Guardian: increased hate crimes against transgender people

[PorcelinaV]

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/oct/05/record-rise-hate-crimes-transgender-people-reported-england-and-wales

The Home Office said the overall fall in the figures could be linked to interim guidance published last year which “may have led to greater scrutiny of the threshold of what constitutes a criminal offence of public fear, alarm or distress”.

However its report noted: “Transgender issues have been heavily discussed by politicians, the media and on social media over the last year, which may have led to an increase in these offences, or more awareness in the police in the identification and recording of these crimes.”

...

“These statistics show there has been an overall reduction in hate crimes recorded by police, and the numbers of sexual orientation, race and disability hate crimes all fell.

“Whilst the increase in transgender hate crime may be due to a genuine rise, the biggest driver is likely to be general improvements in police recording.”

flowers for you.

@Moglet4

Maybe because it's not that simple and it's not a situation where everyone will live happily ever after if it's just left without comment!

The entire point is that its not neutral and just about the individuals involved. It has an impact on others.

Women aren't being allowed 'to live and let live' and this facilitating of fantasy is being imposition on others (without consent or regards to their wellbeing) with a negative impact. It's has consequences.

And people are well within their rights to make this point and to voice concerns about safeguarding (including the impact on children who are gaslight about sex being the same as gender).

The whole 'why can't we just live and let live' is the height of utter ignorance and wilful blindness.

That phrase can be translated to everyone else easily. The phrase why can't we just live and let live actually means 'Its not affecting me, so I don't care and why can't everyone shut up about it because it annoys me and challenges my happy little lala land worldview in which I have no idea beyond the tiny bubble I live in and I don't want to hear bad things or consider another life experience which isn't so fluffy'.

Whatever happened to 'considering all parties, balancing needs and safeguarding'?

I'll tell you what happened - people stopped caring about anyone who didn't fit into their world view and were happy to throw them under the bus instead.

Live and let live? Does that extend to me being able to live my life with the reassurance that if my dd is somewhere single sex for example guide camp that she isn't sharing a tent with someone male bodied? (Yes I deliberately picked that example because I'm fully aware)

A similar situation for me was what made me have to clarify my thoughts.

I now think people use that live and let live line probably have had little impact of the issues. In doing so, it means others can be targeted for derision for seeing the issues and working to make solutions that are workable.

Helleofabore live and let live never seems to apply to the women who have to change what they do because they can't be around male bodied people for various reasons including trauma, they aren't being allowed to just live their lives.

Because its clear that a lot of this isn't actual crime and a lot of it isn't hate.
Instead, it is being misused to target and harass women.

It rarely considers the real life needs of women or children.

It is like a poster once told me I lacked compassion while I was discussing the exploitation of women’s bodies because I was not thinking of the needs of the people who benefited from that exploitation. I simply told them their meaning of compassion simply now included the very opposite of the intended meaning. They keep using the word on other threads and it never includes compassion for the women who are used effectively as resources for others to fulfill some need or other.

Oh there is plenty of misplaced hate on here.

Yeah we see it well.

The other day there was someone saying that hundreds of women should be subject to minor sexual offences to enable to dignity of transwomen.

We get it just fine.

I should add it was on the same day as Michael Crick saying on TV that a small number of rapes of women was ok to facilitate the validation of transwomen.

You should phone the police.

Women can't get the police involved when they are standing watching the crime take place;

https://southallblacksisters.org.uk/news/who-does-the-police-work-for-a-statement-by-southall-black-sisters/

"Whatever happened to live and let live?"

It died a quick death when rapists in women's jails opened the public's eyes.

A friend of mine (male) said last time I saw him he really didn't care how people identified. It didn't bother him. It made no difference. He thought people were just people.

And it really upset me and annoyed me at the time and it took me a few days to work out just why it had bothered me so much.

It was the phrase 'I don't care' that got to me.

And that's when I realised. He didn't care because it didn't affect him. The effects were off his radar. They had no impact on him. And he didn't care about the effect on women because that wasn't an issue for him. It was invisible. When he said 'I don't care' he was saying more than he realised.

He was saying I don't care about women, or lesbians or other religious groups or any other group that it DID impact on. Cos they weren't his concern.

His only concern was to be nice and accommodating. He is an outdoor instructor so he has to observe the sensitivities but he's not closely involved enough to make more of an impact. He DID get the safeguarding issue of mixed accommodation and agreed that couldn't happen but was concerned about kids with mental health issues, which trans kids have a high comorbidity over, being isolated in single room provision (again fair point - but if the kids are supposed to be inclusive there shouldn't be an issue with single sex either - and the heavy drive for validation at an early age by pro-trans campaigning is actually part of the problem in this context. As is not addressing bullying, sexism, homophobia and actual transphobia rather than this imaged GC boogieman).

I am not sure if I will raise it with him next time I see him. In fairness, him and his gf did listen and were slightly surprised at a few points I made. They are nice people and are well intentioned. I did get across the point that you can't say that they are more well intentioned or inform than me (and other gender skeptics though) and I just didn't see it the same way as them as I could see harms they hadn't identified. But I don't think it's at a stage I can push it further just yet.

But the phrase really brought it home to me: he's well intentioned, happy to accept people for who not what they are but just didn't care about womens' rights because they aren't on his radar and he hadn't considered them and they don't impact him.

sauce for the goose.
If you can have a talking to by the police for taking a photo of a sticker that you didn't even stick, that must be recorded somewhere.

Is that one of these Hate Crimes?

What about all the actual crimes against women? what about all the shouting and argy bargy and awful signs being shown at LWS events? are they being recorded somewhere? (perhaps all the LWS people should identify as transwomen for the day?)

Scepticism of hate crime figures is not hateful, particularly when figures like this are used to heavily persuade legislators into making legislation that negatively affects the majority.

It seems like a lot of people don't want this figures analysed.

Lies, damned lies and statistics.

Have a fainting couch and actually read the thread.

You are extremely rude and ignorant to tar people with a brush of your making. You know nothing about me, my life experiences or my worldview. The hate towards trans people and the idea that they are a massive problem to women has been largely created by the right wing press and while specific examples of crimes against women perpetrated by the trans community are possible to find, in REALITY and not lala land (where the readers of the likes of the Daily Heil and the Torygraph actually live) these examples are thankfully extremely rare. Live and let live means stop demonising a group who have done nothing to deserve it.

The evidence suggests that TW retain male pattern offending. Therefore they are as big a risk to women as other males. Most males are nor a risk to women so most TW aren't going to attack women but it is wrong to pretend there is any good rationale for letting male bodied TW into women's spaces and not all the other male bodied people. Sadly the risks are not made up and that reality needs engaging with.

Yeah ok.

Lovely to meet you.

Oh goody. The same old regurgitated bullshit!

Anyway, here's an example of a hate crime, apparently:

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10162480/police-transgender-woman-investigate-porn/

Whatever happened to 'considering all parties, balancing needs and safeguarding'?

how much campaigning do you about the conditions and rights of women in prisons? vis a vis having men put in with them?

What are you doing to highlight and combat the problems of women who belong to religions that don't allow them to be anywhere with a man they are not related to? now they are self excluding from "inclusive" gyms and so on?

etc etc