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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Yousaf: We’d work with Labour on gender Bill before election

35 replies

IwantToRetire · 26/12/2023 01:07

Humza Yousaf said the Scottish Government has been unsuccessful in working with the current Westminster Government, following the Section 35 order of the Scotland Act which prevented the Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill from gaining royal assent.

But in a statement outlining Scottish ministers would not seek to appeal against a Court of Session decision which ruled the block was lawful, Social Justice Secretary Shirley-Anne Somerville appealed to “future” UK Government’s to revive the laws.

“We’re willing to sit down with the Labour party – frankly now, let alone if they end up forming the next UK Government – to see if they have concerns about the Bill.“If they do, then let’s work together to try to mitigate any concerns that they do have.”

Alba’s MSP Ash Regan – a former SNP minister who quit the government over the legislation – wrote to Sir Keir last week urging him not to unblock the Bill.

https://www.ayradvertiser.com/news/national/24010837.yousaf-work-labour-gender-bill-election/

Yousaf: We’d work with Labour on gender Bill before election

Scotland’s First Minister said he is seeking ways to revive the Gender Recognition Reform Bill.

https://www.ayradvertiser.com/news/national/24010837.yousaf-work-labour-gender-bill-election

OP posts:
HagoftheNorth · 26/12/2023 07:10

So Starmer now has a chance to clarify exactly how a Labour government would respond. I hope he does, I for one would like to know exactly what I’m voting for.

Igneococcus · 26/12/2023 07:14

I doubt Starmer will actually respond to it.

AuContraire · 26/12/2023 07:20

Igneococcus · 26/12/2023 07:14

I doubt Starmer will actually respond to it.

Agreed, as that would take some goolies.

Interesting tactic by the SNP, to drag Labour's credibility down with them.

borntobequiet · 26/12/2023 07:38

A great opportunity to ask awkward questions of both parties.

HagoftheNorth · 26/12/2023 07:41

Unfortunately, I agree. Starmer will NOT clarify what a vote for Labour actually means for women’s rights - so we can draw our own conclusions

Floisme · 26/12/2023 07:45

Well Starmer certainly won't respond if he's not asked, but it would be nice to see a journalist do their job and put the question to him.

HagoftheNorth · 26/12/2023 07:47

Maybe Mumsnet can get him back & ask him?

PriOn1 · 26/12/2023 07:57

AuContraire · 26/12/2023 07:20

Agreed, as that would take some goolies.

Interesting tactic by the SNP, to drag Labour's credibility down with them.

I was thinking the same. It looks like a colossal act of self-sabotage to me, as well as dragging Labour in. Can they really still not see the problems with it?

Rightsraptor · 26/12/2023 08:44

The FM says in the article that they have had no details from UK government as to any amendments to be made in order to gain royal assent.

I can't imagine why he'd even expect the UK government to provide such details. I hope nobody implied they'd be working on that.

Froodwithatowel · 26/12/2023 08:53

Yeah. Interesting expectation that Labour will gladly put male privilege and subordination of women and children over things like UK law.

I suspect they're right. But yes, let's get it all out and be clear that anyone voting for a party identifying as left is voting for identity politics with all its pretty alternative realities, and not much else.

BeBraveLittlePenguin · 26/12/2023 09:42

A solicitor.mate who used to instruct Starmer back in his bar days once described him as more sheep than sheepdog.
He is so spineless it's scary.

DewHopper · 26/12/2023 10:11

He won't clarify. He's weak and feeble.

WickedSerious · 26/12/2023 13:49

The fact that he won't clarify tells us everything we need to know.

EwwSprouts · 26/12/2023 13:53

Someone needs to tell Starmer that sticking your head in the sand is not actually leadership.

EasternStandard · 26/12/2023 13:53

BeBraveLittlePenguin · 26/12/2023 09:42

A solicitor.mate who used to instruct Starmer back in his bar days once described him as more sheep than sheepdog.
He is so spineless it's scary.

Seems to be the case

We’ll be toast soon

Froodwithatowel · 26/12/2023 15:44

I've said it before, go take a look at the 'webchat' he did on MN during the labour leadership race. The measure of him can be taken there.

All the female candidates had the integrity to state their identity politics batshit - and it was batshit but they owned it and defended it and had the integrity to say what they believed and stand on it.

Starmer didn't. He came over as smug, superior, and with no intention of committing himself. Particularly to women.

coffeerevelsrule · 26/12/2023 15:52

BeBraveLittlePenguin · 26/12/2023 09:42

A solicitor.mate who used to instruct Starmer back in his bar days once described him as more sheep than sheepdog.
He is so spineless it's scary.

😂😂And has your 'solicitor mate' gone on to become DPP and LOTO, dragging the Labour party back from seeming election oblivion to being 20 points ahead for last year? Takes real spinelessness that.

The bloody SNP have got to be one of the most divisive and political-in-the worst-sense-of-the-word movements that has ever existed in the UK. They know it's over for them and they aren't going to get what they want in the foreseeable future so they would love to drag Labour down with them. Hopefully KS will ignore, yes. He doesn't need to get dragged into this on their terms. The manifesto will answer our questions on gender when it comes out.

Chersfrozenface · 26/12/2023 15:55

Of course Starmer won't make Labour's stance clear before the election. And he'll try to keep the more batshit MPs quiet by assuring them that if they keep schtum Labour will bring in easy GRCs and "trans rights" after winning

Because that is what they'll do. Gender affirming everything, in health, education, social care, the criminal justice system, everywhere.

And they will let the SNP go even further in Scotland if that's what the SNP wants.

EasternStandard · 26/12/2023 16:00

coffeerevelsrule · 26/12/2023 15:52

😂😂And has your 'solicitor mate' gone on to become DPP and LOTO, dragging the Labour party back from seeming election oblivion to being 20 points ahead for last year? Takes real spinelessness that.

The bloody SNP have got to be one of the most divisive and political-in-the worst-sense-of-the-word movements that has ever existed in the UK. They know it's over for them and they aren't going to get what they want in the foreseeable future so they would love to drag Labour down with them. Hopefully KS will ignore, yes. He doesn't need to get dragged into this on their terms. The manifesto will answer our questions on gender when it comes out.

Starmer won’t be able to ignore this stuff indefinitely

He might even have to articulate in clear language what he means

MrsOvertonsWindow · 26/12/2023 16:04

The more Labour uses weasel words - safe spaces rather than single sex, welcoming a "consultation process" while avoiding any mention of the content, glossing over safeguarding children as if it's not an issue, etc they'll not be able to ignore this. Starmer has limited ability to ignore the sheer volume of unhinged comments made by Nandy, Osborne, Lammy, Russell-Moyle & the Butler's of the world. They will keep this issue close to the top of the agenda as they're zealots lacking in self discipline.

There are now a large number of clear sighted journalists who completely understand the threats to children & women's rights that this ideology poses (and the number seems to grow weekly).

Until Labour walk over this golden bridge and clearly come down on the side of safeguarding children and the rights of women they will be confronted with difficult questions that expose the the incoherence and dangers of what they've signed up to.

Chersfrozenface · 26/12/2023 16:23

MrsOvertonsWindow · 26/12/2023 16:04

The more Labour uses weasel words - safe spaces rather than single sex, welcoming a "consultation process" while avoiding any mention of the content, glossing over safeguarding children as if it's not an issue, etc they'll not be able to ignore this. Starmer has limited ability to ignore the sheer volume of unhinged comments made by Nandy, Osborne, Lammy, Russell-Moyle & the Butler's of the world. They will keep this issue close to the top of the agenda as they're zealots lacking in self discipline.

There are now a large number of clear sighted journalists who completely understand the threats to children & women's rights that this ideology poses (and the number seems to grow weekly).

Until Labour walk over this golden bridge and clearly come down on the side of safeguarding children and the rights of women they will be confronted with difficult questions that expose the the incoherence and dangers of what they've signed up to.

Where are the clear sighted journalists?

Are they on the mainstream media?

They're not on the BBC or Sky News, the Guardian or the Independent or the Metro or the regional papers..

The only papers covering this properly are the Times (which is wobbly), the Telegraph and the Mail, all easily dismissed to any audience that might even conceivably vote Labour. Ditto GB News, in spades.

And after Labour wins, they'll bring in legislation to ensure that, as far as possible, no debate comes roaring back.

And I'm not a Tory. I have never voted Conservative in the many decades I've been entitled to vote. I am a realist, and in despair.

EwwSprouts · 26/12/2023 16:27

@coffeerevelsrule The manifesto will answer our questions on gender when it comes out. lol Don't hold your breath.

MerryCheesemas · 26/12/2023 16:28

Surely there is nothing Labour could do which would allow Scotland’s Gender bill to become law? It either affects the Equality Act or it doesn’t. The courts have ruled it does which is why Section 35 was legal.
Is this the SNP trying to through the Scottish Greens a bone?

Chersfrozenface · 26/12/2023 16:34

MerryCheesemas · 26/12/2023 16:28

Surely there is nothing Labour could do which would allow Scotland’s Gender bill to become law? It either affects the Equality Act or it doesn’t. The courts have ruled it does which is why Section 35 was legal.
Is this the SNP trying to through the Scottish Greens a bone?

The Section 35 action was brought by the current Conservative Westminster government

A Labour Westminster government could watch the SNP bring in a carbon copy of GRR Act and not bother to challenge it

Or bring in its own very similar legislation which would cover Scotland, England and Wales.

MerryCheesemas · 26/12/2023 16:37

The SNP would be shooting itself in the foot of they tried to bring in similar legislation, surely. It was deeply unpopular with the public but I get what you are saying @Chersfrozenface
Labour are not to be trusted and I’ll be voting accordingly when the GE is finally called.

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