DD is now a TERF

[Bouledeneige]

So pleased. When she was at school in her late teenage years she was very woke and we had some horrible arguments - she told me to never to say my views in front of her friends as they'd hate me (all very privileged righteous middle class girls who had all the views and were constantly 'calling out' others behaviours). I simply could not say that woman means an adult human female.

But now she's 23 and a feminist in every way. The conversation started on men in women's sport and Lia Thomas. We then moved to women being safe in refuges and prisons. We then discussed who but a biological woman understands period pains and the everyday institutional sexism in society, or feeling unsafe in the streets after dark. Then we discussed medicalising young people and doing irreversible harm to their bodies and future fertility. She brought up the NHS using terms like 'people who give birth'. I told her about Jessica Yaniv.

It felt so good. I've kept my mouth shut for so long.

Just need to wait for common sense to prevail with DS 21 currently at Sussex University.

Why do you all care so much about trans issues? Has it actually affected you in any way? I really don't get the obsession with this.

Oooh! Two scolders in quick succession! Why are YOU so obsessed? Not interested? Scroll on past, or use the “hide this thread” option.

Sense and kindness?

Sense like believing we were all assigned something at birth by the magic gender fairy?

Kindness like sending rape threats to a woman who has already survived rape once and is campaigning for female rape survivors to have access to female only rape crisis support, but trans activists say no, that would be transphobic?

Maybe you should educate yourself then.

@Bouledeneige can I join and ask you all some questions?

So I'm 32, have a 3 month old and I'm a woman married to a woman. I never had any issues with trans people before having a baby when ALL the language around having a baby has been made gender neutral. I was called a birthing person or pregnant person and even heard "chest feeding" being used. I want to be called a mother and a woman and I found it sad that that has been removed.

Today I went to a stay and play and there were two trans men there with their child. So two people who were born female and one carried a baby, breastfed and gave birth but wanted to be called dad, as did the partner. I just felt so sorry for the child. Now some people wouldn't agree with me having a child in a same sex relationship but I just felt so sorry for the child. Am I wrong??

I get what you mean. I have no problem with two lesbians having a baby but two lesbians having a baby whilst both identifying as men is something I struggle with.

@PinkRoses1245 How is telling the truth and not lying to our children unkind or failing as a parent? I think it is unkind to lie and deny reality, but we are all entitled to our opinion. I also think you are rude and unkind telling people they failed at parenting!

@MargotBamborough this is how I felt. Also I feel it is very much having your cake and eating it by using your female reproductive parts to have a baby but want to be called a man. Also said they got a private room the whole stay at the same hospital for being trans. How many people would like that!? Also "dad" (gave birth) complained about having to be down as mother on birth certificate. I've come home feel full of rage!

I also realise MY language is very gender neutral but I feel it's very drilled into us now and I worry about causing offensive but I don't know how to refer to this couple!

@RealityFan

I wonder what your friend would say if you asked why his “nephew” still feels the need to use womens toilets, (and personally I am happy for them to do so if that is where they need to be) , and asked him why is it that it isn’t even raised as a possibility, or an vague idea to be discussed , that men should accept trans men into their toilets in the way the women have been expected to admit trans women.

I must say it is very cheering hearing the stories of how young women are looking more closely at the reality behind the noise and realising that they have by and large been told a pack of lies.

I care so much because I'm sick and tired of women being shouted down, attacked and discriminated against. I'm more than happy to live and let live but I just want us to be allowed our own safe spaces, to be privileged with the fact that we are the experts of our own experience and identity and not to be trivialised by silly girly tropes that are simply fetishes. And I want everyone to be able to be who they are safe in their own bodies and skins.

I felt alarmed by my DDs views before because it seemed that her wish to be kind and sympathetic actually meant a risk to her own rights and safety. We've fought too long and hard to give away our hard won rights.

I causally drop hints in with my younger kids.

"You can't be whatever you want."

"You can dress like something but that doesn't make you it."

"Vulva = girl/ woman"

"George in the famous five didn't want to be a boy she wanted the freedom, power & adventure men were allowed in a sexist society rather than doing all the bleeding chores like Anne."

Etc

Well, I'll never know, because from the tenor of my last chat, no rocking of the boat is wanted. It's impossible for me to get this right. I wouldn't highlight this if this was simply a situation of coming out as gay, or even a Christian etc.

No, this is more like a medical diagnosis. Would I "interrogate" autism or anorexia or ADHD or self harm etc? Of course I wouldn't. However the issue is not the same, none of those diagnoses involves anyone else, let alone a whole class of people.

Also, what's going on here? By treating this literally as, or close to, a medical/psychiatric condition that needs affirmation, it's not an ID issue anymore, it's a fragility that cannot stand any scrutiny.

I'm so jealous, OP.

Do you have a captured child too?

I know I'm ood but this post was offered. I'm pleased to hear what you say and I hope your ds has followed suit.

I know I'm way ood with this BUT I care when it affects me! In everyday life, no it doesn't, but in a "woman's space" it does! If I see someone in a female toilet with, let's say, different equipment to myself, then "he" or "she" should be hightailing it out of there!

Thats great news but tbf you absolutely could have said something. The reason we are where we are beccause of all the middle class parents kowtowing to their children, not saying NO or establishing healthy boundaries.
Wanting to be their friends rather than the adult in the room.

I wonder if you will ever realise how uninformed this makes you appear, chumsnut?
One of the weird things about online discussions is how happy some people seem to be to display how uninformed and ignorant they are about the topic being discussed, as if it was a badge of pride.

This post is an excellent example, thanks for providing it!

I have two friends whose daughters have had elective mastectomies due to this madness - and one more is currently on that pathway. You'd have to be a psychopath not to care.