The gender war is over in Britain apparently

[CatMattress]

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/08/uk-trans-rights-labour-party/674944/

Seen on reddit. Haven't seen any discussion on MN so apologies if I missed this being posted. Labour have dropped self ID? When? I feel so out of the loop (I blame the summer holidays. Hell on wheels, my god. I can't remember the last time I had a pee without being interrupted never mind read the news)

Good news OP.

I don't for one moment think Labour are supportive of Brexit. So called improving the deal is likely to mean closer ties to Europe in piecemeal fashion. Brexit will die by stealth. RIP. At least I hope so. Let's not derail the thread by my aside comment though.

That’s especially the case now that gender dysphoria is no longer classified – and stigmatised – as a psychiatric disorder.

From that Guardian article by Annaliese Dodds

Not strictly relevant to the point we're discussing, but the sentence I quoted seems to imply that it's fine that my own diagnosis, bipolar affective disorder, is stigmatised. After all, it is a psychiatric disorder

I am an ex-pat in the US and have exactly the same problem… only worse. On the one hand, the Democrats who are all in favour of trans rights without a thought guven to those of women and children. On the other, the prospect of a Republican President and Congress that would carry on handing over anything that isn’t nailed down to their mates. Even more horrible is the prospect of Trump as President… I sometimes find myself hoping that he’ll stand as a third candidate and split the right-wing vote, then I realise that would hand the Presidency to the Dems and I have to pour myself another glass of wine. I mean, I’d probably do that anyway , but still.

You only need to look back a relatively short period of time (1980s) to see that Labour were all for leaving the European bloc. Plenty of people who were Labour then are still involved in the party, albeit on a more senior level these days.

I don't want to derail the thread either but killing off Brexit by stealth, instead of campaigning for another referendum, sounds like seriously undemocratic behaviour. I say that as a remainer who is still dismayed by what happened.

And to get my post back on track, that's a good demonstration of why so many of us don't trust Labour (or in my case, any party) to keep their word on gender.

This is the problem

And because trans gender is seen as legitimate rather than a MH issue or psychiatric issue to address and treat like that, doctors will be issuing these anyway, regardless of how many doctors are needed.

No one is asking the right questions, its just accepted that if you feel like this, you must be this and we'll issue the certificate for you

I don't want to derail the thread either but killing off Brexit by stealth, instead of campaigning for another referendum, sounds like seriously undemocratic behaviour. I say that as a remainer who is still dismayed by what happened.

The particular form of Brexit we got, little short of hard, was pushed in a seriously in democratic manner don’t forget.

We do not live in a democracy. The particular form we have is ranked as minimal democracy, and the trend is to minimise further.

undemocratic that should be

And so the answer is even less democracy?

I'm not discussing Brexit any further on this thread because it's not fair. But to repeat my point, this is how trust in all the political parties breaks down. And it means we no longer believe anything else they say.

So on one hand we need to trust Labour to get us back in the EU. Yes their policy is to keep Brexit. But they don't really mean it, they're just saying that to appease certain voters.

But on the other hand, we need to believe Labour will stick to their revised No Self-ID policy. And they definitely mean it. And they're not just saying that to appease certain voters.

Quite.

So ... we can't trust a thing they say, then.

Sometimes they say things they don't mean, but we should trust that they will always do the Right Thing, even if they say they are actually doing something else.

Sounds positive. I've posted on these boards under different names over the years but it’s become very apparent that with such a direct clash of needs, the only workable solution is to separate sex and gender as much as possible. This paves the way for unimpeded kindness and sensitivity toward trans people, and truly protected single sex spaces.

Not everyone will be happy and there will still be discourse on both sides but I do really think it is the only solution.

I think this is the start of it and it will build momentum as the GE approaches. The trans shitshow will hopefully die with the disastrous government that facilitated and implemented it.

For the first time in ages I feel hopeful.

Build momentum how?

Quietly and effectively.

Well done GC women of Labour. They're starting to hear you.👏👏👏🙌

Right. They've barred LWD from conference again. Stopping women speak, is this what you mean by 'quietly'?

Do you have a link?

labourwomensdeclaration.org.uk/lwd-at-labour-conference-2023-lwd-statement-comment-from-labour-politicians/

Read? I quoted you.
'I'd personally rather have the tories'

I didn't say you'd vote for them.

Me too.

I might start feeling hopeful when they talk to people like Rosie, and Joan Smith. Until then I reckon it's just window dressing.

I'm keeping an eye on Joan Smith on Twitter. She's firmly on the left and has always been very loyal to Labour but some days she can barely hide her contempt for the party leadership.

I have always voted labour but this election I will vote Tory. I will be gutted if labour win.

All I can say is THANK FUCK the tories have been in power (words I NEVER thought I would say) - can you imagine the absolute shit show we would be in if we had had a labour government - women's rights completely dismantled. At least the tories have stuck their heels in the ground and slowed the mad gender-bender-horse-and-cart down.

And when someone says - 'yes but what about all the other problems the tories have caused, what about the privatisation & corruption? Labour will be better'

I say - What, do you actually think Keir Starmer is going to come in and save the day? Pay nurses higher and nationalise the railways and fix the NHS? Do you think they have the power or the will to do so?

As if.

The same shit is going to go on, but with more wishy washy escuses and loads of woke virtue-signalling with ill-thought through policies that will no doubt be detrimental.

So would you rather the situation this country is in PLUS gender destruction of women's rights,

or,

this situation plus a conservation of existing values?

Because sorry but I don't think Starmer has the will or the backbone to swoop in and save the day. Just 'smile & wave. Smile & wave.'

I think I prefer the strong politicians who don't mind being unpopular. Kemi Badendoch for prime minister!