Secretary of State for Education Gillian Keegan MN webchat - on 'trans' guidance for schools.

[ArabeIIaScott]

From 18 minutes, hopefully the link goes directly to the question.

Paraphrasing the 'sex and gender' question:


ValancyRedfern - should I affirm gender identity and keep secret from parents?

GK - I dont agree with that, transparency is important, parents' role very important, parents' first advocate for children.

GK - Call for trans guidance for schools, I'm working with Kemi Badenoch, putting that together. Long consultation, I want everyone's views. Published before summer term and then there'll be a long consultation, be great if MNers could respond to that.


Brief, but sounds sensible as far as it goes.

[PaleBlueMoonlight]

Problem is that they are putting it up for consultation, not producing guidance, which reduces the likelihood of guidance being in place before the election. I thought they said that they were going to publish guidance, or was this always what they said?

[BonfireLady]

I thought they said that they were going to publish guidance, or was this always what they said?

Agreed. It does seem like the boundaries have shifted on this timeframe. Thinking positively, they are already sharing very widely some key principles that will be in it, such as tightening up on age appropriate content and also things like her comment about involving parents.

Perhaps the consultation will be a good way of filtering out viewpoints which are not based on verifiable evidence. Regardless of whether they consult or not, there are bound to be many voices which disagree with the proposed guidance. It's an opportunity for anyone who previously may have had a no debate approach (e.g. protest and drown out) to put forward their persuasive, evidence-based argument.

[ResisterRex]

I would think they now have to consult as without it, the risk of legal challenge...well...not even a risk is it? It's a given.

[BonfireLady]

@ResisterRex

I would think they now have to consult as without it, the risk of legal challenge...well...not even a risk is it? It's a given.

Indeed. I guess it doesn't help that the debate on the clarification of the Equality Act hasn't happened yet.
The ambiguitity within the Act is what underpins the current DfE guidance, which conflates sex and gender, and results in further ambiguity. Many schools then take the guidance and further conflate it all with sexual orientation.

So they are presumably on legally shifting sand at the moment when it comes to the foundations behind the school guidance. Hopefully the EHRC letter from April, in response to Kemi Badenoch's February letter, can break through all of the noise and media misrepresentation so that common sense prevails in the debate on 12th June.

[PaleBlueMoonlight]

True. If they can get it all done in time, hopefully it will at least be legally solid.

[ArabeIIaScott]

I was a bit confused, tbh, by her timeline. She seemed to say guidelines/consultation/guidelines?

[FigRollsAlly]

Did she mean draft guidelines/consultation/guidelines?

[PaleBlueMoonlight]

Probably draft guidelines to consult on, followed by actual guidelines that take into account the results of the consultation?

[Leafstamp]

The last paragraph here says the Dept for Education:
will publish guidance for schools for the summer term on how to respond to children who are questioning their gender identity.

This is separate to the RSHE review, which is stated will be complete by the end of 2023.

Review of relationships, sex and health education to protect children to conclude by end of year - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

[Leafstamp]

But whether that means the guidance for gender questioning children will be consulted on (as she seemed to indicate in the interview), who knows?!

[ValancyRedfern]

Ooh fame at last! I haven't watched yet but thanks for the link. The guidance was originally promised to come out last Autumn so I'm not holding my breath.

[ValancyRedfern]

The timeline makes no sense. The summer term started after Easter. If she means the last half term, then that starts on the 5th June so she's got a week to get the guidance out.

Also, why do they need to consult on the guidance? They know what responses they'll get. It just seems like a delaying tactic.

Very happy to hear her say categorically that parents should be told though. Which I could share with my slt, but don't want them to know my posting name!!!

[rogdmum]

The plan was always that this would be draft guidance put out for public consultation. What worries me is that she is saying a LONG consultation which to me sounds like more and more delay (to an already very much delayed piece of work) and kicking the can even further down the road before we get anything of substance from the govt.

[ArabeIIaScott]

Yes. Given the Scotgov's awful approach to consultations (demand masses of input from people, then ignore it and go with whatever you feel like) I'm less and less convinced of their value, except as a way of saying 'we did ask you'.

[DarkDayforMN]

Is it possibly they’re kicking the can down the road because they want this to be an election issue?

[ValancyRedfern]

I think it's more likely they just don't want to deal with it at all

[IcakethereforeIam]

I'm not sure if this is the most appropriate thread, please feel free to repost.

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2023/may/31/sex-education-in-schools-in-england-to-be-reviewed-by-expert-panel

Tra toys are not yet airborne but it's only a matter of time.

[BonfireLady]

@IcakethereforeIam

I'm not sure if this is the most appropriate thread, please feel free to repost.

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2023/may/31/sex-education-in-schools-in-england-to-be-reviewed-by-expert-panel

Tra toys are not yet airborne but it's only a matter of time.

Interesting deviation from the Guardian. I wouldn't call it entirely balanced but it's heading in that direction. It's certainly a change from the "everything is fine, nothing to see here, you're all bigots" line that they normally take. Progress, albeit slowly.

[TooBigForMyBoots]

Keegan really likes fudging this issue. She should not be in charge of our children's education. Here's some of her other work.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4651945-trans-guidance-for-schools-that-british-fudge-that-so-often-works?page=1