I thought I was a liberal mother, then my daughter came out as trans

[IwantToRetire]

This is the title of an article in the Telegraph that isn't behind a paywall.

The article is very similar to some that have been posted on FWR (but maybe had somesort of editing as parts read quite oddly).

Unfortunately the comments posted suggest that despite the number of articles the Telegraph has published about trans issues it certainly hasn't educate all of their readers. More interested in blaming the mother, and the fact that she wasn't upset that her daughter had said she was a lesbian, but was that she said she was trans.

Makes me doubt that having right wing papers published gender critical aware articles isn't actually achieveing much.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/family/parenting/liberal-mother-daughter-came-out-trans/

It seems to be behind a paywall now.

Paywall here too. Unfortunate, would be interesting to read

If you click thw link then quickly go on airplane mode that should do the trick

That is brilliant. I didn't realise that would work!

I can see hundreds of supportive comments from readers sympathetic to the mother. There are numerous comments about the dangers that Mermaids and Stonewall pose to children , critical of the GP & Social Services involvement in the case & aware of the one way path that some children end up on to drugs & surgery. There are posts critical of the mother's "trendy lefty " position and no doubt some wedging in Brexit given this is the Telegraph 🙄

Just a shame this wasn't published in the Guardian 😁

This link should work:

digitaleditions.telegraph.co.uk/data/1304/reader/reader.html?social#!preferred/0/package/1304/pub/1304/page/66/article/NaN

One sentence in the article is absolutely chilling: the social worker who visits the family of a 13 year old girl who told her parents the previous year she was trans: the social worker described the child as a “13-year-old white British male who was born into a biologically female body”. !!!!
I could just about accept if the social worker had written “13 year old white British youth, born biologically female but now desires to live as a boy” — but to begin the descriptions as “13 year old… male” seems criminal.

I think it's a great article, you can feel how difficult it can be from a mother's point of view while also showing that some sense can emerge with time by staying connected to the teen and by emphasising the achievements of women, sometimes with the odds stacked against them.

This stood out to me. She's not male. And if social work records detail her as such, should the child's situation ever be that she's in a part of the secure estate, where would she be placed? Or if in foster care, what other children with what needs or offending patterns would she be placed with? It lays a path that's so dangerous.

The thing is one is compelled to go along with SS for the sake of keeping ones child, so triply insidious.

I mean make it clear you disagree with that in fron of Social worker where would that lead? It's 1984 style chilling

Brilliant!!! That definitely should be on iPhone tips!

For anyone who's not read this (as I post if often) this is a judgement from Mr Justice Hayden where he's very critical of social workers and otjher professionals who all colluded with a mentally unwell mother who claimed her young son was a girl. This of course wasn't true, the child suffered significant emotional abuse and she lost custody of him to her estranged partner. The judge is scathing about the behaviour of the professionals who, along with Mermaids who were eventually forbidden to have contact with the child, effectively enabled the extended abuse of the child:

https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Fam/2016/2430.html

Yes. I live in Scotland. Fell foul of (the threat of) the Named Person law when seeking help for my Autistic child. NP was challenged by the Supreme Court but the SNP didn't back down. It is still being bandied about now where I am - essentially it gives legal powers over a child's welfare to anyone but the parent.

I had a call from my Dd's school last year. To inform me that 'He wished to have his Exam & School records changed. It's a courtesy call not a req. for permission'. I pointed out that my child had been there for less than a year, had just joined a friendship group where everyone appeared to be 'Trans' & that my child was both Autistic & selectively mute so somewhat vulnerable. The School person started to speak about SS & I quickly remarked that it was fortunate that this child lived in a supportive home, as School had just 'outed' them very throughly indeed before checking that. I have heard no more to date & exams/name are currently still as birth. I've a child searching for identity as is normal with teens. She feels she is gay, & the logical conclusion to that for her, with her ASD, is that to fancy girls she 'must' be a boy. I've tried to talk to her about that, taken her on a Pride march to walk with other gay women (but the march just frightened her as we encountered some really aggressive people, both some marchers & Police)
We tiptoe forward but its a scary time in Scotland as Trans is being pushed hard here & its the most vulnerable, like my child, who are most vulnerable to it.

My DD was telling me about a pupil of hers, an autistic Girl who is now apparently ‘legally’ Male at 16, ( after only a few months) teachers have been instructed to use Male name/pronouns.

I queried the legality of what they’ve been told but DD can’t see the point in challenging it when the pupil will leave in two months anyway.
This child is supposedly on hormones and is down for surgery - I thought waiting lists in England were years long?

This is a rough school in a deprived area, not a grammar in a leafy suburb. It’s heart breaking that yet another autistic Girl has been groomed into this.

Sorry about the link problem have no idea why I was able to read it last night!

But glad the comments have improved and take back my moan about having GC articles in right wing papers isn't working.

Unfortunately cant do airplane mode on my computer so cant catch up on comments.

Was wondering about posting links to similar stories on FWR.

So thanks for the digital link.

I think stories in any political leaning of paper are good as they all bring scrutiny to the issue. Sunlight is said to be the best of disinfectants..

”13 year old white British youth, born biologically female but now desires to live as a boy”

Why did the social worker say she is white? How is that relevant?

I wonder if the child had said she was black the social worker would have stated that too?

One sentence in the article is absolutely chilling: the social worker who visits the family of a 13 year old girl who told her parents the previous year she was trans: the social worker described the child as a “13-year-old white British male who was born into a biologically female body”. !!!!
I could just about accept if the social worker had written “13 year old white British youth, born biologically female but now desires to live as a boy” — but to begin the descriptions as “13 year old… male” seems criminal

Indeed. Slightly different but on a similar theme about written health care records, when my daughter's CAMHS hospital report came back stating that she "identified as male" I knew that this was incorrect because I was there when the (excellent) counsellor met with her. I wrote several letters asking why this statement had been made. When I didn't get responses, I escalated within CAMHS and I also raised a legally binding Subject Access Request (I requested her entire health record, internal communications within CAMHS relating to her and any written notes), to understand how this statement came to be made.

This series of actions eventually kicked off an incredibly productive conversation, where I met with the counsellor and senior management.

It transpired that the statement had been made following observational input from a nurse. It was confirmed the she never did identify as male at any point. The counsellor had been following the correct procedure to take multiple inputs when compiling his report. As part of the conversation, the senior management (who also oversee multiple hospital crisis teams) told me that they would review protocols so that this kind of thing didn't happen again. There were many other positives that came from the conversation too. From the conversation that I had, I believe our discussions will have a positive impact on other autistic girls who fall under their care if they meet with any of the CAMHS hospital teams within that group. There needs to be far greater discussion in health care about autistic girls and gender identity. They represent a significant cohort of children who present with gender dysphoria (48% according to a paper written by 2 Tavistock clinicians) but the conflation of autism and gender identity confusion seems to be very poorly understood.

She was presenting with gender incongruence, and I was happy for the records and referral to reflect this. However, there is a big difference between her confusion over her gender identity and an assertion that she identified as male. By stating that, they had completed a social transition on her behalf.

Her discharge report was subsequently corrected and this statement was removed. Not only was this important for the sake of her health records but it was also part of their referral to our local CAMHS team. So it was especially important that she wasn't referred on to them with this misinformation included. The referral letter was also reissued with the corrected information.

Bonfirelady That is a terrifying post. I can well imagine at that age, a child would go along with a social transition being completed for them.

You are conditioned at that age to be told who you are and what you believe, particularly if you're a girl. And particularly in a health care setting where you already feel intimidated and out of your depth, you would just nod along.

I wonder how many other girls that has happened to.

I haven’t read the article but being “liberal” surely means “progressive”. Embracing the idea that young women can become young men isn’t progress is it?

It transpired that the statement had been made following observational input from a nurse. It was confirmed the she never did identify as male at any point.

Oh my, that's jaw-dropping.

As a parent of an autistic boy I have been absolutely obsessive about pointing out how silly gender stereotypes are, that men can have long hair and like art and women can have short hair and like football. That sex is about your body not your personality or hair do.

I have no idea if it will be enough (not a teen).

These kind of articles terrify me to be honest.

😮😮😮

My god. I have no words.

One of the reasons this article resonates with me so much is that the mum's emotional journey parallels my own liberal and progressive leanings. I'm sure it will hit exactly the same mark with many other parents.

I'm still liberal and progressive. I'm just more aware than ever that progress shouldn't be at the expense of others' boundaries being eroded without scrutiny or decision points along the way. For example, men having pubs to themselves in the UK or being the only actors allowed on the stage back in Shakespeare's time etc. The suffragettes arguing that women as well as men should vote. Black segregation in apartheid South Africa and also the US. Was it right that these boundaries were challenged, at the expense of all those who had the privilege on the other side of it? Yes, absolutely. But at each point, abhorrent as each of those original boundaries sound now, it's right that there was push back and challenge from those who wanted to keep the boundaries exactly as they were. I would oppose all of those views in the examples I've given above and I'm pretty sure everyone on this board would. But I accept the debate, which means I accept listening to views I disagree with. That's the bit that's missing now, we hop over the debate. The progressive liberal leaning world doesn't seem to have any checkpoints. Nothing is too progressive if someone's "lived experience" is all the evidence that is needed that a boundary needs to be changed. None of us can challenge someone else's lived experience. We need liberal progressives to step forward with liberal checkpoints to supplement lived experience when advocating for boundary changes.

The route that this mum took differs from my own slightly but it also has many parallels. Each of us needed to establish strong safeguarding boundaries around (not enforced onto as instruction) our child to keep our children safe. In my case this involved calling out - and then blocking - where someone else had unconciously made a decision on behalf of my child in the belief that they were helping her. It wasn't their decision to make. It's not mine either. It's hers. My job in this is to safeguard her, support her, raise her with guidance and share facts about the world so that she can form her own beliefs and make her own decisions from a position of being informed. This feels like a liberal checkpoint for child safety on gender identity.