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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

NHS trust compares women who want single-sex spaces to "racists"

64 replies

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 21/04/2024 14:33

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/27444783/nhs-trust-women-sharing-loos-men-like-racism/

Sorry about it being The Sun.

Surprise surprise, it's Cambridge, home of Simon "autism is an extreme male brain" Baron-Cohen and a Rape Crisis centre that lets males answer the phones.

NHS trust likens patients worried at sharing loos with opposite sex to racists

BOSSES at an NHS trust have likened patients who object to sharing loos with people of the opposite sex to racists. Internal advice says says “concerns alone” should not stop trans people being tre…

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/27444783/nhs-trust-women-sharing-loos-men-like-racism

OP posts:
MissScarletInTheBallroom · 22/04/2024 07:38

CheeseSandwichRiskAssessment · 22/04/2024 00:05

Do they know that skin colour doesn't rape people??

They show their own racism and homophobia every time they make these arguments.

They are suggesting that they consider black women to be just as unlike white women, and lesbians just as unlike straight women, as trans women are unlike women.

Whereas we just see people who are women, because they are female - which includes black women, brown women and lesbians - versus people who are not women, because they are male.

LaLoba · 22/04/2024 08:25

nhswankers · 21/04/2024 22:09

Ahem, name changed for obvious reasons.

This is my employer. The policy is far worse than the bits quoted (though the 'compare women who don't want men on the women's ward to racists' is a highlight). It says that staff have to gaslight women patients who object, or willl be found to have breached the TWs privacy and be hauled up before a disciplinary committee. It refers to decision making about placing children under 16 according to their natal sex versus their 'true gender'. The staff policy says that a TW staff member should be allowed to use female changing rooms as soon as they 'socially transition' and female staff who object should not be listened to And that it's completely up tot the trans staff member if they don't tell anyone they're trans (informed consent anyone?). It also wrongly says that the genuine occupational qualification which would bar a man from a role, also bars a TM for the same role.

In case anyone hasn't put the two together, this is the same hospital where a Paediatric Haematology consultant sexually abused children with cancer. This hospital above all others should be shit hot on safeguarding. But no, instead they're in the Stonewall scheme and get the Kite Trust to dictate their policies, which discriminate against women and religious people and endanger children.

I have raised concerns about this policy, more than once. Each time I raise a concern, the outcome is that I need more training to better understand the needs of trans people, and the policy stays the same.The 'freedom to speak up guardian', who is meant to be outside the hospital management structure and is meant to be neutral, has pronouns in her email signature. The DEI person is a TM, as is the Unison rep. They are completely and totally captured, and if this media attention is what it takes to change this, then I'm glad it's come out in any newspaper which is willing to report it.

The GMC website has ‘ethical guidance’ for trans patients that tells doctors to ask the patient which ‘gender’ ward they prefer and to never disclose the patient’s trans status. I don’t believe anyone genuinely can’t see how that works out for women’s safety, they just don’t care.
This rot is everywhere is healthcare.

Warpspeed · 22/04/2024 08:27

nhswankers · 21/04/2024 22:09

Ahem, name changed for obvious reasons.

This is my employer. The policy is far worse than the bits quoted (though the 'compare women who don't want men on the women's ward to racists' is a highlight). It says that staff have to gaslight women patients who object, or willl be found to have breached the TWs privacy and be hauled up before a disciplinary committee. It refers to decision making about placing children under 16 according to their natal sex versus their 'true gender'. The staff policy says that a TW staff member should be allowed to use female changing rooms as soon as they 'socially transition' and female staff who object should not be listened to And that it's completely up tot the trans staff member if they don't tell anyone they're trans (informed consent anyone?). It also wrongly says that the genuine occupational qualification which would bar a man from a role, also bars a TM for the same role.

In case anyone hasn't put the two together, this is the same hospital where a Paediatric Haematology consultant sexually abused children with cancer. This hospital above all others should be shit hot on safeguarding. But no, instead they're in the Stonewall scheme and get the Kite Trust to dictate their policies, which discriminate against women and religious people and endanger children.

I have raised concerns about this policy, more than once. Each time I raise a concern, the outcome is that I need more training to better understand the needs of trans people, and the policy stays the same.The 'freedom to speak up guardian', who is meant to be outside the hospital management structure and is meant to be neutral, has pronouns in her email signature. The DEI person is a TM, as is the Unison rep. They are completely and totally captured, and if this media attention is what it takes to change this, then I'm glad it's come out in any newspaper which is willing to report it.

Also a member of staff. I had a suffragette lanyard once. Didn’t go well.

CoffeeWithCheese · 22/04/2024 08:41

The NHS is well and truly captured. My trust seems to be determined to take over the role of "leader in gender care" type shenanigans at the moment. Can't recruit for clinical staff... unless it's for the transgender team - then the money's there.

nhswankers · 22/04/2024 10:17

Warpspeed · 22/04/2024 08:27

Also a member of staff. I had a suffragette lanyard once. Didn’t go well.

I've got one which I've been too scared to wear! I keep telling myself, if others are allowed to wear rainbow lanyards and progress pride badges and pronouns badges, I can wear my suffragette colours. But I know it's not safe Sad

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 22/04/2024 11:13

nhswankers · 22/04/2024 10:17

I've got one which I've been too scared to wear! I keep telling myself, if others are allowed to wear rainbow lanyards and progress pride badges and pronouns badges, I can wear my suffragette colours. But I know it's not safe Sad

The only permissible lanyards should be the ones that say what your job role is. Political statements should not be displayed at work.

OP posts:
Isthisexpected · 22/04/2024 13:36

The 'freedom to speak up guardian', who is meant to be outside the hospital management structure and is meant to be neutral, has pronouns in her email signature. The DEI person is a TM, as is the Unison rep. They are completely and totally captured, and if this media attention is what it takes to change this, then I'm glad it's come out in any newspaper which is willing to report it.

^ huge concerns about our F2SU Guardian also. But ze/zim is a very powerful fish and seems to be untouchable. Wish this thread would get picked up to see the nonsensical reality we're enduring.

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 22/04/2024 13:38

CheeseSandwichRiskAssessment · 22/04/2024 00:05

Do they know that skin colour doesn't rape people??

Exactly!

It's clear who the racists in this are, and it ain't gender critical women.

OP posts:
CoffeeWithCheese · 22/04/2024 14:03

VitoCorleoneOfMNMafia · 22/04/2024 11:13

The only permissible lanyards should be the ones that say what your job role is. Political statements should not be displayed at work.

Edited

And not itchy ones that give people skin tags around their necks either!

MarieDeGournay · 22/04/2024 15:39

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 22/04/2024 07:38

They show their own racism and homophobia every time they make these arguments.

They are suggesting that they consider black women to be just as unlike white women, and lesbians just as unlike straight women, as trans women are unlike women.

Whereas we just see people who are women, because they are female - which includes black women, brown women and lesbians - versus people who are not women, because they are male.

Edited

Admirable clarity, MissScarletInTheBallroom, that sums up so well what's wrong with the 'sexual racists' analogy [that was Nancy Kelley late of Stonewall, wasn't it - where is she now?]

Therolledeyes · 22/04/2024 16:14

I also contacted EDI at the same place when the policy was issued (6 or so years ago) referring to gender, not sex amongst other issues as described by PP. Pointed out the various ways in which it was incorrect.
Was invited for a chat reeducation and declined due to being busy delivering the service avoiding brainwashing .

Left to work elsewhere, thankfully somewhere less captured.
Dreadful. Cambridge is difficult as noted. LWS had a reasonable turn out considering.

binaryfinery · 22/04/2024 16:23

Its hard to describe the deep lack of critical thinking that is behind comparisons of racism and wanting to exclude males from women's spaces.

So for the hard of thinking. Its racist to want to exclude black people (or insert ethnicity of your choice here) as there is no reason to think a person is more of a threat just because they are black.

Its not sexist or phobic to want to exclude men from female only spaces as there is overwhelming data that men are much more likely to assault women than other women are, and because its male abuse of women is common and so some women in female only spaces will have trauma around men being there.

nhswankers · 22/04/2024 16:31

binaryfinery · 22/04/2024 16:23

Its hard to describe the deep lack of critical thinking that is behind comparisons of racism and wanting to exclude males from women's spaces.

So for the hard of thinking. Its racist to want to exclude black people (or insert ethnicity of your choice here) as there is no reason to think a person is more of a threat just because they are black.

Its not sexist or phobic to want to exclude men from female only spaces as there is overwhelming data that men are much more likely to assault women than other women are, and because its male abuse of women is common and so some women in female only spaces will have trauma around men being there.

Plus there's the bait and switch element of it - the Trust doesn't say they offer single race wards and toilets, so no patient has any right to expect that or complain about that, if they are a racist. No one promised them they could have racist wards.

But they specifically say 'you will be in a single sex ward with single sex bathroom' in patient information, but that's a lie. If a man with a special identity wants in we will just scrap that and refuse to admit it, refuse to discuss it, and call you a bigot for not wanting it. It's abusive.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 22/04/2024 16:57

nhswankers · 22/04/2024 16:31

Plus there's the bait and switch element of it - the Trust doesn't say they offer single race wards and toilets, so no patient has any right to expect that or complain about that, if they are a racist. No one promised them they could have racist wards.

But they specifically say 'you will be in a single sex ward with single sex bathroom' in patient information, but that's a lie. If a man with a special identity wants in we will just scrap that and refuse to admit it, refuse to discuss it, and call you a bigot for not wanting it. It's abusive.

This.

If you think single sex spaces are equivalent to racial apartheid then say so and campaign to abolish them.

But if you accept that there are valid reasons why they exist, don't fucking insult and gaslight women who want to insist on them actually being single sex by suggesting that they are akin to white supremacists.

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