WPATH - Damage limitation strategy.

[FOJN]

Dr Marci Bowers, WPATH President, (and Dr featured in "I am Jazz") has written to colleagues in WPATH to outline how they defend SOC8, given that it contains recommendations for best practice which are supported by very weak evidence.

This is a PSA as much as anything because Marci Bowers tell colleagues to force team trans issues with any other minority group, straight out of the Denton's playbook.

Thread abou it:

https://twitter.com/genspect/status/1649581294110605313

Marci Bowers letter:

https://listloop.com/wpath/mail.cgi/archive/adhoc/20230421130649/

Wicked, that's so given me the heebie jeebies! I'm never going to the toiletries section of the chemist ever again, lol.

That picture with the Teddy given what's been done - entirely experimental and televised FFS - is so disturbing. Why are social services (US equivalent) not involved? I do have some sympathy for the Dad - he seems shocked that it's all so experimental so I'm guessing the truth was massaged for him to consent to this.

It is absolutely wild living thru this moment (or is that permanent change?) in society.

I recall times when crazes took off, or controversial medical diagnoses became the norm.

But nothing like this. It's as if we've returned to medieval practices like chastity belts, FGM, lobotomies, electro shock treatments, gay conversion chemical castration, but somehow weaponised via social media, and reinforced as religious rites by the so-called intelligentsia and elites in society.

It's totally wild, and what's also wild is that we haven't reached the murky seabed yet.

I feel just the same.

About 20 years ago me and OH used to read the discussions on a peak oil forum, where there was a lot of speculation about what the future might hold and we talked about it a lot at time. One thing that came out of those conversations was that we reckoned that around 15-20 years in the future - now - large numbers of humans would start to lose the plot. We came up with a few outlandish scenarios, but none of them were anywhere near as batshit as what's happening today. I've been around a while but this is truly the strangest time I've lived through.

The first concerns about anorgasmia go back a lot further than that. https://4thwavenow.com/2018/07/08/does-prepubertal-medical-transition-impact-adult-sexual-function/ Article dates from 2018 and the earliest query about this mentioned there is 2016. Scroll down a bit for the screenshot from Arlene Istar Lev. It's been known for years and years that there is no research on this area and nobody knows what the effect will be on these poor kids.

Herd mentality has always existed (how many doctors back in the day disagreed with electro shock therapy etc?), and purity spirals were a thing (doctors at conferences would have doubled down on industry wide beliefs and "best" practices).

But in the age of the internet, the decades long journey to acclaiming the self and burnishing patients self esteem, the social justice element of being a trans ally, and the societal move to lived experience trumping empirical data, we now have fertile soil for this movement to take root and flower.

And my core belief that humans are prone to group dynamics mixed with seeming altruistic impulses, which generations past motored religion, the Enlightenment etc, and has now evolved to what we see today.

'I'm in good spirits and my captors are treating me well.'

So given this is the case, are parents and children put on this pathway informed about this?

If so, why on earth does any parent consent (and you know, why aren't social services at least part of the conversation) and if not, that's medical malpractice right there.

I mean anyone who wants this outcome for their child is a little suspect at best.

Bowers is at least talking frankly about this. 100% of kids blocked at Tanner stage 2. Jesus. Alongside the issues with puberty blocking for height for girls and penile growth for boys who want to transition as well as the lack of research which apparently STILL isn't being done it beggars belief that puberty blocking is still legal for transition.

I just don't get it - even if you 100% supported the attempt to transition from one sex to another, surely this would give you pause that this was the best route for kids. Especially given most of the middle aged male transitioners keep their genitals and that's apparently also fine.

I don't think I can stomach reading that, poor boy, but surely given there have been at least one death as a direct result of this experimental surgery with a huge question mark over whether there are overall benefits, there should be brakes being applied?

The critical thing to remember is that none of those were medieval practices, they were (except chastity belts, which were a made-up thing catering to a 19th century paraphilia) modern-era 'gosh look at us we're so scientific' medicine. As was eugenics, which the splendid Barry (I wasn't exagerrating that crush) mentioned a couple of times in his entirely justified rant, as being comparable to what we're living through now.

Eugenics wasn't based in the real world, the scientific justification for it was made up, books were written to justify it and it was swallowed whole (and went on influencing public policy until a few years ago - may still be doing so). It was boom business in the 1930s when the concept of 'sex change' was being invented.

Thinking critically is much harder work that swallowing feelgood nonsense. Once, some people were prepared to swallow nonsense that was packaged as religion (it usually had little or nothing to do with the actual teachings of their religion). Now people are swallowing nonsense packaged as science (which has little or nothing to do with actual science).

The use of “TGD” throughout Bowers’ letter- does the “D” stand for disorder or disease as it usually does in medicine? Is this a new term being floated to indicate a new phase of activism?

It is surprising that this was written.

However, I am very glad it was. Everyone needs to see this. Because I know very few people who respond well to knowing they have been so manipulated.

https://people.com/tv/jazz-jennings-talks-sexual-stuff-orgasm-libido-doctor-before-gender-confirmation-surgery/

“Jazz does not know what an orgasm is and it’s very important when expressing intimacy,” said Dr. Bowers. “And although it is not something that’s going to delay surgery, it’s not going to be any easier for her to have an orgasm after surgery.”'

Video of that.

'it's a very difficult process to go through. It's permanent, it's going to leave you sterile'

Why the fuck is any child being put on this pathway?

'Killarney, Ireland and EPATH will again surely exceed expectations as we meet April 26-28, 2023.'

If anyone's in Ireland, do please go and ask EPATH/WPATH members questions about Eunuch gender identity.

Thank you for sharing that article in the bottom link.

It reminds me somewhat of the whole 'men in women's prisons/toilets' thing.

Problem: Men feel unsafe in men's spaces/get hurt in men's spaces

Solution from the T Lobby: They therefore must go in the women's spaces and any impact on the women is irrelevant because the serious presenting issue of unsafe men is fixed.

When in fact there are many, many solutions to men's safety and comfort, none of which necessitate impact upon women never mind an impact so serious as the end of women's spaces. The reason for this being, as we all know, the solution came first and was not a solution, it was a fixed desire. The presenting problem it can be a solution for comes of ceaseless flailing around trying to find one or more that's convincing enough, hence the incoherence of argued problem but the fixed solution of they must be in women's spaces and no other possible option ever being accepted.

This seems to work the same way.

Problem: children may commit suicide in distress at their growing bodies

solution: life harming, seriously risky surgery leaving them with no capacity for a sex life, and likely chronic pain and chronic illness.

Surely there are many, many other possible solutions to try for the problem before resorting to that one, it's crazy. Ones less restrictive, less harmful, less dangerous.

It only makes sense when again you think 'this is not a solution to a problem. It is a predetermined fixed goal flailing around looking for a problem to convince the world it's the right answer to'. Which leaves me wondering, again, what is the goal and who the hell came up with it.

Grotesque, horrific, needless harm enacted on a previously healthy child.

When Marci Bowers tries to 'allow the public to hear the anguish and the stories of those in pain as a direct result of anti-trans legislation, difficult as this will be to watch-and to pin this pain upon those legislators and policy makers who have inflicted the agony. In my interview with CBS Evening News to be aired any day, I called it ‘legislative cruelty’. The moment we are in reminds me of San Francisco’s Harvey Milk and his plea to gay persons to come out. We need to be heard—trans persons, allies, parents, families, politicians, clergy-those who have been hurt and those who know us.'

I am only going to think of the photographs in that study.

Bowers and all of that ilk are complicit in this horror.

Ach, sorry for the strike-through, there must have been two dashes in that quote.

Quite. Hear that person's anguish and don't look at the anguished people over there.

Only pre approved, politically useful anguish in the press please.

a penis is just a large clitoris

This gives me the rage. Is Marci so fucking incompetent that Marci believes we PEE out of our clitoris?!?!

The reason for this being, as we all know, the solution came first and was not a solution, it was a fixed desire.

Yes, great post @nilsmousehammer

It's particularly noticeable with the preventing children from going through puberty and surgically altering their bodies. Given that so many adult trans people have gone through puberty and don't feel the need for hormones or surgery to be trans. And for those that do have surgery, the outcome - for men at least and arguably also women- is a hell of a lot better if they've gone through puberty. Plus the extremely dubious ethical question of whether children can possibly consent to anorgasmia since they can't possibly know what this really means, and why on earth any parent would want that for their child (or indeed think that this outcome is likely to result in anything other than worsened - not improved - mental health).

I tend to agree there is a very dubious agenda in terms of why it's a good idea to block puberty and medicalise children given the total lack of sufficient evidence base that the benefits outweigh the serious risks of anorgasmia, sterility and lifelong medical complications.

Nobody should be presenting treatment that is so risky, and has such potentially devastating consequences, as a simple 'choice'.

Nobody should suggest a child should be sterilised to fix 'a feeling'.

If you have dysphoria, you need good, compassionate, evidence-based care, and support.

You do not need to be abandoned to the mercy of doctors who will prescribe off label drugs, or perform experimental surgeries, who consider 'eunuch' to be a sexuality as valid as being homosexual or heterosexual.

Yes, I'm aware that this was known well before then. The reference to 2021 was about Marci Bowers acknowledging this.

Absolutely, Arabella. Isn't astonishing that it needs saying? What a world we live in.