Female surgeons sexually assaulted by colleagues while operating

[yourhairiswinterfire]

A major analysis of NHS staff has found.

BBC News has spoken to women who were sexually assaulted in the operating theatre while surgery took place.

The study's authors say there is a pattern of female trainees being abused by senior male surgeons, and this is happening now, in NHS hospitals.

The Royal College of Surgeons said the findings were "truly shocking".

Sexual harassment, sexual assault and rape have been referred to as surgery's open secret.
There is an untold story of women being fondled inside their scrubs, of male surgeons wiping their brow on their breasts and men rubbing erections against female staff. Some have been offered career opportunities for sex.
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Nearly two-thirds of women surgeons who responded to the researchers said they had been the target of sexual harassment and a third had been sexually assaulted by colleagues in the past five years.
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Registered surgeons - men and women - were invited to take part completely anonymously and 1,434 responded. Half were women:

• 63% of women had been the target of sexual harassment from colleagues
• 30% of women had been sexually assaulted by a colleague
• 11% of women reported forced physical contact related to career opportunities
• At least 11 incidents of rape were reported
• 90% of women, and 81% of men, had witnessed some form of sexual misconduct

While the report shows men are also subject to some of this behaviour (24% had been sexually harassed), it concludes men and women surgeons are "living different realities".

The pair of reports suggest the relatively lower proportion of women surgeons (around 28%), combined with surgery being deeply hierarchical, gives some men significant power and this combines badly with the high-pressure environment of surgery.

"That leads to people being able to behave with impunity and much of this goes unchecked," Prof Carrie Newlands, consultant surgeon from the University of Surrey.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-66775015

Given the dates (1986-2020), I suspect he was a student around the last tranche of medical students for whom the quota was still in place (women weren't be be more than 10% of a medical or dental school intake).

I've been sexually assaulted by doctors in hospital, twice. Not the UK, not that it's any different! I've been raped by medics who were my boyfriends.

What pisses me off most about the results of this research is the shock.

What's shocking about men in power sexually assaulting women who are lower than them?

Is it that they're in positions of trust?

Well, back to the point above, doubled.

The issue is they're taught to believe they're god and we believe they are too.

This news was only shocking if you view surgeons/doctors as some special class of humans. They have a special class of skills. Then they're people who do things other people do.

The only bit that shocked me wasn't that it happens, or that it happens so much (as you say - men in power, we all know what that means). Or the ineffectiveness of complaints. It's that so much of it is so very public.

Entitled men are a problem everywhere, but in most workplaces these days they make at least a token effort to hide it. In a meeting in your average office they may ask women to take the notes, and make the coffee, and will ignore what they say - but they save the groping for a quiet corner rather than doing it half way through a PowerPoint presentation.

A few years ago there was a scandal about the practice in teaching hospitals of allowing students to carry out pelvic examinations on anaesthetised women (who were their for unrelated reasons). So you'd go in for, say, surgery on your shoulder, and while you were under anaesthesia, several students would practise their pelvic exam technique on you without your knowledge or consent. The practice is more widespread in the US - this article suggests that non-consensual pelvic exams are still legal in 29 states - but is not unknown in the UK either. Essentially, many female patients will have been a victim of sexual assault while they were unconscious, without even being aware of it.

Students have also carried out non-consensual prostates on anaesthetised men, but to nothing like the same degree.

This seems like a clear example of the medical establishment's disregard for women as full humans: the educational needs of a few students trumps the (pretty fucking basic) need to get consent from women for an unneeded and sensitive medical intervention.

The irony is that, when they actually bother to ask women explicitly about this, many do actually consent (or consider consenting) to a pelvic exam under anaesthesia, for educational purposes. So there isn't even any need to go about things in such a cloak and dagger way, and with such contempt for the dignity and consent of female patients.

Sorry, bit of a derail but also illustrative of the way that many male doctors view female patients (and, presumably, colleagues).

The survey asked about issues in the last few years.

Not over the lifetime of their careers.

Even the OP quotes the following point:

Nearly two-thirds of women surgeons who responded to the researchers said they had been the target of sexual harassment and a third had been sexually assaulted by colleagues in the past five years.

That not 'things changing'. That's a very immediate and current problem.

A few years ago there was a scandal about the practice in teaching hospitals of allowing students to carry out pelvic examinations on anaesthetised women (who were their for unrelated reasons). So you'd go in for, say, surgery on your shoulder, and while you were under anaesthesia, several students would practise their pelvic exam technique on you without your knowledge or consent.

Fucking hell!

To be fair, in the posts to this point this has only been raised once.

The vast majority of posters haven't made it all about "the trans issue".

Also to add I do agree it's all part of the bigger issue as it's a fact that with limited cash and resource for training, there's plenty in the pot for D and I projects but apparently men need training on assault being wrong

Yes, it is. You are specifically targeting trans recognition as somehow tainted by this issue to whip up more anger in an already foaming transphobic space.
If you really think less trans education would have meant a better deal for women born women, you don't understand the issues.

Doh

Posted too soon

So yes - I just wanted to make some posters aware that the point made by the earlier poster isn't making THIS discussion just about a trans issue as actually, claims like that are just as much of a dog whistle/klaxon for others to pop along and try to misrepresent what's being discussed

To be honest pelvic exams under general are probably the most sanitised tip of the iceberg.

This 👆🏼

There is a general disregard and dehumanisation of women going on.

They are second class citizens when it comes to health care on many many levels.

I mentioned upthread a bunch of them. So did others.

Virtually all did not mention the trans issue.

The lack of respect and dignity for women is the ultimate issue here. The fact that policy is being written with regards to trans issues that echoes this general lack of consideration for women and womens issues is reflective of that, but it isn't the key issue.

The key issue is that decision makers in the NHS management are sexist and protectionist. They are often men. Especially if they are from the clinical side. Top surgeons are commonly in these roles.

The overall cultural is one where the reputation of the hospital is put before patients and staff. This enables abuses of power and harms to patients and staff to occur because of a lack of safeguarding. Where safeguarding exists it is not being enforced or taken seriously.

Women are affected by:
Men being regarded as the 'default' in research
Men being regarded as the 'default' in training
Poor understanding of women's health issues generally
Poor understanding of the difference in presentation of certain conditions between men and women.
Poor understanding of women's social issues
A socialisation of women to not complain when they should
A culture of intimidating women to not complain when they should
A culture of not intervening when seeing abuse towards other staff or patients
Poorer outcomes with male surgeons on female patients
A lack of single sex ward provision which leaves women particularly vulnerable (this is even more so when it comes to mental health). There is a total lack of value placed on the importance of safeguarding.
Male doctors being proven to listen less to what a female patient says than a male patient
A culture that believes that women can deal with pain better than men (which has been disproven).
Ideological belief being particularly influential in women health care (its absoluetely rife when it comes to female reproduction). This happens even when research is showing results to be in favour of the option which isn't in line with the ideological belief. I've seen conclusions written up saying exactly the opposition to the study's findings.
Inappropriate services (hello Bounty) only exist on female wards
Women's complains are taken less seriously and are dismissed.
Women are socialised to more compliant - and when they are not they are labelled as 'difficult' or worse 'abusive' even when they are merely asserting themselves fairly.
The idea that you need training to stop sexually assaulting other staff is sexist too.

To name but a few.

The trans issue, sticks out because it effectively documents this sexism by writing them down formally in policy. And that does make it quite shocking. But as I say its merely symptomatic of the bigger issue:

Healthcare is institutionally sexist.

Dr Peter Hilton has given the issue a little more life in the DM (i googled his name and some mad lads had put snarky comments under a letter someone with that name had written over a year ago).

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12513355/Snowflake-doctors-need-toughen-Retired-anaesthetist-sparks-backlash-telling-medics-four-s-level-not-answer-problems-face-female-NHS-surgeons-shared-accounts-sex-assaults-male-colleagues.html

Although, seeing that 'This is going to hurt' guy getting all sanctimonious....well.

Good list, @RedToothBrush .

Although I'd add to:

A culture that believes that women can deal with pain better than men (which has been disproven).

That it's also a culture that believes women are more emotional/likely to make a fuss about trivial amounts of pain whereas a man will only seek medical help if it really truly hurts. (Also disproven.)

So they've got us coming and going.

I may borrow Arabella's folding chair, blanket, and flask to wait for the revelation that, historically, prostate exams were carried out on unconscious men without asking for consent.

I can see this easily happening. Junior female staff member complains about an incident from a senior male clinical colleague. HR actually go through the motions of an investigation but produce a generic finding about culture needing changing and possibly a verbal warning to the male with a departmental lecture to improve 'respect'.

The department views the complaint as a vicious slur against an esteemed colleague and bringing the department into disrepute. The complainant is frozen out the team with possible comments about mental health. The complaint is viewed as tantamount to a false or spurious allegation against a senior team member and therefore her position is untenable ultimately and future career options are limited. Colleagues do not stand up for her as simply they don't want to be the next one ostracised.

The more experienced hard nosed members of the team look at the snowflake complainant with disdain. 'For f&#s were dealing with life and death decisions in a pressurised environment which is utterly reliant on team working and the precious little trainee pisses everyone off by complaining ...... and she was going to have a career....so sad'

I know from experience complaining about colleagues is a viewed as practically criminal in the NHS so no wonder no one reports these things internally.

Dr Hilton ain't backing down

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/backlash-over-doctor-arguing-female-surgeons-need-to-toughen-up-257gw6cww

It has been archived.

I know from experience complaining about colleagues is a viewed as practically criminal in the NHS so no wonder no one reports these things internally.

In light of this report but also what happened with Letby this is very worrying. How many abusers are getting away with terrible things in the nhs because people are scared to speak up?

Here is another entitled one.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12514129/Married-doctor-junior-colleague-accused-sexual-harassment.html

I wonder of part of the reason the "theatre sexual assaults" issue has not been dealt with is that both victims and perps will be in the same union?

A consultant psychiatrist and head of dept, who was an appalling bully generally, physically assaulted several male colleagues (medics) and got away with shocking behaviour for years despite multiple official complaints and grievances.

The Trust only finally took notice only after he bullied and threatened a female secretary and Unison threatened to take all members out on strike if nothing was done.

The only "punishment" he got was demotion from his Head of Dept role and being pushed into early retirement. It wasn't enough but it was an improvement in working conditions for everyone else.

The BMA did nothing effective to help the junior medics (male) who had been physically assaulted. I haven't read the articles yet so apologies if this is a red herring and the BMA (or other medical union, there are some much smaller ones) actually have tried to to help.

I think this is a really good point and what I was trying to say earlier with the comment about harassment of nurses. The consultants hold all the power of the surgical trainees and also a lot if the power in the BMA. Therefore if you are a junior doctor who complains against someone above you they are likely to side against you and with the member with more power. This is exactly what happened with my friend, who was pressured by the harasser's manager to drop the complaint and then bullied by him for the rest of the time she was based in that hospital. The BMA were spectacularly useless, gave lots of incorrect advice and eventually decided that they wouldn't support a tribunal claim (even though that's supposed be be included in the subscription), because her case wasn't strong enough, partially due to the incorrect advice they had given earlier.

In contrast if you are a nurse/HCA/ member of admin staff you have a separate management structure to complain within and union to support you. If you are lucky they might be prepared to go in strong for you against the doctor as in the UNISON case above. This is still likely to be heavily dependent on the culture of your union and your hospital though, and ultimately the consultants still hold a position of power over the whole hospital and I am sure there are female NHS staff in all job roles that are treated appalling by senior men.

I regret mentioning the trans thing now and I'm really pleased the conversation has moved on in the way it has. It's an area that I feel very strongly about and I really hope that this expose has a real impact on the way surgical trainees are treated.

If that is the case, do you not think that there is an upbringing issue here? These men would have been brought up in the midst of their mother, sister, aunt, friend, neighbour and have still acquired this outrageous habit?

It has been mentioned that surgery is one of the professions with a high incidence of psychopathy.

Are psychopathic tendencies innate, due to upbringing or a mixture of nature and nurture?

Is their expression situational, ie. psychopathic surgeons sexually assault female surgeons and theatre nurses because they are "available" to be sexually assaulted without adverse consequences; in the absence of women and children to assault, the psychiatrist I mentioned above physically assaulted male colleagues who he considered to be "beneath him".

Most men are raised around at least some female relatives. Are you wondering if the presence of female relatives in childhood might inoculate men from developing "outrageous habits" like rape and sexual assault?

I don't know if there is any truth to it but these days bad behaviour by males is often blamed on "absent fathers" and the lack of suitable male role models.

This was normal when I was a student at Cambridge in the 90s. Not performing surgery, but observing it in training at Addenbrooke's, female medical students in my group of friends used to have to put up with male surgeons and other male doctors putting their hands down their (my friends') shirts to feel their breasts.

None felt they could complain, because their careers depended on these abusers.

I had hoped things had improved, though, since then. :(