dabbling in socially transitioning and children's emerging sex and sexuality will now be in considerable dufficulty.

It's like a cult.

I bet a school wouldn't allow a oujaboard club. In my view imbedding a contested belief could be just as distressing and damaging (oujaboards are just a board and a whole lot of scaremongering)

I dont have children at school so on one level cant offer help in terms of who to talk to, how to raise it.

But on reading the OP cant understand how this is allowed given the recent directives about for instance, teaching self identity etc.. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-69017920

Actual Government documents
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/age-limits-introduced-to-protect-children-in-rshe
https://consult.education.gov.uk/rshe-team/review-of-the-rshe-statutory-guidance/supportingdocuments/Review%20of%20the%20Relationships%20Education%20Relationships%20and%20Sex%20Education%20RSE%20and%20Health%20Education.pdf

In the first instance as the teacher has replied to your request I think you have to respond, even if only to say what you have read raises concerns. For instance:

Is the teacher not aware that Stonewall is a contested source of information, why not LBG Alliance.

How does this proposal help children who do not see how LBG has anything to do with T & Q.

It does seem very strange that a "club" cant be set up, almost as though to get round guidance.

It sounds much more like a full on TRA wants to abuse their position to lead children to think like them

If the purpose of the club is to talk about films, videos, why does it have to be split on what at that age are uncertain ideas of who they are might become.

Surely better to have a club where all are welcomed, and all feel able to talk about different role models without having to segregate.

I am really puzzled as to how this is allowed.

And as an aside is the teacher american. Just the word "gotten" or is that something that younger people now use?

Sorry longer than I intended. So maybe a reply to teacher raising doubts. And if that doesn't lead to a fruitful discussion go higher up?

Sorry not sure this is relevant https://safeschoolsallianceuk.net/2024/06/18/our-position-as-a-safeguarding-organisation/

But could contact Safe School Alliance.

This might be useful:

https://www.transgendertrend.com/school-lgbt-club/

This is a very bad idea. The teacher is, apparently innocently, using resources from organisations which are not reputable, and is dabbling in stuff she is very unlikely to be able to able to safely contain for any of the students there. I'd go to the top on this and push safeguarding and kcsie heavily.

11 years olds getting to know 18 year olds in a sexuality club. With no structure run by someone with no experience of a club like this. What could go wrong?

As others have said - straight to the head (with the Safeguarding Lead in copy) and if you don't get adequate responses start following the school complaints policy through (I suspect they will be breaching their own Safeguarding policy) and a threat to talk to Ofstead (who don't like failures at schools around safeguarding).

Terrible idea. In addition to the resources, suggested, I would also note the google form. Ask them how they're safely storing special category data, and for their policy on such data:

ico.org.uk/for-organisations/uk-gdpr-guidance-and-resources/lawful-basis/a-guide-to-lawful-basis/lawful-basis-for-processing/special-category-data/

Sexual orientation is special category data. Depending on what else this club is doing, other areas in that link may be invoked as well.

As well as that, there are normal but extra considerations as regards data on children:

ico.org.uk/for-organisations/uk-gdpr-guidance-and-resources/childrens-information/children-and-the-uk-gdpr/what-should-our-general-approach-to-processing-children-s-personal-data-be/

Year 7 are 11-12 year olds.
Year 10 are 14-15 Year olds.

Surely that in itself is a safeguarding issue. Any discussion of sex cannot possibly be age-appropriate in a mixed-age group.

How will the teacher handle mischievous 15yo boys talking about their favourite type of porn in front of 11 year old girls? Does the teacher think this might be a turn-on for those boys? How will this be handled?

I would write a letter to the Headteacher, the schools pastoral and safeguarding leads and the local authority or Academy lead. This is not appropriate for untrained staff.

'ensure only students that have registered a genuine interest are coming along' - this bit will be worth exploring too. What on earth does it mean? Will they be welcoming gender critical children? Does 'genuine interest' mean they have to disclose all sorts of info about their sexuality/how they are questioning their sexuality? All a minefield.

This is a mistake - it is not chess, or dance - it is about fundamental identity and it is not the school's role to be delving into this.

Straight to head and governors.

The biggest concern is that the teacher has an agenda of their own.

Teachers should not be discussing with children who they might be sexually attracted to. It's a massive overreach and puts the teacher in a potentially exposed position.

It’s worse:
‘branching it out to KS5 too as it may be nice for the younger students to have some older pupils to support and look up to.’

That is 18 year olds and possibly some 19 year olds if they have been held back at all. It also is confusing as it sounds like the younger ones are there to support the older ones.

"If the purpose of the club is to talk about films, videos, why does it have to be split on what at that age are uncertain ideas of who they are might become."

This bit leapt out at me too IwantToRetire, aside from all the safeguarding issues others have raised.

Also, when I was at school, the thought of chatting about my favourite music or films in a room with a teacher or older kids would have been so offputting!

Sorry quote fail but my point still stands.

Also, when I was at school, the thought of chatting about my favourite music or films in a room with a teacher or older kids would have been so offputting!

Agreed, what I meant about a "split" was why even if you felt comfortable about your "identity" what has that got to do with films, music or whatever.

Not suggesting anyone should do this be a far more positive school club would be one where you came along (same year group) and talked about fashion, music or whatever but in the context of being gender non-conforming about clothers etc., to break down the stereotypes that the trans agenda is imposing on young people.

Without wanting to add any more presure on OP, I have this worry that if this suggestion comes from a "popular" teacher that there maybe push back, not necessarily from the school hierarchy, but other pupils finding out that OP has raised objections.

This does NOT mean OP shouldn't persue her questions, but wonder what her daughter feels about it, and could maybe give some background as to how this came about.

Are there other clubs? Do they rely on teachers setting them up?

I think I would feel happier if the school had done some sort of informal vox pops to find out if students would like clubs and if so what about.

Would any of them said what I really want is one based on LGBTQ+ to talk about music and films, and so on.

But this is coming from a teacher who seems to be on a mission.

Also from a practical point of view, the year 7, 8 and 9s shouldn't be watching 15 certificate films, and the year 10 and 11s probably don't want to watch stuff suitable for the year 7s etc. Adding in the year 12 and 13s adds in a further degree of complexity on that front.

Maybe go to the school and have an honest conversation w teacher that this is possibly semi medical inappropriate.
Tell them you're happy to have meeting with them and full board and get some others.