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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Scottish Hate Crime Bill - information and resources.

244 replies

ArabellaScott · 19/03/2024 20:39

Well. Here we go.

Disclaimer: I don't have any special expertise or knowledge. Check everything for yourself.

The Bill:

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/asp/2021/14/contents/enacted

PART 1 Aggravation of offences by prejudice

PART 2 Offence of racially aggravated harassment

PART 3 Offences relating to stirring up hatred

It's part three that is most relevant to women and feminists.

I'll just paste the whole of Part 3:

(1)A person commits an offence if—

(a)the person—

(i)behaves in a manner that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening, abusive or insulting, or

(ii)communicates to another person material that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening, abusive or insulting, and

(b)either—

(i)in doing so, the person intends to stir up hatred against a group of persons based on the group being defined by reference to race, colour, nationality (including citizenship), or ethnic or national origins, or

(ii)a reasonable person would consider the behaviour or the communication of the material to be likely to result in hatred being stirred up against such a group.

(2)A person commits an offence if—

(a)the person—

(i)behaves in a manner that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening or abusive, or

(ii)communicates to another person material that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening or abusive, and

(b)in doing so, the person intends to stir up hatred against a group of persons based on the group being defined by reference to a characteristic mentioned in subsection (3).

(3)The characteristics are—

(a)age,

(b)disability,

(c)religion or, in the case of a social or cultural group, perceived religious affiliation,

(d)sexual orientation,

(e)transgender identity,

(f)variations in sex characteristics.

(4)It is a defence for a person charged with an offence under this section to show that the behaviour or the communication of the material was, in the particular circumstances, reasonable.

(5)For the purposes of subsection (4), in determining whether behaviour or communication was reasonable, particular regard must be had to the importance of the right to freedom of expression by virtue of Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights, including the general principle that the right applies to the expression of information or ideas that offend, shock or disturb.

(6)For the purposes of subsection (4), it is shown that the behaviour or the communication of the material was, in the particular circumstances, reasonable if—

(a)evidence adduced is enough to raise an issue as to whether that is the case, and

(b)the prosecution does not prove beyond reasonable doubt that it is not the case.

(7)For the purposes of subsections (1)(a)(i) and (2)(a)(i), a person’s behaviour—

(a)includes behaviour of any kind and, in particular, things that the person says, or otherwise communicates, as well as things that the person does,

(b)may consist of—

(i)a single act, or

(ii)a course of conduct.

(8)For the purposes of subsections (1)(a)(ii) and (2)(a)(ii), the ways in which a person may communicate material to another person are by—

(a)displaying, publishing or distributing the material,

(b)giving, sending, showing or playing the material to another person,

(c)making the material available to another person in any other way.

(9)A person who commits an offence under this section is liable—

(a)on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 12 months or a fine not exceeding the statutory maximum (or both), or

(b)on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 7 years or a fine (or both).

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/asp/2021/14/contents/enacted

OP posts:
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ArabellaScott · 01/04/2024 13:50

Justme56 · 01/04/2024 12:37

Oh dear!

😆

OP posts:
lechiffre55 · 01/04/2024 14:01
Snp GIF by The Scottish Conservatives

Anyone want to guess how the inbox over at the thought crime police HQ Scotland is looking right now? I'm betting there's a lot on for whoever has to take a look through it tomorrow. I'm hoping it makes a "bing" sound every time a new one arrives.
Perhaps there will be so many that they need some sort of transport system to effectively and efficiently move them around the building.

Rainbowshit · 01/04/2024 14:02

Excellent. Wonder who "Sophie" reported?

Scottish Hate Crime Bill - information and resources.
LarkLane · 01/04/2024 14:12

Probably everyone on FWR.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 01/04/2024 14:27

Pretty sure what Willoughby did there could count as "stirring up hatred" against the trans community. It doesn't matter that Willoughby is trans themselves, see Helen Islan v Miranda Yardley.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 01/04/2024 14:28

Haha I keep posting on the wrong thread today, but I'm sure most people know what I'm referring to.

ArabellaScott · 01/04/2024 14:48

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-68703684

'"I think there has been a lot of misinformation," about the legislation, said the Victims and Community Safety Minister Siobhian Brown, before going on to claim, inaccurately, that it was "passed unanimously" by MSPs in 2021.'

Ouch.

police scotland

Scotland's new hate crime law comes into force

Police say they expect a flood of complaints, but the government insists the act provides protection.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-68703684

OP posts:
ArabellaScott · 01/04/2024 14:50

'Asked whether "misgendering" someone or making a comment about their religion would be a crime the minister replied: "This will be up to Police Scotland. I wouldn't say misgendering if you say something on social media for example it would be up to Police Scotland to determine."'

OP posts:
lechiffre55 · 01/04/2024 15:12

ArabellaScott · 01/04/2024 14:50

'Asked whether "misgendering" someone or making a comment about their religion would be a crime the minister replied: "This will be up to Police Scotland. I wouldn't say misgendering if you say something on social media for example it would be up to Police Scotland to determine."'

Snp GIF by The Scottish Conservatives

Isn't that effectively saying "we don't know"? "We made this new law up, but we are not sure how it should be applied, so we're going to let someone else decide that bit"?
How can a criminal law exist when even the people who made the law can't describe how it should be applied?
It's my understanding that Judges have to do their best to interpret laws in the context of the circumstances of indiviual cases, and one of the factors they consider is the intent of the lawmakers who made the law. How can they possibly do this when the lawmakers reply "I dunno, ask someone else" when questioned about how the law is intended to operate?
Can a judge just say "this law is too stupid to enforce" and refuse to hear any further prosecutions brought under that particular law? Can a judge declare a law invalid?

Morwenscapacioussleeves · 01/04/2024 15:30

ArabellaScott · 01/04/2024 14:48

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-68703684

'"I think there has been a lot of misinformation," about the legislation, said the Victims and Community Safety Minister Siobhian Brown, before going on to claim, inaccurately, that it was "passed unanimously" by MSPs in 2021.'

Ouch.

That's the SNP Scottish government all over though isn't it - if you don't listen to anyone who disagrees with you then everything seems "unanimous" or "supported by the public"

My favourite part was - police Scotland will investigate all hurry feelings juxtaposed with no extra resources & insufficient resources to investigate actual crime 🤦🏻‍♀️

lechiffre55 · 01/04/2024 15:52
Snp GIF by The Scottish Conservatives

I've not had a chance to read this, but it looks potentially very interesting.
Wings Scotland has comissioned legal advice.
https://wingsoverscotland.com/a-thousand-paper-cranes/#more-142127

Boiledbeetle · 01/04/2024 19:04

lechiffre55 · 01/04/2024 15:52

I've not had a chance to read this, but it looks potentially very interesting.
Wings Scotland has comissioned legal advice.
https://wingsoverscotland.com/a-thousand-paper-cranes/#more-142127

For some reason your posts are really standing out today.

I'm not sure why!

There must be some subliminal message thing going on with them!

DuesToTheDirt · 01/04/2024 21:55

In this bbc article they say, "For example, if an assailant punched someone in the face while also making a hateful comment about their age, that might be assault aggravated by age-related hatred."

As we know, sex is not included in the hate-list.

So, if someone punches me in the face while calling me a "fing bitch", there is no hate crime involved. On the other hand, if they call me a "fing old bitch", that is a hate crime. Confused

police scotland

Scotland's new hate crime law comes into force

Police say they expect a flood of complaints, but the government insists the act provides protection.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-68703684

Ereshkigalangcleg · 01/04/2024 21:56

One to remember for any events in Scotland.

Hoardasurass · 01/04/2024 22:05

It looks like the law of unintended consequences is biting human today 🤣
https://x.com/WingsScotland/status/1774701455892463712?s=20

Scottish Hate Crime Bill - information and resources.
ArabellaScott · 01/04/2024 22:09

DuesToTheDirt · 01/04/2024 21:55

In this bbc article they say, "For example, if an assailant punched someone in the face while also making a hateful comment about their age, that might be assault aggravated by age-related hatred."

As we know, sex is not included in the hate-list.

So, if someone punches me in the face while calling me a "fing bitch", there is no hate crime involved. On the other hand, if they call me a "fing old bitch", that is a hate crime. Confused

If the trans rights activists could only refrain from making sneering jokes about people's ages, or assumed mental health conditions, they'd possibly be safe from being reported for hate crimes.

Guess what, though, they can't.

OP posts:
lechiffre55 · 01/04/2024 22:59

Boiledbeetle · 01/04/2024 19:04

For some reason your posts are really standing out today.

I'm not sure why!

There must be some subliminal message thing going on with them!

Snp GIF by The Scottish Conservatives

Yeah it's almost as if I've got a real bee in my bonnet about some fuckwit buffoon who couldn't run a piss up in a Scottish distillery imposing absurd draconian authoritarian laws on a populance who deserves far better, and I'm on a one adult human female protest of the inane insanity, choosing ridicule, mockery, chiacking, performative scooter faceplant dancing, and an indecently inappropriately long sentence as the medium through which to express my protest and disgust.
That it came into effect on April Fool's day is just the icing on the lemon drizzle cake.
This may be the last gif of my protest, but it's not over. I spoke with a relative from Canada earlier who was bemoaning Trudeau. "Hold my beer and listen to my story about Scotland" I said. It started with "This story involves people named after fish, and some even fishier behaviour." By the time I got to Mein Kampfervan my relative thought I was just making stuff up as I went along.
No one should live in a country where the ruling class are a writing the scipt to a farce that no one in their right mind could believe was true.

lechiffre55 · 01/04/2024 23:03

Hoardasurass · 01/04/2024 22:05

It looks like the law of unintended consequences is biting human today 🤣
https://x.com/WingsScotland/status/1774701455892463712?s=20

You realise that IF the police interview him about his racist "white white white" speech then there will not have been a Scottish First Minister who has not been interviewed under caution by Police Scotland.

BlessedKali · 01/04/2024 23:10

Apologies if someone has said it, but I think the way to help is going to be to report all hate crime you possibly can. Everything and anything. The system needs to be overwhelmed.

Can people from outside Scotland report?

Boiledbeetle · 01/04/2024 23:14

BlessedKali · 01/04/2024 23:10

Apologies if someone has said it, but I think the way to help is going to be to report all hate crime you possibly can. Everything and anything. The system needs to be overwhelmed.

Can people from outside Scotland report?

I think there's been a lot of that sort of reporting today. And even if you don't think it's a hate crime but it might be to someone somewhere then report it anyway!

I don't think the person reporting has to give their details, and who knows if its just in Scotland or not, report anyway!

😏

lonelywater · 01/04/2024 23:15

BlessedKali · 01/04/2024 23:10

Apologies if someone has said it, but I think the way to help is going to be to report all hate crime you possibly can. Everything and anything. The system needs to be overwhelmed.

Can people from outside Scotland report?

since the `Babylon regard anything that can be read in Scotland as being published in Scotland, then I would think yes. quite how they are going to manage to police the whole world when they cannot attend to low level stuff (you know, the things no body minds about, like being burgled) remains to be seen.

BlessedKali · 01/04/2024 23:19

Oh how lovely! I am incredibly excited to be able to report all this hate. I'm not really sure what it is exactly, so I'll just have to report lots of it. Especially all the cis-gender hate I receive. Looks like I will return to twitter, a wonderful place for gathering evidence.

Morwenscapacioussleeves · 02/04/2024 00:09

BlessedKali · 01/04/2024 23:10

Apologies if someone has said it, but I think the way to help is going to be to report all hate crime you possibly can. Everything and anything. The system needs to be overwhelmed.

Can people from outside Scotland report?

The Golden Path Paperwork GIF by The Chemical Brothers

And as all this reporting is going on it's important to keep checking if anything has been recorded against you

https://www.scotland.police.uk/spa-media/vmlfakm2/subject-access-request.pdf

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