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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Scottish Hate Crime Bill - information and resources.

244 replies

ArabellaScott · 19/03/2024 20:39

Well. Here we go.

Disclaimer: I don't have any special expertise or knowledge. Check everything for yourself.

The Bill:

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/asp/2021/14/contents/enacted

PART 1 Aggravation of offences by prejudice

PART 2 Offence of racially aggravated harassment

PART 3 Offences relating to stirring up hatred

It's part three that is most relevant to women and feminists.

I'll just paste the whole of Part 3:

(1)A person commits an offence if—

(a)the person—

(i)behaves in a manner that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening, abusive or insulting, or

(ii)communicates to another person material that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening, abusive or insulting, and

(b)either—

(i)in doing so, the person intends to stir up hatred against a group of persons based on the group being defined by reference to race, colour, nationality (including citizenship), or ethnic or national origins, or

(ii)a reasonable person would consider the behaviour or the communication of the material to be likely to result in hatred being stirred up against such a group.

(2)A person commits an offence if—

(a)the person—

(i)behaves in a manner that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening or abusive, or

(ii)communicates to another person material that a reasonable person would consider to be threatening or abusive, and

(b)in doing so, the person intends to stir up hatred against a group of persons based on the group being defined by reference to a characteristic mentioned in subsection (3).

(3)The characteristics are—

(a)age,

(b)disability,

(c)religion or, in the case of a social or cultural group, perceived religious affiliation,

(d)sexual orientation,

(e)transgender identity,

(f)variations in sex characteristics.

(4)It is a defence for a person charged with an offence under this section to show that the behaviour or the communication of the material was, in the particular circumstances, reasonable.

(5)For the purposes of subsection (4), in determining whether behaviour or communication was reasonable, particular regard must be had to the importance of the right to freedom of expression by virtue of Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights, including the general principle that the right applies to the expression of information or ideas that offend, shock or disturb.

(6)For the purposes of subsection (4), it is shown that the behaviour or the communication of the material was, in the particular circumstances, reasonable if—

(a)evidence adduced is enough to raise an issue as to whether that is the case, and

(b)the prosecution does not prove beyond reasonable doubt that it is not the case.

(7)For the purposes of subsections (1)(a)(i) and (2)(a)(i), a person’s behaviour—

(a)includes behaviour of any kind and, in particular, things that the person says, or otherwise communicates, as well as things that the person does,

(b)may consist of—

(i)a single act, or

(ii)a course of conduct.

(8)For the purposes of subsections (1)(a)(ii) and (2)(a)(ii), the ways in which a person may communicate material to another person are by—

(a)displaying, publishing or distributing the material,

(b)giving, sending, showing or playing the material to another person,

(c)making the material available to another person in any other way.

(9)A person who commits an offence under this section is liable—

(a)on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 12 months or a fine not exceeding the statutory maximum (or both), or

(b)on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 7 years or a fine (or both).

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/asp/2021/14/contents/enacted

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Thread gallery
60
JanesLittleGirl · 30/03/2024 21:50

Morwenscapacioussleeves · 29/03/2024 21:29

Yes I agree the law is unworkable- as the SNP were told repeatedly
I mean a more general we're fucked 😂 because these idiots repeatedly pass laws that are unworkable & until they are proved so people will suffer <starts blithering on about the bloody Named Person fiasco etc> It's all very well if it hides away because the police can't manage it but if it's still there on the books then speech is still stifled. And the fact the bill is the FM's baby, it will be harder to get rid off.

The SNP continues to damage Scotland.

On the upside I went to see this today & think you're the women to enjoy it 😁

Hands up if you really want to wear that dress.

ArabellaScott · 31/03/2024 10:47

Last day before the new Act comes into force.

Here's the conclusions I've drawn, after the past few years of watching the Bill go through Scotgov and finally be brought to enactment:

I won't allow bad legislation to chill my speech.

I don't want to exaggerate risks or scare anyone, but in my view, the new act presents a potential risk to absolutely everyone in Scotland, and possibly even elsewhere in the UK, regardless of your views on anything. The vagueness of it and the paucity of police understanding/training offers a perfect way for malicious or misguided people to abuse process, leading to potential investigations into people who have done absolutely nothing wrong. This applies to everyone, not just feminists, but feminists are likely to be targeted.

Some practical actions to take if you are worried you may be targeted:

Prepare to have phones and laptops/PCs confiscated. Consider how you will be able to function/work/care for children without devices.

Export phone contacts or write out numbers in an old fashioned address book.

Back up or export important files to the cloud or make hard copies.

Use a throwaway email to register for social media sites.

Consider joining the Free Speech Union.

Seek the number of a competent solicitor experienced in criminal law in Scotland, and have it written down somewhere safe.

Be prepared to make a Subject Access Request regularly.

If you are asked to talk to the police. You have to give your name, address, DOB, but beyond that, 'no comment' is advisable. Grey rock will be useful here.

Everyone should make their own risk assessment and consider how much they are willing to risk, and what the effects may be of a police investigation/court case. This is different for everyone.

Consider that the more people are silenced, the harder it will be for the few people who are willing/able to talk openly.

The chilling effect is already in action. People, especially women, are already withdrawing from public debate and social media.

Hopefully our worst fears won't be realised, and the protections that Humza Yousaf has pointed to in the Act will be upheld, those of freedom of speech and expression, especially.

Whether or not that happens, my considered position is this:

'Proclaim the truth and do not be silent through fear'

Catherine of Siena.

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RethinkingLife · 31/03/2024 14:38

I've just read this (see screenshot):
Police promise ALL complaints will be investigated. https://twitter.com/SVPhillimore/status/1774366880075026470

I'd like to know if Police Scotland finds the money to fund some posts to do this. I would like a PT job so I can increase my contributions to Sex Matters, FWS etc.

Scottish Hate Crime Bill - information and resources.
Cailin66 · 31/03/2024 16:02

As I am not in the UK, never mind Scotland. Could some of you lovely ladies tell me where I can usurp this law best.

As in, on here, on Twitter. Direct to which police etc.

Bring it on.

First thing I’ll do is tweet at midnight:01 that India W is not a woman. Bear in mind I’m older so need exact instructions please on what best to do.

Appalonia · 31/03/2024 17:04

This week Naomi Cunningham is making her closing speech in the case involving Edinburgh Rape Crisis Centre. I wonder if anyone watching it will report her words as a hate crime...?

lonelywater · 31/03/2024 17:08

Cailin66 · 31/03/2024 16:02

As I am not in the UK, never mind Scotland. Could some of you lovely ladies tell me where I can usurp this law best.

As in, on here, on Twitter. Direct to which police etc.

Bring it on.

First thing I’ll do is tweet at midnight:01 that India W is not a woman. Bear in mind I’m older so need exact instructions please on what best to do.

Edited

if I read it right, then the Scottish Babylon take the view that anything that can be read In Scotland is regarded as being published in Scotland. Which surely means their jurisdiction now extends to the entire world and everyone in it. They are going to need a lot of extradition treaties to service that lot.

RethinkingLife · 31/03/2024 17:18

lonelywater · 31/03/2024 17:08

if I read it right, then the Scottish Babylon take the view that anything that can be read In Scotland is regarded as being published in Scotland. Which surely means their jurisdiction now extends to the entire world and everyone in it. They are going to need a lot of extradition treaties to service that lot.

Agreed. The publishing workaround is similar to the reasons that English courts are popular for libel/privacy actions and super-injunctions for the super-wealthy oligarchy even when none of them reside here.

https://www.politico.eu/article/uk-libel-privacy-law-defamation-westminster/

<merail>And, OT, I would very much like Police Scotland to be renamed Scots or Scottish Babylon, please and thank you.</merail>

How British libel law lets bad people get away with bad things

English media rules are chilling journalism around the world.

https://www.politico.eu/article/uk-libel-privacy-law-defamation-westminster

lonelywater · 31/03/2024 19:36

Another weird angle on all this is that according to Useless himself, vexatious complaints will be dealt with "robustly". How is that going to work then? If the test is just the complainants perception (which is surely the ne plus ultra of marking your own homework) how can they even begin to prove the complaint is in bad faith? I can easily see the wilder fringes of Bloko Haram counter suing the Babylon for just such a dismissal. At any rate I cannot see this being anything other than a world class binfire.

ArabellaScott · 31/03/2024 21:40

https://joannacherry.scot/newspaper-columns/women-have-every-right-to-be-concerned-about-hate-crime-act

'The weaponisation of hate crime laws to silence gender-critical women is a risk which has been recognised by legal experts who have looked at the issue in recent years both north and south of the Border. The retired Scottish judge who prepared the independent report which preceded this new hate crime legislation, Lord Bracadale, recommended that there should be a tailored freedom of expression protection for such women in it.

When the bill was first introduced to Parliament, this recommendation was not reflected in the bill. I approached Humza Yousaf to discuss my concerns, he listened, took my concerns on board, and a tailored defence for gender-critical women was produced at the end of January 2021. Here's what it said: 'Behaviour or material is not to be taken to be threatening or abusive solely on the basis that it involves or includes discussion or criticism of matters relating to transgender identity.'

The amendment was drafted and published by the SNP Scottish Government, but when I tweeted my support for it, I was accused of transphobia. Nicola Sturgeon tweeted her now infamous broom cupboard broadcast, I was sacked from my position on the SNP front bench and the amendment was ditched in what I can only describe as an atmosphere of hysteria.'

From Joanna Cherry

Lord Bracadale's report:

https://www.gov.scot/publications/independent-review-hate-crime-legislation-scotland-final-report/pages/6/

Women have every right to be concerned about Hate Crime Act

Joanna Cherry is the MP for Edinburgh South West and deputy chair of the Joint Committee on Human Rights

https://joannacherry.scot/newspaper-columns/women-have-every-right-to-be-concerned-about-hate-crime-act

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ArabellaScott · 31/03/2024 21:41

lonelywater · 31/03/2024 19:36

Another weird angle on all this is that according to Useless himself, vexatious complaints will be dealt with "robustly". How is that going to work then? If the test is just the complainants perception (which is surely the ne plus ultra of marking your own homework) how can they even begin to prove the complaint is in bad faith? I can easily see the wilder fringes of Bloko Haram counter suing the Babylon for just such a dismissal. At any rate I cannot see this being anything other than a world class binfire.

I think this is, in legal terms, Humza 'talking shite'.

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Ereshkigalangcleg · 31/03/2024 21:47

Will he be using his "at it-o-meter"?

DuesToTheDirt · 31/03/2024 21:58

Ereshkigalangcleg · 31/03/2024 21:47

Will he be using his "at it-o-meter"?

Easter Grin
ArabellaScott · 31/03/2024 21:58

He's certainly a tit.

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PriOn1 · 31/03/2024 23:27

Here’s a link to Sarah Phillimore’s Twitter, outlining a plan for those who can afford to risk it.

I’m in Scotland and have a Twitter account in my own name, so I will be joining in. What a time to be alive.

x.com/SVPhillimore/status/1774364435693379962?s=20

ArabellaScott · 01/04/2024 00:04

It was a cold, bright day in April, and the clocks were striking thirteen.

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Boiledbeetle · 01/04/2024 00:07

ArabellaScott · 01/04/2024 00:04

It was a cold, bright day in April, and the clocks were striking thirteen.

Any requests for when we visit you in jail? Teabags? Cigarettes? a file?

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motheronthedancefloor · 01/04/2024 08:09

Can you have a NCHI recorded even if reported anonymously?

LarkLane · 01/04/2024 08:17
Miss Piggy Waiting GIF by Muppet Wiki

Does pelvic exercises while waiting...

HagoftheNorth · 01/04/2024 08:25

Being discussed on R4 atm (8.25 ish) OMG I love Justin Webb - “why weren’t women included?” Why indeed!

Cailin66 · 01/04/2024 08:51

Appalonia · 31/03/2024 17:04

This week Naomi Cunningham is making her closing speech in the case involving Edinburgh Rape Crisis Centre. I wonder if anyone watching it will report her words as a hate crime...?

A court case would be an exception, like what you say in parliament is protected.

ArabellaScott · 01/04/2024 10:46

https://archive.ph/Wrki9

Vic Valentine, manager of 'Scottish Trans', and a supporter of the HCA:

'Do I disagree, profoundly, with many of the things that are said about and to trans people on a daily basis? Of course. Do I think that they cause real upset and harm to trans people? I know that they do – I see it every day from working with and talking to trans people across Scotland. But complaining to the police about offensive views that people are lawfully allowed to hold and express is no solution to the rise in prejudice and hateful sentiment, nor is it the right thing to do.
It could also in some cases give people who are being deliberately offensive and unpleasant the opportunity to portray themselves as the victims. The solutions are instead quite different. They include speaking out against prejudice, and in favour of a generous and supportive society, and modelling that in our own behaviour.'

Is that Vic trying desperately to roll back some of the more enthusiastic trans rights activists who are committed to reporting every instance of misgendering?

You're a bit late, Vic.

Do encourage activists to model better behaviour though, that would make a nice refreshing change from punching women/spitting on women/threatening women/shouting at women.

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