Germany passes Self Id law allowing infants to transition.

[StealthSpinach]

I missed this 22/4/24 article from Reduxx.
How could anyone with a heart, conscience or basic understanding of humans and humanity ever think it is right to allow this to be done to infants, toddlers, children…
Where are the doctors, scientists, child development experts who should be fighting against this madness, this evil?

https://reduxx.info/germany-passes-gender-self-identification-law-allowing-infants-to-transition-imposes-massive-fine-for-deadnaming/

There are genuinely no words for the horror of this.

Dear god this is terrible. I thought Ireland was bad.

We had a discussion about it here

Infants???
How exactly is an infant expressing how they identify? Or what their "new name" is?
Is "Bah bah waaah guh" sufficient to presume they wish for that to be their new name...?
Or do we have to wait for something more substantial such as "Batman" or "She-Ra"?

One of the dangers of Proportional Representation - which allows minority or clearly half crazed loons to exert power. It seems to be the German Greens which are, largely, behind this. Echoes of the Scottish Greens.

If parents choose to do so, they may alter the identifying information of their children from birth. The SBGG stipulates that the consent of a child is necessary from the age of five

Off their collective rockers

Here is the previous thread, where many posters contributed to the discussion about background and motives of various parties:
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5048705-selfid-law-passed-in-german-parliament?reply=134497541

The current situation in the Scotland will hopefully be watched by the German parties, too.
But this was not just from the German Greens, some other parties joined the bandwagon as well.

The election system seems fair, as it offers more possibilities for changes and various coalitions, compared to having only two major parties. The reasons for the vote mentioned in the OP don't seem to be grounded in the electoral system as such.

Oh please. Nothing much to do with PR - after all, the UK almost passed Self-ID, and under FPTP. It's more a case of low issue salience (because voters aren't familiar with the problems/think they won't be affected) leading to policy capture by a highly motivated lobby group. In effect, the different parties' LGBT groups jointly wrote the policy and other members/party leadership went along.

What fresh hell is this?

This only benefits paedos. Makes it harder to keep track of and identify children. Horrific.

What kid hasn't identified as an animal/superhero/inanimate object??

Agree

The many ramifications of this are terrifying and "mutual consent” between the child and their parents." At the age of five ???

By 5 my sons had pretended to be all sorts of shit like lions, dogs, aliens... my youngest once spent a week as a teapot.

this is ludicrous. Absolutely ludicrous.

children should be allowed their imaginations and their play without it being turned into this bullshit

There are a number of issues with this law, and various groups are trying to get the Bundesverfassungsgericht (Court of Constitutional Law) to review the law. First step would be a Normenkontrollklage, in which 25% of members of parliament can ask the Bundesverfassungsgericht to review the law. Also, single persons can fight decisions based on the law, for ex. fines received for misgendering a person.
The worst issue with this law is, that it is indeed the first time that "Geschlecht" (sex OR gender in German) is defined. And it is basically defined as Gender, which causes an avalanche of changes of definition througout the system. Wherever we thought of Sex when reading Geschlecht, we will now have to read Gender, as per the self-id law everyone can choose the sex/gender....

From the age of five. Below five, it's entirely up to the parents. There've already been testimonials from parents intent on raising their child gender-free (refusing to disclose their sex & calling them by a gender neutral first name.) Not inconceivable people like that might be tempted to officially change their infant's sex to "divers".

The current situation in the Scotland will hopefully be watched by the German parties, too.

I very much doubt that many German politicians will pay much attention at all. I know quite a few and am related to one (state politics, not country but a state with twice the population of Scotland) and most of them can't even remember not to say England or Britain when they mean Scotland. HY's resignation will have barely registered.

But those parents are parenting irresponsibly and in the face of the common sense proven by Cass

Parents raising non binary children are conducting a social experiment on their child that Cass proves is not in their best interests. Why would you try to encourage dysphoria and a medical pathway?

English and Welsh Greens too. The misogynists are such a powerful force in the Green Party that I wonder if it was deliberately infiltrated. There was never a hint of this during the 1970s-1990s when I was most active in environmental groups.

It’s not even a good fit. Environment and male sex fetishism: why?

A lot of radical people, and 'far out' ideologically motivated people joined because the Labour party/Lib Dems were too mainstream, I imagine.

@Igneococcus
But the politicians and the parties overall have research staff / analysts /strategists who are supposed to be informed and see which topics could influence the debate; they're not on their own with regard to covering all of the news.

Since the UK has Mermaids and Stonewall, there are probably similar organizations in Germany which have lobbied in the background.

I posted in the other thread about a petition which intended to convince politicians to remove some safeguards from an earlier draft of this law: amongst the signees of the petition were support groups and organizations who are long established and whose original goal was the support of women.

This means that their policies have changed, but did they change by their own account to "go with the times" or did they get guidance by a group comparable to Mermaids?

It seems the whisperers in the background aren't so much known.

There is one organization called "Bundesverband Trans*". They published a brochure about "Terfs", with subsidies by the Ministry for Family.
The German chapter of Let Women Speak is protesting against the minister and there is an open letter, asking her why women are demonized. Everyone can sign this letter.

At the end of this linked page are a couple of women's organizations who support the criticism and who are pro-women.

https://lasst-frauen-sprechen.de/frauen-nicht-terfs-offener-brief-an-lisa-paus/

German "Let Women Speak" / Lasst Frauen sprechen is lobbying the conservative parties (who voted against the law) to instigate the "Normenkontrollklage". This lawsuit at a High Court is about the fact that the new law does clash with the German constitution.

Their other course of action is to ask the German president to refuse to sign the law for the same reason.

All the contact adresses and sample letters are provided here:
https://lasst-frauen-sprechen.de/sbgg-stoppen-wir-fordern-eine-abstrakte-normenkontrollklage/

Poor Germany every trans person in the whole of Europe will be heading in their direction

there are other countries with Self ID. I'm surprised that Germany aren't looking at Spain and Switzerland for reference.