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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

First Direct and Natwest closing bank accounts for political reasons inc being gender critical

698 replies

Snorkers · 30/06/2023 15:47

Apprently First Direct have closed the account of the Wings over Scotland founder for his beliefs (He's Gender Critical), and Coutts, owned by Natwest, closed Nigel Farage's account.
Whatever you think of Nigel Farage he is entitled to a bank account.

This is really worrying.

I bank with First Direct. I am gender critical. Do I need to hide my beliefs to keep my bank account? Will tey stop me getting access to my money?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12249755/Nigel-Farage-claims-three-loved-ones-bank-accounts-closed-Brexit.html

Are banks shutting accounts of customers with anti-woke beliefs?

Mr Farage has not named the bank who plan to shut his personal and business accounts this summer, but is understood to be Coutts, the famous 327-year-old private bank whose clients include the Royal Family.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12249755/Nigel-Farage-claims-three-loved-ones-bank-accounts-closed-Brexit.html

OP posts:
Thread gallery
78
Needmoresleep · 01/07/2023 11:08

As I said, it is an issue I have only come across in passing and in which I have no expertise.

I understand that there was legislation passed last week which splits domestic and international PEPs, suggesting a recognition of the complexity of international banking and international clients.

FedgeHund · 01/07/2023 11:10

This is really interesting.

Take Nancy Pelosi and the family semi conductor business in Taiwan. If NATO went to war with China, where would that PEP stand internationally in banking?

Kennykenkencat · 01/07/2023 11:12

It isn't one about Free Speech for me. It's one about something entirely different. And Farage's case is something else again

Well let’s hope you don’t get your account blocked. Wondering what I have done to get my account blocked.

Spent 2 days trying to get it unblocked with no luck.

No idea what is going on as I have money in my account but none of my direct debits have been paid . They don’t show up on my account as having been presented but I know they have, they have just not been paid

I know some people have had their account closed for things like matched betting. And you can’t just go elsewhere as every bank is informed that your account was closed and you can’t open another account

Tukmgru · 01/07/2023 11:14

Oh I’m sure it’s nothing to do with the fact that these guys are variously bankrupt or - in Farage’s case - being investigated for taking money from a sanctioned entity linked to a hostile state.

Why people continue to fall for these snake oil salesman contrarians is beneath me.

Kennykenkencat · 01/07/2023 11:20

I think that people are too quick to make excuses and lay blame at people they don’t like and think they must have done something wrong to have that happen to them.

If someone in the public eye who has a platform to name and shame can have this happen them there is nothing to stop it happening to someone who hasn’t got a platform to shout from.

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 01/07/2023 11:20

Tukmgru · 01/07/2023 11:14

Oh I’m sure it’s nothing to do with the fact that these guys are variously bankrupt or - in Farage’s case - being investigated for taking money from a sanctioned entity linked to a hostile state.

Why people continue to fall for these snake oil salesman contrarians is beneath me.

In the case of this feminist group, the Co-Op bank explicitly denied them an account for wanting a single-sex organisation. They were not coy about it: they boasted about it, in a public-facing report.

But, sure, there is nothing to see here 🙄

Co-operative bank bans feminist group from using its services

The bank claims the unnamed group has 'actively declined the rights of members of the transgender community', sparking a furious backlash from British activists.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5852547/Co-operative-bank-bans-feminist-group-using-services.html

RedToothBrush · 01/07/2023 11:23

Needmoresleep · 01/07/2023 11:08

As I said, it is an issue I have only come across in passing and in which I have no expertise.

I understand that there was legislation passed last week which splits domestic and international PEPs, suggesting a recognition of the complexity of international banking and international clients.

Splitting domestic and international makes sense. Purely from the perspective of individuals and managing their own affairs

Farage would fall into international though under any definition though a) because he was an MEP rather than MP b) he has worked in and has close associations with the US and us political parties c) the Russian connection and the Belize connection are hard to ignore as this is where he has received considerable known funding either directly or through his closest associates and this is public knowledge.

In terms of being classified as domestic that would encourage to keep all your income domestic. Which isn't that hard imho. If you are an MP what reasons do you have to have an income from overseas if you are employed and paid by the state?

If you have additional incomes this immediately constitutes declarations of interests and always potentially poses a conflict of interest. That's why secondary incomes are ALWAYS potentially problematic in politics. You HAVE to be squeaky clean.

Farage has never even attempted the squeaky clean approach. He has offshore interests which he has admitted. He has done foreign political rallies. There is no way he escapes.

All high profile political figures should be scruntinised and questioned in terms of their business and associates as a matter of standard practice. This is the cornerstone of democracy.

When he declared himself the lifelong leader of the Reform Party that really showed him up in terms of his ideas on democracy and disrespect for the views of others. It was a vehicle for pushing Brand Farage and Farage's own political interests. It was an overreach in a many ways.

Kennykenkencat · 01/07/2023 11:24

If you are aware that all your mates are being done for money laundering, distancing yourself from certain individuals might be wise. Farage has doubled down instead really

So you think he is guilty by association rather than actually doing anything wrong.

I don’t think that is an actual crime

RedToothBrush · 01/07/2023 11:26

Kennykenkencat · 01/07/2023 11:12

It isn't one about Free Speech for me. It's one about something entirely different. And Farage's case is something else again

Well let’s hope you don’t get your account blocked. Wondering what I have done to get my account blocked.

Spent 2 days trying to get it unblocked with no luck.

No idea what is going on as I have money in my account but none of my direct debits have been paid . They don’t show up on my account as having been presented but I know they have, they have just not been paid

I know some people have had their account closed for things like matched betting. And you can’t just go elsewhere as every bank is informed that your account was closed and you can’t open another account

As I say that's a different issue to the Farage one.

Farage is exploiting something else because it strikes a note with this section of the public but Farage's problems are very very different and do to with his risky associations and financial behaviour.

As for accounts closed for betting - depends on what and how it's being done. It IS a known route for laundering and that's the problem.

RedToothBrush · 01/07/2023 11:30

Kennykenkencat · 01/07/2023 11:24

If you are aware that all your mates are being done for money laundering, distancing yourself from certain individuals might be wise. Farage has doubled down instead really

So you think he is guilty by association rather than actually doing anything wrong.

I don’t think that is an actual crime

I think the banks have to do risk assessments.

They can't afford to be hit by huge fines or have their business restricted because of their duty to all their other customers and because of their obligations under law and banking regulations.

So yeah if you hang out with multiple known money launderers you are a dick. One is unfortunate, more than one is eyebrow raising.

It's like kids at school - be mindful of the company you keep and how that affects you. Don't be a dick and then wonder why it comes back at you.

Kennykenkencat · 01/07/2023 11:34

In terms of being classified as domestic that would encourage to keep all your income domestic. Which isn't that hard imho. If you are an MP what reasons do you have to have an income from overseas if you are employed and paid by the state

How many people own a holiday home abroad?
Or sell on eBay or Amazon to an overseas buyer

What about all the companies who export our goods and services overseas

What about the people who work for those companies and are benefitting from the overseas income in their paycheck.

Staying domestic is actually quite hard.

dcbc1234 · 01/07/2023 11:48

RedToothBrush · 01/07/2023 10:22

Fairly sure given that they make a point of speaking up on injustice they would say something tbh.

I worry you are being a bit naive to assume this and that is not like you at all. I appreciate your many insightful posts on politics etc.
Another bank may well have taken them on, on condition they did not publicise the fact. After all most Banks don't want to have all the young pro LGBTQ+ demographic closing accounts on them in a flounce, they are every Bank's future long-term account holders by virtue of their youth and future earning potential. The fact that many kids are being indoctrinated in school to accept the force-teaming of LGB and TQ+ and the media's originally biased presentation of these issues has a significant affect and has driven the corporate 'virtue-signalling' overkill.

RedToothBrush · 01/07/2023 11:50

Kennykenkencat · 01/07/2023 11:34

In terms of being classified as domestic that would encourage to keep all your income domestic. Which isn't that hard imho. If you are an MP what reasons do you have to have an income from overseas if you are employed and paid by the state

How many people own a holiday home abroad?
Or sell on eBay or Amazon to an overseas buyer

What about all the companies who export our goods and services overseas

What about the people who work for those companies and are benefitting from the overseas income in their paycheck.

Staying domestic is actually quite hard.

But being classed as a political exposed person is unusual and even if you buy things on eBay etc it's rarely high value and there is a trail that can be audited. And it's also about volume of that type of purchase. As for holiday homes - again register of interests applies anyway.

You are confusing issues and conflating accountability with financial irregularities.

Anyone who can't explain the source of money has an issue. If you are getting large sums from overseas that's different to occasional purchases. If you are having a high volume of unauditable small transactions again it raises questions about the source of that money.

The key points are irregular financial behaviour and public position and conflicts of interests. Especially foreign. Farage fails on all three.

RedToothBrush · 01/07/2023 12:01

mumda · 01/07/2023 11:56

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/building-society-admits-close-customers-200122654.html

For those saying it'll never affect them:
Building society admits it would close customers’ accounts if they are ‘rude or discriminate’ after Farage row

Read the thread.

BankName · 01/07/2023 12:07

RedToothBrush · 30/06/2023 22:29

Seven or eight banks refusing to bank with Farage smacks of secret service flags on his banking activity. Not his views.

A man whose personal office was run by a convicted money launderer.

There is no such thing as a “secret service flag” for banking activity. Banks aren’t even allowed to discuss financial crime decisions with other banks, so each individual institution is making an independent decision. Different institutions making the same decision, however, is rather telling; in cases like this one might expect a single significant factor, possibly an inability to show source of wealth / source of funds. It is very unlikely to represent personal views, or pretend government watchlists.

RedToothBrush · 01/07/2023 12:11

BankName · 01/07/2023 12:07

There is no such thing as a “secret service flag” for banking activity. Banks aren’t even allowed to discuss financial crime decisions with other banks, so each individual institution is making an independent decision. Different institutions making the same decision, however, is rather telling; in cases like this one might expect a single significant factor, possibly an inability to show source of wealth / source of funds. It is very unlikely to represent personal views, or pretend government watchlists.

So the FBI asking for a warrant and carrying out a criminal investigation in cooperation with a bank wouldn't be a secret service flag to a bank?

Not would the FBI actually naming someone as a person of interest?

It doesn't need to be a system where there is a secret service black list.

Just known irregularlies and causes for concern for banks.

Then when one bank says no, others are bound to follow suit if they feel it's a measured decision...

FedgeHund · 01/07/2023 12:48

The free speech union are saying that the Yorkshire building society requested feedback from the Anglican vicar, when they didn't like it they then closed his account.

DarkDayforMN · 01/07/2023 13:24

After reading the thread, I’m totally willing to presume Farage’s account was closed for legitimate non-sinister reasons, but what about the other cases? It still seems like there is something very sinister happening even if you completely disregard Farage’s case.

(Also I think there should be a human right to have a bank account to prevent this kind of abuse, and that should presumably include Farage because he’s presumably human.)

RedToothBrush · 01/07/2023 13:44

DarkDayforMN · 01/07/2023 13:24

After reading the thread, I’m totally willing to presume Farage’s account was closed for legitimate non-sinister reasons, but what about the other cases? It still seems like there is something very sinister happening even if you completely disregard Farage’s case.

(Also I think there should be a human right to have a bank account to prevent this kind of abuse, and that should presumably include Farage because he’s presumably human.)

It is perfectly possible there is more than one issue at hand though.

It need not be a singular issue.

Farage is hiding behind a potentially legitimate one. That's how he's always operated. Doesn't mean he's clean though.

SerendipityJane · 01/07/2023 14:05

Jung fans will of course have smiled at the fact that Farages bestie was at one time Arron Banks.

MowingTheTerf · 01/07/2023 14:09

First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

RedToothBrush · 01/07/2023 14:12

MowingTheTerf · 01/07/2023 14:09

First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

I'm quite happy for them to go after people who can't explain where their money came from. You know money launderers who have a habit of being criminals.

That's not the same as this quote being misused in a way to manipulate on a totally separate issue.

I think it's a gross misuse of the quote tbh.

Alyso · 01/07/2023 14:17

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

DarkDayforMN · 01/07/2023 14:24

It is perfectly possible there is more than one issue at hand though.

yes, agreed! I’m grateful for the additional context about Farage; I’ve always resisted finding out much about him.

But I’m still really disturbed about the banks closing down the accounts of loud political dissident types without explanation. So I hope the thread can be deFaraged to some extent!