Rob Bryson & Ruth Jones

[CaveMum]

Just listened to the latest episode of Rob Brydon’s podcast where he interviews his long-term friend Ruth Jones.

I thought this exchange at the start was interesting - they know.

Ruth: “It's a lovely intro. Very, very nice. It always makes me interested when people describe me as an actor, because I think of myself as an actress.

Rob: I am being very politically correct.

Ruth: You are, but I always correct people's political correctness when it comes to describing me as an actress.

Rob: I'd rather say actress. I would naturally say actress.

Ruth: Thank you. And it's funny because sometimes I've been introduced or I've read an introduction to something I've been doing and they've called me an actor. I said, oh no, I'm an actress.

And they go, well, no, it's our policy to call you an actor. I go, I know, but I identify as an actress.

Rob: Once you decide to identify, won't be tied anybody who gets, I identify as five foot 10.

Why is that funny? That's what I'm identifying as. How tall am I, Ruth?

Ruth: Oh, maybe you are five foot 10. Are you?

Rob: No, I'm five foot seven. Maybe five foot six and a half now. But I'm identifying as five foot 10.

So I'll ask you again, how tall am I?

Ruth: You're five foot 10.

Rob: Thank you. We're too old for all this, aren't we?

Ruth: Oh, I don't understand it. Anyway, you can't even talk about not understanding anything, can you? You just have to go, I'm old.

I can't hear very well now. So just leave me out of the conversation. Thank you.”

From Brydon &: Ruth Jones, 13 Jun 2024
https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/brydon/id1687943454?i=1000658813656
This material may be protected by copyright.

We're too old for all this, aren't we?

Aka 'grownups'.

I think this was the start of all this insidious stuff. Making everyone "actors" "headteachers" "chair person". I've stopped all that and correctly sex the job :)

Interesting that you should say that. I've started doing the same!

There were some good ones back in the day. “Jewess” was my favourite.

Thank you for sharing this @CaveMum ( I forgot my manners for a moment there!)

Headteacher and chairs are neutral terms. Actor is applying the male term for women. It's not the same. The equivalent would be calling a woman a headmaster and a chairman.

When I started gardening professionally I advertised myself as a 'Lady Gardener' and had loads of older women get in touch. I knew what sort of customer I wanted and they knew what sort of gardener they wanted. It worked really well.

No, that's not the point here.

And back when unsexed terms were introduced, they were very necessary - the sexed terms were all too often used in very sexist ways.

And what sex is a headteacher position?

We used to have headmasters or headmistresses

sex neutral titles like headteacher are better for women, it doesn’t presume it’s a man’s role. Actor was the male title, so it would be more like using headmaster for both male and female heads, and saying “oh the title is unisex now”.

i suppose “acting professional” could be unisex, is their a unisex title that isn’t something that used to be the male one?

(they never decide we are using one title now and default to the female one, so they?)

In a similar vein, what happened to using Mr, Miss, etc?

In newspaper reports - and not reporting court cases😉- everyone seems to be referred to by surname only. E.g, Ruth Jones would be named in the first paragraph, then referred to as "Jones" throughout, rather than Miss Jones or Ruth.

I am sure it is somehow meant to imply an equality of the sexes, but to me it sounds like everyone, male or female, is in the army or in a 1950s school!

I am old though.

Sarah Michelle Gellar played the headmaster in Do Revenge

I don't want "neutral". I want headmasters and headmistresses, actresses etc.

Well if he's a man he a headmaster. If she's female she's a headmistress. Surprised you didn't know that.

Part of this happened because female versions of jobs were often given slightly sordid overtones. Actress in particular. Whereas actor sounds serious and had none of those connotations. Completely wrong, and wrong to change the word in response but I can understand why some actresses (or actors) in the past might have wanted the less loaded, more "serious sounding title" for themselves.
See also seamstresses having to rebrand themselves as sewing technicians or what-not.

Totally agree, I hate the fact we are losing actress, hostess, headmistress etc, people think this is great for equality but these terms shouldn’t be considered lesser in the first place and by not using them we are agreeing with that assumption, I don’t want gender neutral or unisex terms for everything it’s like there is no such thing as a woman…….🤔

I disagree. It's much more like the sex of the person doing the job isn't relevant. It's a post. Plumber, social worker, headteacher. Why gender some and not others?

Just noticed the typo in my thread title 😳

I don't want "neutral". I want headmasters and headmistresses, actresses etc.

Why? What terms would you like for other professions - doctors, lawyers, scientists for instance?

It's fine for people to choose these sexed terms if they want, obviously, but where there is a true neutral term and the persons sex is irrelevant to the job then why would you want sexed words?

Actress/actor is one of the few examples in which the persons sex often (though not always) matters for the role.

I disagree - if you always advertise for a 'headmaster' and always have a 'headmaster' you can't then be surprised that young children don't feel a woman can do that job.
Actor and actress are slightly different as you'd be unlikely to have a role that could be either, but for almost every job gender-neutral terminology is important (and nothing whatsoever to do with gender identity).

Headteacher was in common use way back in the mid 90s so it's not some new thing designed not to offend.

I don't want "neutral". I want headmasters and headmistresses, actresses etc.

How ridiculously petulant.

I do want neutral. I prefer headteacher as the sex of the person should be irrelevant to the role.
With actor and actress, the sex is actually important.

You're silly 😜