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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Philippa Gregory thinks that two sexes, male and female, is a "myth"

142 replies

Fenlandia · 30/10/2023 17:33

According to journalist Susan Dalgety's Substack (a good read), the author Philippa Gregory, who has sold gazillions of historical fiction novels, thinks there are more sexes than we first thought!

https://susandalgety.substack.com/p/philippa-gregory-may-be-a-bestselling

Here is the quote from Dalgety:

"Philippa Gregory, who prides herself as a feminist, does not believe in the “myth of two sexes.” She writes glowingly of a modern world where it is impossible to divide humans into two categories, male and female. “It is as fictional as a sorting hat – we are more diverse than and more varied, and more changeable over time, in a richer multiple word than the binary model…” And she points out that in the 1990s, American sexologist, Anne Fausto-Sterling, counted five sexes (male, female, merm, ferm and herm), while French scientist Eric Vilain suggested an “infinite number of biological genders.” It was at this point I dropped my coffee cup."

And yet again with the tedious trope that in order for people to be interesting and the world to be diverse, we must dispense with the fact of the sex binary by which every single human has been produced, ever.

Philippa Gregory may be a bestselling historical novelist, but facts still matter

Author of Normal Women believes that two sexes, male and female, is a "myth"

https://susandalgety.substack.com/p/philippa-gregory-may-be-a-bestselling

OP posts:
ValancyRedfern · 30/10/2023 20:06

From her latest book:

Philippa Gregory thinks that two sexes, male and female, is a "myth"
Tinysoxxx · 30/10/2023 20:06

ErrolTheDragon · 30/10/2023 19:59

Oddly enough it appears she used to live on a farm in the North York Moors. You'd imagine she'd know there was a distinct difference between the sexes, there's no mistaking a ram for an ewe!

That is odd. Maybe she is like some religious people who see humans as distinct from the rest of the animal kingdom?

WickedSerious · 30/10/2023 20:07

Stupid woman.

Precipice · 30/10/2023 20:15

ValancyRedfern · 30/10/2023 20:06

From her latest book:

Ah, yes, in 2019, there were no cases of 'trans woman' prisoners attacking women, since fortunately the case of Karen White came to light in 2018.

Boiledbeetle · 30/10/2023 20:21

This reply has been deleted

Withdrawn at poster's request

real housewives of new york city wtf GIF

Christ!

Donkeyseason · 30/10/2023 20:29

RaininginDarling · 30/10/2023 18:36

And yet every person that exists has been created via a male and female parent. What an extraordinary coincidence eye roll

Yeah, they never manage to explain that away, do they?

Froodwithatowel · 30/10/2023 20:31

Stand on your head for the good girl cookies Phil.

<slow clap>

<wonders if Anne Boleyn and Kate Howard could have identified as men, had their marriages annulled and left their psychopathic bastard husband before he murdered them>

Ereshkigalangcleg · 30/10/2023 20:39

Yes exactly @Froodwithatowel but perhaps Philippa thinks we're living in more enlightened times now. If only that option had been open!

EmpressaurusOfCats · 30/10/2023 20:41

So how did they decide that Henry VIII got to be King & his older sister Margaret had to go to Scotland & marry James IV?

Maybe they tossed a coin.

GrumpyPanda · 30/10/2023 20:46

ValancyRedfern · 30/10/2023 20:06

From her latest book:

"Very few men abuse and attack women unknown to them."

Is she on glue? Or part of the tiny, tiny blessed minority who've never come across street harassment?

tobee · 30/10/2023 20:57

What the hell is that book?

Bobtheamazinggingerdog · 30/10/2023 21:00

Oh for fuck sake. Joanne Harris and Philippa Gregory used to be two of my favourite writers but they are both vacuous idiots on this subject. I tried reading JH's last book and gave up when the leader of the female running club was oops! Secretly trans and nobody knew! Dickheads.

FeckArseIndusty · 30/10/2023 21:01

Oh my gawd I read that, I thought it was a male writer. It was soooo bad!

Rightsraptor · 30/10/2023 21:08

I'm not buying her latest book then. Fuck it.

BurbleBumleBleep · 30/10/2023 21:15

Clearly explaining gender not sex. We all get the variety of human nature. There are many ways to express male and female.

Equally our biology is undeniably two sex.

Really the difference needs to be better understood. I remember having this conversation with sexist males growing up. Like rugby. Women aren’t as fast or strong as men but if we play against other women it’s still the same level of competition. Sex says we aren’t up to men. Gender says we can play excellent rugby.

PermanentTemporary · 30/10/2023 21:25

"Very few men abuse and attack women unknown to them"

Enough to affect our lives though...

"Rape is a conscious process of intimidation by which all men keep all women in a state of fear" Susan Brownmiller. Remember that one Philippa?

spookehtooth · 30/10/2023 21:25

ErrolTheDragon · 30/10/2023 18:54

Why do supposedly intelligent people get confused by something as simple as the difference between sex (two, biological, dimorphic, non-interchangeable in mammals) and 'gender' (as many as you want, culturally variable etc).?

Gender is too intertwined with sex, carrying sexist baggage with it. The concepts require full separation. Even people that see them clearly as separate are inclined to few attributes of different genders more commonly associated with one sex or the other

RethinkingLife · 30/10/2023 21:50

"Very few men abuse and attack women unknown to them"

Astonishingly naive for a historian.

Rape is a common weapon of war and of terrorising a populace.

EdithStourton · 30/10/2023 21:59

EmpressaurusOfCats · 30/10/2023 20:41

So how did they decide that Henry VIII got to be King & his older sister Margaret had to go to Scotland & marry James IV?

Maybe they tossed a coin.

Nah, Maggie was 'assigned female at birth' on the whim of the midwife, but by the time Henry arrived the parents were insisting that the new baby be 'assigned male'.

ErrolTheDragon · 30/10/2023 22:01

Gender is too intertwined with sex, carrying sexist baggage with it. The concepts require full separation. Even people that see them clearly as separate are inclined to few attributes of different genders more commonly associated with one sex or the other

Or how about just lose the wretched concept of gender and have a fantastic new one: 'individual character'?

JanesLittleGirl · 30/10/2023 22:06

ErrolTheDragon · 30/10/2023 22:01

Gender is too intertwined with sex, carrying sexist baggage with it. The concepts require full separation. Even people that see them clearly as separate are inclined to few attributes of different genders more commonly associated with one sex or the other

Or how about just lose the wretched concept of gender and have a fantastic new one: 'individual character'?

I'm with you. There are two sexes and an infinite number of personalities.

ErrolTheDragon · 30/10/2023 22:08

Nah, Maggie was 'assigned female at birth' on the whim of the midwife, but by the time Henry arrived the parents were insisting that the new baby be 'assigned male'.

I wonder what the history of this country would have been like if Henry had had all his children assigned male at birth, albeit Mary and Elizabeth both boys without winkles? I mean wouldn't that have saved a lot of problems? Why on earth didn't he think of it?

CountZacular · 30/10/2023 22:10

I don’t understand how an author who has frequently written about the dynamics between men and women in historic fiction is suddenly confused. I’ve read about half a dozen of her books (though admittedly none in the past 10 years or so) but it seems like she understood that women are treated as property due to our sex.

FictionalCharacter · 30/10/2023 22:14

Is she one of those who thinks that every possible variation in chromosomes/ hormones/ anatomy is a different sex?
I’m utterly sick of non-scientists lecturing everyone about biology. Though to be fair, I’m more disgusted at people who actually are scientists or doctors pushing this kind of nonsense when they know it isn’t true.

roibustea · 30/10/2023 22:15

ErrolTheDragon · 30/10/2023 22:08

Nah, Maggie was 'assigned female at birth' on the whim of the midwife, but by the time Henry arrived the parents were insisting that the new baby be 'assigned male'.

I wonder what the history of this country would have been like if Henry had had all his children assigned male at birth, albeit Mary and Elizabeth both boys without winkles? I mean wouldn't that have saved a lot of problems? Why on earth didn't he think of it?

Isn't that what the Egyptians did? Slap on a beard and no-one will be any the wiser...